# Atheism **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 4, 2013, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288 "2013-02-04T04:58:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 23
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/441 "2013-02-06T21:10:52Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > Actually, it doesn’t sounds like you would: There’s no conflict between those two statements, although you seem to think there is. I don’t regard religion-v-atheism in general as “my battle.” When an R-type gets in my face or obstructs me on religious grounds, it is. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/442 "2013-02-06T21:17:01Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > You’d be crushed if you tried. You might be surprised. But that’s another subject. > [@](#): > > It’s the atheists “zealots” who dare commit such terrible crimes as suing for their legal rights who are the reason you can so much as talk on a board like this without having some government agency shut it down. > > It’s amazing how little it takes to be a “zealot” if you’re an atheist. What? This makes next to no sense at all. (Foggy shot) There are many organizations defending free speech and religious freedom. American Atheists et al. seem a lot more concerned with very narrow interpretations of rights infringement than they do with any wider scope. So forgive me if I don’t credit AA with keeping this board free. Or something. ETA: As for my original comment, I find the rigid dogmatism of some Big-A’s to be embarrassing and counterproductive. We’d all be better off if these types would just STFU and let the American body of atheists be represented as a more normal and rational group. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/443 "2013-02-06T21:20:03Z")
> [@NitroPress](#): > > You might be surprised. But that’s another subject. > What? This makes next to no sense at all. > > (Foggy shot) There are many organizations defending free speech and religious freedom. American Atheists et al. seem a lot more concerned with very narrow interpretations of rights infringement than they do with any wider scope. So forgive me if I don’t credit AA with keeping this board free. Or something. I’m sorry-I don’t recall you mentioning AA in particular in the previous posts. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/444 "2013-02-06T21:26:16Z")
I wasn’t speaking of American Atheists; I don’t know anything about them besides the name. I’m speaking of all the atheists who have stood up in recent decades and been labeled zealots and similar terms for daring to support the separation of church and state, daring to claim that atheism is a valid position, refusing to stay silent like they are “supposed to”. People talk about atheists who speak up and who refuse to submit to abuse the same way they talk about other groups that kill people. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/445 "2013-02-06T21:41:39Z")
American Atheists handle narrow little issues, like manditory prayer in schools. In that 1959 court case, Madalyn Murray O’Hair “shrieked” > [@](#): > > “Your petitioners are atheists and they define their beliefs as follows. An atheist loves his fellow man instead of god. An atheist believes that heaven is something for which we should work now – here on earth for all men together to enjoy. An atheist believes that he can get no help through prayer but that he must find in himself the inner conviction and strength to meet life, to grapple with it, to subdue it, and enjoy it. An atheist believes that only in a knowledge of himself and a knowledge of his fellow man can he find the understanding that will help to a life of fulfillment. He seeks to know himself and his fellow man rather than to know a god. An atheist believes that a hospital should be built instead of a church. An atheist believes that a deed must be done instead of a prayer said. An atheist strives for involvement in life and not escape into death. He wants disease conquered, poverty vanquished, war eliminated. He wants man to understand and love man. He wants an ethical way of life. He believes that we cannot rely on a god or channel action into prayer nor hope for an end of troubles in a hereafter. He believes that we are our brother’s keepers and are keepers of our own lives; that we are responsible persons and the job is here and the time is now.” ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/446 "2013-02-06T22:16:21Z")
> [@razncain](#): > > I hope it’s like that in all of TX now. It would be one less anxious moment for me to have to deal with. My county still has a small questionnaire that you have to fill out, and every time it has asked me my religious affiliation. Yeah, the last time I served was here in Dallas, and on the questionnaire that you bring in there’s the religious affiliation question, and I just put “none.” ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/447 "2013-02-06T22:48:26Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I’m sorry-I don’t recall you mentioning AA in particular in the previous posts. I feel like I’ve been turned on by my own pack of sharks, here. I didn’t suddenly turn anti-atheist or something. I just wince when a self-identified Atheist flashes his badge and pontificates on behalf of all nonbelievers, spewing just as much hate and discord as any brainless thumper, and I disavow my connections to such types no matter how much we might be marching in the same direction. If any of my fellow atheists don’t think there are some embarrassing shriekers among the card-carrying ranks of our disbelief, never mind, moving on. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/448 "2013-02-06T22:51:09Z")
> [@CurtC](#): > > Yeah, the last time I served was here in Dallas, and on the questionnaire that you bring in there’s the religious affiliation question, and I just put “none.” I wonder what would happen if you just failed to fill in that line at all? I could imagine if a lawyer were to ask me in _voir dire_, “_What’s your religion?_” “Five and a quarter inches dorsal.” “_What?_” “Five and a quarter inches dorsal, erect.” “_What kind of answer is that?_” “An answer to what I consider a very personal question.” Which, of course, might get me sent home for the day, or maybe held in contempt or something. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/449 "2013-02-06T23:16:05Z")
> [@NitroPress](#): > > If any of my fellow atheists don’t think there are some embarrassing shriekers among the card-carrying ranks of our disbelief, never mind, moving on. No, you’re right. I can’t speak to AA, but there are atheists that interpret their irreligiosity as proof that they are more intelligent, moral, and worthy than any theist. It’s obnoxious behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/450 "2013-02-07T00:50:38Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > No, you’re right. I can’t speak to AA, but there are atheists that interpret their irreligiosity as proof that they are more intelligent, moral, and worthy than any theist. It’s obnoxious behavior. I believe they are a species of reddit… The reddit atheist…😃 ---
