# Asking an African-American woman to give up a bus seat in the handicapped section makes me racist? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 17, 2013, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137 "2013-11-17T19:02:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/181 "2013-11-19T14:59:54Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > And the fact that so many people jumped to the conclusion that it was racist just lets you know how many offenderatti we have on this board. I’m starting to wonder if the reason we rant and rave about them so much is that they are here. > > I don’t know about the woman’s past history, but there is nothing in this thread to justify it being racism. She didn’t tell anyone to go to the back of the bus. She said there were seats in the back, but she simply asked the girls to let her sit down. We were informed about the seats in the back in order to let us know that the girls had a place to sit. > > I’ve just never understood this desire to make up your own version of events. Sure, the OP may not be telling the truth, but that’s true about every single post on this board. Is it not easier to take it as given that what people say is true, for the sake of discussion? Having multiple versions of events just means that people will be talking past each other, essentially having totally different conversations. You don’t have to be a racist to say things that are racially insensitive. Just clueless. > [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > I must be missing something here, that is an observation the OP made, not something she said out loud to the girls. > At no point did the OP say that she asked the two girls to sit at the back. Nothing in that entire first post suggests that. > They themselves are reported as making a statement about the back of the bus, not the OP. > > Come on people, it was only four short lines to read. Are you that eager to cry “racist” or does the OP’s history mean you are all prejudging? Quibbling. > [@DSeid](#): > > That is, almost, what we have now. The last part is actually frowned upon. Fact is that you do not know who is disabled by looking at them and people should not have to be placed in a circumstance of explaining their conditions. MS is not apparent to the naked eye for example and having to tell strangers about it is a bit much for a place to sit. These girls deserved to be politely reminded what seats they were occupying and what rules are supposed to apply to all Blacks and Whites alike regarding handicapped seating. If they then refused to move then no conflict is indicated. The unenforcable but usually complied with social contract was for them to believe the claim of disability no more questions asked and get up and for the op to move on and ask the next person if they did not. > > I’m going more with the op being Tobiasoid than overtly racist. I can just her looking shocked when someone tried to point out how it sounded and saying “What?” The problem was that it was only the girls that were reminded. There were other people sitting in those seats. The OP took it upon herself to pick out only the black girls. It’s a bus. The only seats open are in the back. So you pick out the black girls to move to the back so white lady can sit down. Regardless of the motivation in your own head how can someone in 2013 not understand it might be a problem? Thank god there was a white lady there to give up her seat. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/182 "2013-11-19T15:04:56Z")
Based on Annie’s posting history, there’s a _strong_ case to be made that the racist implications of her behavior was based on social cluelessness rather than racism. It would be nice if she would learn something from the explanations on this thread, but I’m guessing she won’t. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/183 "2013-11-19T15:07:28Z")
> [@Sarahfeena](#): > > No…IIRC, she agreed not to state that adoption causes people to become serial killers, but she did not actually apologize. Course, I didn’t ask for nor expect her to, I just wanted her to stop spreading bad information. So, we’re cool. Oh. I thought I remembered an apology, but you are right. I think she just agreed to knock it off. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/184 "2013-11-19T15:47:02Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > She \*wanted \*it, but that doesn’t mean she \*needed \*it. It is possible that she wanted it _because_ she needed it. Anyhow, seems like positions are entrenched now and facts superfluous so that seems like a good place to leave it. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/185 "2013-11-19T15:57:24Z")
Right. So can we all agree that the OP isn’t racist, just an ass? But that the girls weren’t unreasonable in reading some amount of racism into her behavior? Okay, maybe we won’t agree on the second part, but we should definitely be able to agree on the first part. That just seems cut and dried. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/186 "2013-11-19T16:04:07Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Little help please? I’ve looked over the **Bang Bus** site but have so far been unable to locate this episode. Try cross-referencing “GILF + teens” and “interracial threesomes.” ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/187 "2013-11-19T16:08:44Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Oh. I thought I remembered an apology, but you are right. I think she just agreed to knock it off. I have to ask, were you one of the seated girls, Nzinga? ---
