There’s no such things as a “secular,” or “materialist” beliefs. What would taht even mean othjer than a belief which is not religious? Nor are there any such “movements.” There may be movements which are incidentally secular, but atheism is not a cause or a group or a movement unto itself.
Meh. It’s just a semantics game, and always will be. The definition of religion I was taught has absolutely nothing to do with what y’all are talking about. You mostly are just disputing it is an organized religion (espeically one similar to Christianity). You have yet to disprove that, when told you are an atheist, there’s a group of beliefs we can generally assume you have (or don’t have), and that we can, in broad terms, treat you like a group the same way we would a group you consider religious.
BTW, if you don’t want people to define you by what you don’t believe, stop using a word that defines you in that form.
Dio: Yes, secular does mean areligious (or at least anti-Christian). But materialistic means that you accept reality as your senses perceive it (including from experiments) It’s a “what you see is what you get” mentality. It is rare, but there are atheists who are not materialists.
Atheism is not a group of beliefs, or even one belief. Atheism is defined by the lack of a particular belief, and aside from that one particular absence of belief, atheists have no other common denominator as a group. ypu might as well say that people who don’t believe in unicorns are a group or a “religion.”
The FDR is east of 42nd St. 
Such as?
Sigh Do we have to perpetuate this myth? Look, if you want to see the unicorn head down to the corner of 5th and Fnord in your city and look behind the bus stop. There will be a box mark Pandora, don’t open it. Bring it to the head branch and they’ll teach you.
Now if you’ll excuse me I’ll not be hiding from the non-Inquisition.
Karl Rove is an atheist. 'nuff said. I bet he doesn’t hold many if any of the beliefs we supposedly hold.
It’s a repeating bit on Law & Order. The detectives look up the address for someone in some database, or on some form, business card, etc. One of them reads it off. Instead of saying “that’s a fake address”, they all slump and one of them says either “that’s in the middle of the Hudson River” or “that would be in the middle of the East River.” Usually somebody says “damn”.
Could you give us some examples of what these secular/materialist/humanist beliefs are? For example, I believe that gravity exists. I believe flu vaccinations are a good idea. I believe democracy is the best form of government overall. I believe the Buffalo Bills will make the playoffs again someday. I believe Bob Dylan is overrated. I believe my mother makes the best chicken parmigan in the world. Are these beliefs shared by all my fellow secular materialist humanists?
Or is it an exclusive thing? A Christian believes Jesus was the son of God and rose from the dead. A non-Christian doesn’t believe that. What is the atheist equivalent of that belief? And don’t argue that an atheist believes Jesus wasn’t the son of God because then I’ll point out that non-atheist Jews and Muslims and Buddhists and Hindus share that belief.
If atheists want to have the “not a religion” thing taken seriously, you need to convince fellow non-believers to stop sharing the bad news and trying to convert people because that’s what smacks of religion right there. If you’re content that there’s no God, fine, but Athiest Andy’s repeated attempts to convince me that religion is a sucker’s bet is proselytizing just as much as Believer Brian’s spouting off about needing to be saved.
The sick, evil god of the OT not existing is good news, not bad. When people spend time convincing others that there’s no strong evidence for ESP, is that a religion too? Do you also call that trying to convert people? Convert them to what? The religion of not having a belief in that one thing? I guess all the beliefs you don’t have are religions? Trying to convince others that there’s no strong evidence for something so belief in that thing isn’t warranted does not a religion make.
elfkin477, Religion is a sucker’s bet. There are 12 major religions, (more if you count Scientology and Mormonism), so your odds of choosing the right one are at best 1 in 12. An atheist has 50-50 odds. Either there is a god or there isn’t. A good gambler would take even odds over a 1 in 12 chance!
Obviously you’re counting the big four: Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, and Buddhism. Probably Confucianism and Taoism, although they’re tricky because of the overlap.
But what are the other six? Shamanism? There’s a lot of shamanists in the world but it’s not really a single religion. A similar point can be made about Neopaganism.
Judaism probably gets in, even though it’s a relatively small religion. Most people are surprised to find there are more Sikhs than Jews in the world. Let’s count both.
Juche? It’s kind of a cult but it’s a big one.
Baha’i? Jainism? Shinto? Cao Dai? Cheondoism? Zoroastrianism? Tenrikyo? Yarsan? Shinshukyo? Rastafarianism? Yazidi? Vudon?
Cool. So there’s a 50-50 probability that unicorns exist too, right? And then a 50-50 probability that fairies exist. And a 50-50 probability that Bigfoot exists. That means odds are at least one of them exists. Hmmm.
Undoubtedly.
I also can’t paint my house clear. But don’t tell anyone!
As soon as you take responsibilty for Fred Phelps and Osama bin Laden, I’ll start giving a fuck if some atheist I have no connection to asks you uncomfortable questions.
Some folks tried to use Brights to describe themselves as atheists, but that went over like a lead balloon. What term do you suggest? Secular humanist? A bit of a mouthful. How about “atheist” for the atheists and “aatheists” for the believers?
It does actually convey something that seems relevant to the thread – atheists are not necessarily alike in any way, except they don’t have a belief in god or gods. Since it’s not an affirmative label (like Christian, Jew, Muslim, Hindu, etc.), it just specifies none of the above.
That’s why it’s not a belief system or a religion, just like clear isn’t a color and bald isn’t a hair color, there’s no such thing as an atheist bible, there can’t be fundamentalist atheists (there’s nothing to have strict adherence to!).
Atheists can believe in the supernatural, aliens, superstition, spirituality, life after death, or none of those things. They just don’t happen to believe there is a god or gods. There is nothing you have to believe in to be an atheist. It’s just a lack of belief in god or gods. A lack of something is not the same as something.
Anyway, that’s my view. I’m sure there are many atheists who disagree.
Guys, guys, let’s calm down. You can have Orthodox Atheists and Reform Athiests and Conservative- no, wait, those are* Jewish* denominations. Never mind. Anyway, y’all should sit down to a peaceful internonfaith breakfast or something.
My close atheist friend says she won’t join unless you include her pet mice in the non-pantheon. She’s petty cool, so I’d suggest your start venerating the Furry White Godesses in short order. Squeak.
No problem. I’ll definitely not worship your friend’s mouse as much as I don’t worship anything else.
Of course, not worshiping is just like worshiping something. I’m an aworshiper and by not worshiping the mouse, I’m really worshiping the non-mouse. Or something.
The mice can join, but they’ll have to eat whatever they want and not get circumcised.