# Atheists - What drives you? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 29, 2013, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030 "2013-04-29T18:09:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![AnthonyElite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b487fb/32.png) [@AnthonyElite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnthonyElite)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/221 "2013-05-01T19:38:33Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Are you two done patting each other on the back for putting atheists in their place, or is this going to go on for a few more posts? Czarcasm…please, quit defending yourself against shadows. No one is attacking atheism. It was an innocent question, asked out of curiosity. I, speaking for myself, have not put any atheists in their place, first and foremost because I was never AGAINST them. I have a different viewpoint and was asking about another, not attacking it. I do have problems with fanatical atheists, and fanatical ANYTHING, but I’d assume most people would. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/222 "2013-05-01T19:46:07Z")
> [@AnthonyElite](#): > > Czarcasm…please, quit defending yourself against shadows. No one is attacking atheism. It was an innocent question, asked out of curiosity. I, speaking for myself, have not put any atheists in their place, first and foremost because I was never AGAINST them. I have a different viewpoint and was asking about another, not attacking it. I do have problems with fanatical atheists, and fanatical ANYTHING, but I’d assume most people would. What behaviors do fanatical atheists exhibit? ---
**Author:** ![shiftless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9c0ed/32.png) [@shiftless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shiftless)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/223 "2013-05-01T19:46:19Z")
> [@AnthonyElite](#): > > Czarcasm…please, quit defending yourself against shadows. No one is attacking atheism. It was an innocent question, asked out of curiosity. I, speaking for myself, have not put any atheists in their place, first and foremost because I was never AGAINST them. I have a different viewpoint and was asking about another, not attacking it. I do have problems with fanatical atheists, and fanatical ANYTHING, but I’d assume most people would. You have a problem with fanatical atheists, which you fail to give an example of. At the same time you can’t see how an atheist could be offended by being called ignorant and arrogant. Wow. Maybe some of us just aren’t up to the mental gymnastics that are required to rationalize religion. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/224 "2013-05-01T19:48:34Z")
> [@AnthonyElite](#): > > Czarcasm…please, quit defending yourself against shadows. No one is attacking atheism. It was an innocent question, asked out of curiosity. I, speaking for myself, have not put any atheists in their place, first and foremost because I was never AGAINST them. I have a different viewpoint and was asking about another, not attacking it. I do have problems with fanatical atheists, and fanatical ANYTHING, but I’d assume most people would. When you address atheists in general on this board, but claim that you are only attacking the “fanatical” atheists among us, it would be nice if you could come up with some examples to let us know what you mean by radical. ---
**Author:** ![sWozzAres](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/51bf81/32.png) [@sWozzAres](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sWozzAres)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/225 "2013-05-01T19:59:58Z")
I don’t think he realises that I am atheist, so it’s not about putting them in their place, more like putting us in our place. I was an ignorant atheist, then I became a rational atheist. No mental gymnastics required, just a bit of time and effort - something we can all do. For me, deities are simply objects of worship. You can’t imagine God and you can’t worship something that your can’t conceive of, so you create deities as a representation of, or a part of God in order for you to connect with God. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/226 "2013-05-01T20:06:13Z")
> [@sWozzAres](#): > > I don’t think he realises that I am atheist, so it’s not about putting them in their place, more like putting us in our place. I was an ignorant atheist, then I became a rational atheist. > > No mental gymnastics required, just a bit of time and effort - something we can all do. > > For me, deities are simply objects of worship. You can’t imagine God and you can’t worship something that your can’t conceive of, so you create deities as a representation of, or a part of God in order for you to connect with God. Let’s just say you have a rather…unique definition of “atheist”, and leave it at that. ---
**Author:** ![AnthonyElite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b487fb/32.png) [@AnthonyElite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnthonyElite)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/227 "2013-05-01T20:07:11Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > When you address atheists in general on this board, but claim that you are only attacking the “fanatical” atheists among us, it would be nice if you could come up with some examples to let us know what you mean by radical. I’m not claiming, I’m telling you right now, again, that that is the only type that I would be against. If you don’t believe me, that is fine. I can’t do anything about that. An example of someone fanatical would be someone an atheist in conversation saying that any intelligent person could not be a theist. I know it’s not blowing-up-buildings radical, but it is unnecessary and hurts their position by demonizing the opposing view point. I don’t think there is anything wrong with 99% of atheists I meet, or their view points. I think the choice they make is logical and understandable. Not my choice, but I respect it. I’d assume and appreciate mutual respect from atheists. If that is not possible - well it is hurtful to know that a group I respect does not reciprocate respect, but I can’t do anything about hurt feelings. On a note, that is part of why I typically dislike Christianity; it is not enough to be a worthwhile person, you must be indoctrinated or you are doomed for eternity. If that is God, then damn me, I don’t want to be around that God. ---
**Author:** ![sWozzAres](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/51bf81/32.png) [@sWozzAres](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sWozzAres)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/228 "2013-05-01T20:07:26Z")
perhaps a fanatical atheist is one who has no tolerance for what others believe, making them obnoxious, arrogant and constantly trying to force their (lack of) beliefs onto others, which also demonstrates a lack of respect. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/229 "2013-05-01T20:10:24Z")
