# Atheism **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 4, 2013, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288 "2013-02-04T04:58:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 22
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/421 "2013-02-06T18:56:37Z")
Bill Maher: “[Atheism is not even my hobby](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mA-57ZkL6Q)”. Will religious folk ever understand this? The only time atheists think about atheism is when religious folk bring it up. Most of the time, we just go about our lives in much the same way as everyone else. In fact, when people speak of god, jesus, nephi, whatever, more often than not, my response is the ancient Japanese practice of _mokusatsu_ (kill it with silence). ---
**Author:** ![pchaos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/258eb7/32.png) [@pchaos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pchaos)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/422 "2013-02-06T18:59:29Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > So, would you advise an atheist who is not an empiricist to describe themselves as one to avoid negative connotations? No. Sometimes, we need to fight our battles. Certainly, I realize there are some negative connotations that come with self-labeling myself as a Christian. But I’m ready to fight the battles. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/423 "2013-02-06T19:03:34Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > No. Sometimes, we need to fight our battles. Certainly, I realize there are some negative connotations that come with self-labeling myself as a Christian. But I’m ready to fight the battles. Seems to me you’re ready to _start_ the battles, at least on this message board. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/424 "2013-02-06T19:05:46Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > No. Sometimes, we need to fight our battles. Certainly, I realize there are some negative connotations that come with self-labeling myself as a Christian. But I’m ready to fight the battles. Why don’t you just self-label as an anti-empiricist. Less to explain. There’s no reason to fight an unnecessary battle. Let the remaining Christians fight the battle. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/425 "2013-02-06T19:11:07Z")
> [@For You](#): > > The only negative connotation associated with atheism is placed there by religious asshole clerics who want their believers to believe that believing in what they believe is the only believable belief system and that everything else is just evil satan-thrall. So the only negative to atheism is entirely manufactured. To my view, the opponent of atheism isn’t theism, it’s monism. The notion that there is only one valid belief system that must be forced on everyone is the enemy of all mankind. Pluralism is what we need, nothing more. I don’t regard religion as innately destructive or harmful, or believe that the world would be measurably better off without it. > [@pchaos](#): > > No. Sometimes, we need to fight our battles. Certainly, I realize there are some negative connotations that come with self-labeling myself as a Christian. But I’m ready to fight the battles. So only people who are prepared to “battle” for their beliefs should express them openly and honestly? That makes some sense, but as you note, it’s applicable to any belief that isn’t universal or nearly so. > [@Really Not All That Bright](#): > > I haven’t actually claimed to be religious\*. There have just been some times when I downplayed my lack of faith. > > \*I did once claim to be a Satanists to get rid of some Jehovah’s Witnesses. I see; I didn’t mean to come off as critical of you, I just found the notion that atheists should lie so as to not upset others to be offensive. Choosing your moments, as you describe here, is a different matter. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/426 "2013-02-06T19:45:24Z")
> [@For You](#): > > Bill Maher: “[Atheism is not even my hobby](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mA-57ZkL6Q)”. Will religious folk ever understand this? The only time atheists think about atheism is when religious folk bring it up. This has been a great day for posts that nail it. I am ripping off that Maher quote and he can just suuuuueee me. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/427 "2013-02-06T19:50:49Z")
> [@NitroPress](#): > > This has been a great day for posts that nail it. I am ripping off that Maher quote and he can just suuuuueee me. You are _so_ going to Hel…no, wait. Nevermind. ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/428 "2013-02-06T20:05:05Z")
I’m in north central TX, and I’ve learned to just smile a lot, and to keep my mouth shut for the most part as I’ve gotten older. Not always though. When younger I had my share of confrontations, some got real ugly, and letters to the editor didn’t help matters either. All of that was before I got my business going. Don’t recall ever lying, but do keep a much lower profile. I would lie if I felt like my life or other loved ones were in danger. Fortunately, it’s not that bad. For jury duty, I still answer my religion as non-religious instead of atheist. That way it leaves more room for interpretation. I’m just trying to not get singled out in front of a bunch of religious people with me having to explain my religious views or the lack of them in front of everybody. Although not lately, I’ve been up for jury duty quite a few times, but never selected. I doubt I would want to make a big deal of out swearing to tell the truth “so help me God” either. That would cause me much unwanted attention that could possible wipe out my business. It was just a few months ago I was accosted by three religious men standing outside the Subway. Turned out I got there a bit early, so the door was locked, and they had permission to use it as their bible study group before it opened. They zeroed in on me, with the biggest one not smiling and starting out by asking me if I wanted to be a goat or sheep. I pretended to not know what he meant, so he kept getting more aggressive with the questions, asking me if I go to church. I told him I hadn’t been in a long time. This guy was particularly intimidating because he was so direct with the questions, and not smiling the whole time and almost in my face staring at me, while I kept looking down for the most part. At least one of his buddies thought it was amusing; he seemed to enjoy watching how uncomfortable I was getting. When he realized I wasn’t all that agreeable to what he was saying, he got around to telling me a man isn’t a man unless he’s been down on his knees crying, and praying to Jesus for forgiveness. Still not getting the responses he wanted out of me he just asked me point blank and a little bit louder: “You do believe in God, don’t you?” That’s when I said, “Look, I just came here for a sandwich, and I know where to go for a sermon if I want one.” I didn’t look back, just got in my pickup and left. Not one of my better moments, and looking back, I was mad at myself and wish I would have handled it differently. Just never had total strangers confront me like that before, so it caught me completely off guard, and I wasn’t sure how it might end. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/429 "2013-02-06T20:08:44Z")
