# Assisi Loop: Breakthrough or Woo? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 7, 2016, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740 "2016-06-07T14:48:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2016, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/21 "2016-06-08T00:28:42Z")
Magnets? Hah! Radium is the real cure! ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2016, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/22 "2016-06-08T03:10:51Z")
As noted, “FDA-cleared” is an odd and probably meaningless term. Beware of any company marketing products with supposed FDA sanction in the event that no trials of the drug/device have ever been submitted to the agency and don’t have to be by law. I would be impressed in this instance only if the device in question has actually undergone comprehensive testing in a controlled setting. > [@pieceoftheuniverse](#): > > I couldn’t find the Assisi Loop on the FDA website. The only thing I found was approval for Assisi Research Laboratories’ drug Asparaginase used “for the induction of remission of multicentric lymphoma in dogs.” Useful, certainly, but not particularly relevant. I think that whatever patent may have existed on the chemotherapy drug asparaginase expired long ago (its discovery dates back to the early 1950s), so it’s a generic agent not unique to this company. ---
**Author:** ![BwanaBob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bwanabob/32/2985_2.png) [@BwanaBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BwanaBob)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2016, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/23 "2016-06-08T11:56:20Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > The ironic thing with weak electromagnetic fields is that the conspiracy theorists and the alt-med woo peddlers are \*both \*so excited about them. Cellphones and cell towers _cause_ cancer, throw away your cellphones and wrap your head in foil; at the same time, electrotherapy _cures_ cancer, and just about eveything else, provided of course that it is applied _holistically_. > > I imagine that there must be a huge market for holistic cellphones. It would only be ironic if the same people believed in both. Not all believers of a woo subject believe in all things woo. For such an assertion I would regrettably ask for a cite.😉 ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2016, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/24 "2016-06-08T12:57:42Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > … Well, “FDA cleared” is meaningless, no matter how much it looks like “FDA approved,” and could mean the FDA glanced at a submission and declined to issue any opinion. … My guess – it was successfully thrown over the top of an FDA facility, so it “cleared” it. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2016, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/25 "2016-06-09T17:04:40Z")
Thanks to all. Wrote a nicely cite-studded letter to the ragazine, which had blown off my initial comment with the usual “oh, we’re a community service group, charitable org, and our writers are volunteers, so.” By the way, the paper above that shows some effect for “weak” magnetic therapy means comparatively weak up against prior trials with gauss fields in the low thousands. A 23-gauss magnet just under an inch square and continously applied to a wound dressing promoted healing in 15 days, vs. 20 days for the control and sham group. So there might be something to it, although the conclusion is that results are mixed. So a loop that produces 0.04 gauss (claimed) and is used for three 15 minute sessions a day, and produces that field over a one-foot ring instead of a square inch… must be just as effective, hah? Allee-samee thing. Or at least (calculates) 1/46,000th as good. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2016, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/26 "2016-06-09T17:08:44Z")
> [@](#): > > … which had blown off my initial comment with the usual “oh, we’re a community service group, charitable org, and our writers are volunteers, so.” … What initial comment? To who? ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2016, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/27 "2016-06-09T17:13:19Z")
Sorry - if you reread or skim the OP, I sent (web-form based) email complaining about the review just before posting it. I got a rather airy wave-off as described above, but that gave me a direct email to send a more composed reply. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2016, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/28 "2016-06-09T17:15:18Z")
You’re going to be as popular as [a 12-year-old kid who had the temerity to claim that vaccines are safe and effective.](http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2016/06/08/antivaccine-activists-gleefully-attack-and-dox-a-12-year-old-boy-who-made-a-pro-vaccine-video/) ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2016, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/29 "2016-06-09T17:27:55Z")
Used to it. The real rub is that, as I said, I picked up the freebie (which gets mailed to us every month because we donated a couple of big bags of dog food a few years ago) with the intent of engaging with the group - I believe in and support pet rescue and do a lot of community work. I am dismayed that we probably won’t become friends over this. ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2016, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/30 "2016-06-09T20:39:46Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > That _totally_ sounds just like a lightweight necklace and pendant that can operate off of a watch battery. :rolleyes: It’s a combination of electromagnetism and homeopathy. The weaker the force, the _better_ it works! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2016, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/31 "2016-06-09T20:58:03Z")