**Author:** ![koufax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/7ea924/32.png) [@koufax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/koufax)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/451 "2013-02-07T00:58:12Z")
Do atheists believe in the higgs boson? [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/D6XAkVA7RmY/maxresdefault.jpg "Michio Kaku: Space Bubble Baths and the Free Universe | Big Think") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6XAkVA7RmY) I love this guy. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/452 "2013-02-07T01:03:06Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > Less to explain. I don’t think you’re quite qualified to give this piece of advice. ---
**Author:** ![pchaos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/258eb7/32.png) [@pchaos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pchaos)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/453 "2013-02-07T01:17:26Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I don’t think you’re quite qualified to give this piece of advice. You’re right, IMO only. ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/454 "2013-02-07T01:50:19Z")
> [@koufax](#): > > Do atheists believe in the higgs boson? > > [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6XAkVA7RmY&feature=em-uploademail](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6XAkVA7RmY&feature=em-uploademail) > > I love this guy. … Atheists only agree on not believing in God. I’ve met atheists who reject science and believe in vampires. Turn your question around, what would your answer be to the question: “Do theists believe in the Higgs boson?” ---
**Author:** ![Wallaby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/dc4da7/32.png) [@Wallaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wallaby)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/455 "2013-02-07T03:20:08Z")
I hate being an atheist. it’s a label I don’t want or need. I don’t know how to be an atheist - I haven’t made a conscious decision to be an atheist. the label has been applied to me by others. The stamp-collectors don’t call me an ‘Anti-Philatelist’, the Ford drivers don’t call me an ‘Anti-Henry-ist’. Let those who have made a definite decision to live their life in a particular way - by collecting stamps or driving Fords - provide justification for their decisions. Me, I don’t really care one way or the other - provided you don’t attempt to let your beliefs impinge upon my freedoms - either by making me only drive a Ford, or by suspending my e-mail and thus creating more postal activities and thus more stamp usage in our society. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/456 "2013-02-07T03:48:16Z")
> [@Wallaby](#): > > I hate being an atheist. it’s a label I don’t want or need. > > I don’t know how to be an atheist - I haven’t made a conscious decision to be an atheist. the label has been applied to me by others. > > The stamp-collectors don’t call me an ‘Anti-Philatelist’, the Ford drivers don’t call me an ‘Anti-Henry-ist’. For one, an “atheist” isn’t an anti-anything, so your analogy fails. “Atheist” is just a term that means “not a theist”, the label “not a stamp collector” fits you just fine. Labels you never asked for follow you all the time, for one – you’re a mammal, a human, a(n) \, etc. “Atheist” is just a descriptive label. There’s nothing to know about “how to be an atheist” any more than there is in how to be a mammal (or even “how to be a theist” given how many religions there are). It just “is”. That it’s used by activists is a side effect of religious culture, and does not reflect on you. No decent person is trying to corral you into a neat little box with it. You’re either an atheist or a theist – sorry, it’s not a political stance, it’s basic logic. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/457 "2013-02-07T03:59:52Z")
> [@koufax](#): > > Do atheists believe in the higgs boson? Yes. https://www.youtube.com/embed/akgPsuIX4lU?feature=oembed&wmode=opaque FWIW, Michio Kaku appeared at a recent theist vs atheist debate giving an agnostic stance. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/458 "2013-02-07T04:10:46Z")
> [@Wallaby](#): > > The stamp-collectors don’t call me an ‘Anti-Philatelist’, the Ford drivers don’t call me an ‘Anti-Henry-ist’. **Jragon** covered most of what I was going to write here, but you should know (if you aren’t already) that an [antitheist](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antitheist) is different from an [atheist.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheist) An antitheist is opposed to belief in the existence of gods. An atheist merely lacks belief in the existence of gods. If you view religion as dangerous or believe that it’s wrong to practice it, you may be an antitheist. If you merely don’t, yourself, believe, without regard to the beliefs of others, you’re just an atheist. It is possible to be both. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/459 "2013-02-08T17:57:30Z")
> [@koufax](#): > > Do atheists believe in the higgs boson? > > [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6XAkVA7RmY&feature=em-uploademail](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6XAkVA7RmY&feature=em-uploademail) > > I love this guy. What does that video have to do with atheism? I don’t get it. He does talk about how it seems that the universe could have zero matter + energy, and therefore could possibly come from nothing, since everything cancels out to zero. So does that answer your objection in the very first post you made in this thread? Thing is, I’m an atheist, and I have no idea if what he’s saying is correct or not. It seems plausible. But I’d be an atheist even if it didn’t seem plausible. I don’t have to know the origin of the universe to not believe in God. I consider the origin of the universe to be an impenetrable mystery, and I still don’t believe in God. Maybe there was an uncaused first cause, but even if there was, I don’t think that uncaused first cause would deserve the name “God”, and calling it “God” doesn’t add anything to the theory, or help us understand anything about this hypothetical uncaused first cause. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288/460 "2013-02-08T18:19:13Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > What does that video have to do with atheism? I don’t get it. What you’re not getting is that \*\*koufax \*\*is obsessed with the atheist concept of creation. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288.md?page=22) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheism/649288.md?page=24)