**Author:** ![SmellMyWort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SmellMyWort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmellMyWort)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/188 "2013-11-19T16:14:56Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Little help please? I’ve looked over the **Bang Bus** site but have so far been unable to locate this episode. > [@Crotalus](#): > > Does the site have an elderly category? Check there. Probably shouldn’t expect any handy scenes. ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/189 "2013-11-19T16:25:30Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > I have to ask, were you one of the seated girls, Nzinga? She’s referring to the thread about adopted kids, not this one. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/190 "2013-11-19T16:36:18Z")
> [@zweisamkeit](#): > > She’s referring to the thread about adopted kids, not this one. Whoosh. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/191 "2013-11-19T17:02:16Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Right. So can we all agree that the OP isn’t racist, just an ass? But that the girls weren’t unreasonable in reading some amount of racism into her behavior? Okay, maybe we won’t agree on the second part, but we should definitely be able to agree on the first part. That just seems cut and dried. Agreed. I have no problem thinking that the girls were snotty and shitty in their response too. ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/192 "2013-11-19T22:30:35Z")
> [@CairoCarol](#): > > No, you are looking at **paragraph** 2. > > **Sentence** 2 says: “The bus was crowded, but there were some seats in the back.” But…but,…it’s a one SENTENCE paragraph! 😃 Anyway, she never actually tells the girls that (at least not that she’s said here), she’s merely telling us what she observed regarding the bus being crowded and that she saw open seats in or toward the back. Gah, I’m actually against what she did, but it’s kind of a side rant that people are claiming she said/did something other than what she did. It’s really HOW she did what she did, rather than that she truly needed some help, or a sit down in the handicapped area. I personally think it sounds as if she didn’t handle it well (at all, particularly given her odd beliefs regarding others’ umbrellas), but I disagree that she stated that at any point she actually told the girls to sit in the back. They’re the ones that jumped on that bandwagon (again, according to what she stated). That said, her best bet (and imho, for people who truly do have invisible injuries/disabilities this is the most efficient, least risky confrontation-wise), would be to go to the driver first and not even have to stress about it regarding other people. ---
**Author:** ![Asympotically\_fat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e47c2d/32.png) [@Asympotically\_fat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asympotically_fat)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2013, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/193 "2013-11-19T23:24:37Z")
I can’t help but think Ricky Gervais has this one covered: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/9vIp1lF-BcM/hqdefault.jpg "Ricky Gervais: Out Of England "Rosa Parks" (HBO)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vIp1lF-BcM) ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2013, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/194 "2013-11-20T00:10:48Z")
> [@CanvasShoes](#): > > Anyway, she never actually tells the girls that (at least not that she’s said here), she’s merely telling us what she observed regarding the bus being crowded and that she saw open seats in **or toward** the back. [Bolding mine] I _knew_ those seats were going to inch forward. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2013, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/195 "2013-11-20T05:55:41Z")
> [@expectopatronum](#): > > **Annie** , listen up. you have a history of [not](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14653481&postcount=134) [acting](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15147625&postcount=27) [right](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=523508), Jesus Christ! ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2013, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/196 "2013-11-20T06:50:00Z")
> [@Bill\_Door](#): > > People who need handicapped seats don’t usually carry around those little placards you get for hanging on your rear view mirror, the social contract should be that we take their word for it, like the pregnant woman I gave up my seat for. I asked her how far along she was, and she said, “Around 15 minutes, and am I tired.” Missed this gem earlier. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2013, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/197 "2013-11-20T07:57:37Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Jesus Christ! To be fair, the second link seems to be about telemarketers, and I think there are many who can sympathize with wanting to react that way. ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2013, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/198 "2013-11-20T08:32:56Z")
True to her name, **Annie Xmas** is a gift that keeps on giving. Thanks for sharing those other links of crazy Annie antics, **expacto**. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2013, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/199 "2013-11-20T08:33:31Z")
The third link seems to indicate othermaddness. YMMV of course. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2013, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137/200 "2013-11-20T10:32:44Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > YShe didn’t ask them to change seats though did she? Effectively, yes, she did. > [@](#): > > they could have _stood_ if the thought of sitting in a racially sensitive location gave them so much of a fucking problem. Standing _is_ a fairly common occurrence on buses you know. a), I already covered the standing option and b) IME, people only stand if there are no seats or they just have one or two stops to go. So no, you’re being a little silly, she was asking them to change seats, since: they were already sitting, so clearly they _wanted_ to sit. ETA. My question to the OP is why ask the people who are clearly together to move, rather than a single person. Less inconvenience for one to move rather than two. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asking-an-african-american-woman-to-give-up-a-bus-seat-in-the-handicapped-section-makes-me-racist/674137.md?page=11)