Has this device been sent to an independent lab for testing? ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2016, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/32 "2016-06-10T01:45:10Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Has this device been sent to an independent lab for testing? No, it’s being sent to vet techs all over the country to write gushing reviews for blogs and pet-rescue magazines. If there is any valid jump from the paper Riemann cited (that small, relatively powerful magnets in continuous contact appear to have some effect) and the vastly weaker, more diffused output from these rings, I can’t find evidence of it on their site. It’s all misdirection and vast smoky jumps of logic. Even the list of papers they cite (from a suspiciously micro journal) don’t really engage the product’s stated characteristics. ---
**Author:** ![SnoopPenguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@SnoopPenguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SnoopPenguin)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2019, 8:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/33 "2019-10-11T08:16:02Z")
First off, apologies for resurrecting this OLD thread, but I came across this page while looking into the Assisi Loop. A vet/physio person recommended it to me for my elderly dog who has knee and back issues, and I’d never heard of it before. First thoughts were that it sounded like total woo, but I saw on their website that there are some new clinical trials that have been done on it showing its efficacy. I am not good at reading anything to do with clinical trials and working out if they’re valid or not, so was just wondering if anyone could help me out with that? [https://www.assisianimalhealth.com/blog/2018/11/tpemf-and-pain-management-clinical-research-update/](https://www.assisianimalhealth.com/blog/2018/11/tpemf-and-pain-management-clinical-research-update/) I’m quite happy to try out things that fall into the “most likely won’t do anything but certainly won’t hurt” bucket, but on the other hand, I don’t want to be lining the pockets of unscrupulous companies who prey on the vulnerable. I just need a little help working out where this company and product fits in with that. Thanks ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2019, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/34 "2019-10-11T11:51:29Z")
> [@SnoopPenguin](#): > > First off, apologies for resurrecting this OLD thread, but I came across this page while looking into the Assisi Loop. A vet/physio person recommended it to me for my elderly dog who has knee and back issues, and I’d never heard of it before. First thoughts were that it sounded like total woo, but I saw on their website that there are some new clinical trials that have been done on it showing its efficacy. > > I am not good at reading anything to do with clinical trials and working out if they’re valid or not, so was just wondering if anyone could help me out with that? > > [https://www.assisianimalhealth.com/blog/2018/11/tpemf-and-pain-management-clinical-research-update/](https://www.assisianimalhealth.com/blog/2018/11/tpemf-and-pain-management-clinical-research-update/) > > I’m quite happy to try out things that fall into the “most likely won’t do anything but certainly won’t hurt” bucket, but on the other hand, I don’t want to be lining the pockets of unscrupulous companies who prey on the vulnerable. I just need a little help working out where this company and product fits in with that. > > Thanks The devil is in the detail and I can’t see the full details of their study without signing up and that I won’t be doing. We’d need to see the protocol and full results of the study to know how solid this is. Just quoting a p - value is never enough and the qualitative nature of wound assessment and the requirement for pain relief raises questions. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2019, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/35 "2019-10-11T14:38:05Z")
I looked at research abstracts cited on the company website. As noted, one study requires registration (pay to view?) to see the entire article, so I can’t fully evaluate it. The second study notes that “There was no difference in primary outcome or in secondary measures of gait” in the dogs tested, which seems the critical measure of whether the therapy works. It would be good to know if the dogs’ post-therapy status was evaluated in blinded fashion by observers, i.e. whether they knew which dogs had gotten therapy and which had placebo (double-blind could mean just that the individual(s) administering therapy were blinded as to what they were giving). Degree of significance of results, the type of device used (same as what this company sells?) and whether studies were funded by device manufacturer(s) would also be nice to know. I see there was a Cochrane review of PEMF for osteoarthritis in humans, which concluded that there was a “probable” positive effect on pain scores, but no significant effect on function/course of disease. I remain skeptical overall, especially for overheated claims and those that [promote beneficial effects for a wide range of diseases](http://sciencebasedmedicine.org/pulsed-electromagnetic-field-snake-oil/). ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2019, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/36 "2019-10-11T15:19:09Z")
Great timing for reviving this thread because just today [Science-Based Medicine released a report](https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/electromagnetic-healing-devices-for-dogs-studies-show-meh/) on the Assisi Loop and similar devices, and the overall outcome is a big fat “_meh_”. Now to be fair, I tried to find other websites with other opinions…but every website dedicated to pet care that touted the effectiveness of this device also touted the effectiveness of pet acupuncture, pet chiropractic, pet homeopathy and (occasionally) pet chi manipulation. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2019, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740/37 "2019-10-13T01:10:57Z")
> [@SnoopPenguin](#): > > First off, apologies for resurrecting this OLD thread, but I came across this page while looking into the Assisi Loop. A vet/physio person recommended it to me … Look for a better Vet. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/assisi-loop-breakthrough-or-woo/756740.md?page=1)