Not one of your better moments? I don’t think I would have been half as polite as you were if I was accosted like that. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/430 "2013-02-06T20:14:13Z")
> [@For You](#): > > The only time atheists think about atheism is when religious folk bring it up. Your sentence is exactly correct, because… a useful distinction I make is big-A vs. little-a atheism. The Big-A’s are the formally organized, card-carrying, loudmouthed and obnoxious ones impossible to tell from their religious brethren except by parsing the dogma. Most of what’s been discussed here is small-a atheism, which fits the above and most of the statements about not having a comprehensive doctrine or belief set behind it. ETA: That’s the one religionists can’t seem to cope with; they are used to, or familiar only with, the Big-A’s who want to stand and scream things out, doctrinal point by dogmatic assertion. They can’t understand that we neither have a dogma to argue nor wish to argue anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/431 "2013-02-06T20:16:59Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > Not one of your better moments? I don’t think I would have been half as polite as you were if I was accosted like that. Agreed. That’s a shitty way to start your day, seems like you handled it well enough. ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/432 "2013-02-06T20:19:15Z")
> [@koufax](#): > > And my definition of “god” is the PRIMARY CAUSE of all matter. And is that the full extent of your definition? I ask because that definition is pretty much outside the mainstream – except when theists are doing a bait-and-switch. (Not to say that’s what you’re doing). ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/433 "2013-02-06T20:19:16Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > Not one of your better moments? I don’t think I would have been half as polite as you were if I was accosted like that. I just felt like I should have been more aggressive in replying to them from the get-go, but wasn’t sure really what these guys were up to and what might happen. They all had bibles in their hands, but never seen religious people that were total strangers be that aggressive towards me before and single me out. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/434 "2013-02-06T20:21:21Z")
> [@NitroPress](#): > > Your sentence is exactly correct, because… a useful distinction I make is big-A vs. little-a atheism. > > The Big-A’s are the formally organized, card-carrying, loudmouthed and obnoxious ones impossible to tell from their religious brethren except by parsing the dogma. > > Most of what’s been discussed here is small-a atheism, which fits the above and most of the statements about not having a comprehensive doctrine or belief set behind it. ETA: That’s the one religionists can’t seem to cope with; they are used to, or familiar only with, the Big-A’s who want to stand and scream things out, doctrinal point by dogmatic assertion. They can’t understand that we neither have a dogma to argue nor wish to argue anyway. The big "A"s are the ones on the frontlines fighting against the hardline religionists for the little "a"s. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/435 "2013-02-06T20:28:20Z")
> [@razncain](#): > > Although not lately, I’ve been up for jury duty quite a few times, but never selected. I doubt I would want to make a big deal of out swearing to tell the truth “so help me God” either. I’ve served on three criminal juries here in Texas, and I’ve never been asked to swear “so help me God,” nor has the oath/affirmation had any religious language at all. > [@](#): > > It was just a few months ago I was accosted by three religious men standing outside the Subway. Which, in Texas, means that place that sells sandwiches, not anything to do with public transportation. When I first read this sentence, I thought “really? A subway” In Texas?!?" ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/436 "2013-02-06T20:28:48Z")
Simply for the record, I have never once lied about my religious views. I have, however, routinely (in certain circumstances) replied with “I’m Jewish” or “I’m a Jew.” That seems to settle things 99.9% of the time. And the few idiots who then ask “What’re your views on God, then?” get the response “That’s personal and I’d rather not discuss it.” ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/437 "2013-02-06T20:37:41Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > The big "A"s are the ones on the frontlines fighting against the hardline religionists for the little "a"s. So they say. I think I’d rather fight my own battles than have some of these zealots screech on my behalf. ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/438 "2013-02-06T20:42:02Z")
> [@NitroPress](#): > > So they say. I think I’d rather fight my own battles than have some of these zealots screech on my behalf. Actually, it doesn’t sounds like you would: > [@NitroPress](#): > > They can’t understand that we neither have a dogma to argue nor wish to argue anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/439 "2013-02-06T20:47:35Z")
> [@CurtC](#): > > I’ve served on three criminal juries here in Texas, and I’ve never been asked to swear “so help me God,” nor has the oath/affirmation had any religious language at all. I hope it’s like that in all of TX now. It would be one less anxious moment for me to have to deal with. My county still has a small questionnaire that you have to fill out, and every time it has asked me my religious affiliation. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/440 "2013-02-06T21:09:28Z")
> [@NitroPress](#): > > So they say. I think I’d rather fight my own battles than have some of these zealots screech on my behalf. You’d be crushed if you tried. It’s the atheists “zealots” who dare commit such terrible crimes as suing for their legal rights who are the reason you can so much as talk on a board like this without having some government agency shut it down. It’s amazing how little it takes to be a “zealot” if you’re an atheist. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288.md?page=21) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288.md?page=23)