> [@fatova\_mingus](#): > > . . . Anyone who can PROVE something without hard facts is full of shit. . . . > [@Cyros](#): > > . . . The most I’ve ever heard an atheist claim is that a specific iteration of god does not exist. . . . I consider it proven that the “omniscient and omnipotent” variety of God cannot exist, as these properties are logically self-contradictory. I consider it proven that any God said to possess any attributes which are “infinite” cannot exist, for the simple reason that infinity cannot exist. It is as meaningless to speak of an infinitely powerful God as of an “infinitely rich person.” You can have billions. You could even have trillions. But an “infinite” amount of wealth? Meaningless. As for a lesser god, perhaps an alien with great power based on natural principles we don’t know of, well, shrug. Maybe. I’m comfortably agnostic there. There is no evidence for such an entity, but it can’t be ruled out logically. But tell me about believing in a four-sided triangle, and my disbelief leaps to the quality of full-blown positive atheism. There’s no such animal. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/230 "2013-05-01T20:14:57Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > What behaviors do fanatical atheists exhibit? Not believing in the particular god of the person calling them fanatical. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/231 "2013-05-01T20:16:01Z")
> [@sWozzAres](#): > > perhaps a fanatical atheist is one who has no tolerance for what others believe, making them obnoxious, arrogant and constantly trying to force their (lack of) beliefs onto others, which also demonstrates a lack of respect. I’m not trying to make believers turn to unbelief. I do, however, have a profound lack of respect for those beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/232 "2013-05-01T20:18:20Z")
> [@fatova\_mingus](#): > > Yeah I used a broad stroke on that. But pushed into a corner an atheist will assert that believers are delusional which to me implies they have a case to back it up. Thank for bringing this up. No. This simply is not true. Being an atheist I would know. I have no opinion on believers, I’m just not one of them. If they have delusions they are not alone. I have them too sometimes. As long as the leave me alone and keep it out of my daughter’s public school I’m absolutely fine with them believing in whatever they’re drawn to believe. I feel the same about those who believe in ghosts, aliens and the like. I even volunteer at a local church charity because I agree with their mission. What you’re thinking of is a positive atheist, or a hardline atheist. We aren’t all like that. ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/233 "2013-05-01T20:22:19Z")
> [@sWozzAres](#): > > Well said 🙂 > > This thread has helped me realise that there are at least two types of atheist, rational atheist and ignorant atheist, the latter defined as those that have a narrow, naive and uneducated view of religion leaving them with no other option but to be atheist. No. There is only one type of atheist. A person who does not believe in the existence of gods. Anything else is a personal decision. We’re as varied as any group of humans but we all share that one singular lack of a belief. ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/234 "2013-05-01T20:24:23Z")
> [@sWozzAres](#): > > I don’t think he realises that I am atheist, so it’s not about putting them in their place, more like putting us in our place. I was an ignorant atheist, then I became a rational atheist. > > No mental gymnastics required, just a bit of time and effort - something we can all do. > > For me, deities are simply objects of worship. You can’t imagine God and you can’t worship something that your can’t conceive of, so you create deities as a representation of, or a part of God in order for you to connect with God. Whether you’re an atheist or not doesn’t really matter. You’re still ascribing characteristics and generalizing about the entire group. ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/235 "2013-05-01T20:26:38Z")
> [@sWozzAres](#): > > perhaps a fanatical atheist is one who has no tolerance for what others believe, making them obnoxious, arrogant and constantly trying to force their (lack of) beliefs onto others, which also demonstrates a lack of respect. There are obnoxious people of all stripes. A fanatical Muslim blows up buildings in the name of their god. A fanatical Christian lets a child die while they pray for help. A fanatical atheist…is arrogant? Come on. ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/236 "2013-05-01T20:32:06Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I’m not trying to make believers turn to unbelief. I do, however, have a profound lack of respect for those beliefs. If that makes us fanatics, so be it. 🙂 For me it depends on the belief though. I’m cool with those fuzzy-love-is-God types who are just looking for some sort of spiritual connection. I just have a problem with the hell-threats and the terrorists and the reproductive clinic fanatics. So I guess I’m a fanatic against fanatics. ---
**Author:** ![Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/half_man_half_wit/32/21766_2.png) [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Half_Man_Half_Wit)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/237 "2013-05-01T20:34:24Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > What behaviors do fanatical atheists exhibit? Apparently, correcting other peoples’ scientific misconceptions. The sheer audacity! ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/238 "2013-05-01T20:34:55Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > What behaviors do fanatical atheists exhibit? Well, purely IMHO of course but if you’re looking for an example… > [@MrDibble](#): > > Nope, I’m very much with **DT** on this one - agnostics are theism’s _idiots utiles_. I’m comfortable with identifying as both agnostic and at 6.9 on the 7 point spectrum of theistic probability popularized by Dawkins. (The same identification Dawkins himself prefers, and same spectrum score). ([cite](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/9102740/Richard-Dawkins-I-cant-be-sure-God-does-not-exist.html)) Getting called theism’s useful idiot for this position is fairly insulting and might lead one to characterize the speaker as somewhat fanatical. Basically, when you’re far enough along the spectrum that you’re calling Dawkins religion’s bitch the scale may need to be extended to 8. ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/239 "2013-05-01T20:37:55Z")
> [@Rushgeekgirl](#): > > There are obnoxious people of all stripes. A fanatical Muslim blows up buildings in the name of their god. A fanatical Christian lets a child die while they pray for help. A fanatical atheist…is arrogant? Come on. Well, if you’re going to put it that way… yes, they’re probably a lot less harmful. 🙂 (Although for a more consistent comparison the fanatical atheist would be blowing up a place of worship I’d expect. But the question is I guess: how often does that happen?) ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2013, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030/240 "2013-05-01T20:42:56Z")
> [@Rushgeekgirl](#): > > A fanatical atheist… Shows up at your door and hands you a blank newsletter. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atheists-what-drives-you/657030.md?page=13)