Atlantis question

[What_Exit]

scotandrsn Excellent details.
Mine are recollections of a Natl Geo article and special on either Natl Geo or history channel and a little bit from Wiki and a 20+ year dated HS recollection of a translation of the story of Atlantis.

Jim

[BrainGlutton]

@adam yax

Everyone should realize the true mystery is Mu.

But, has a dog the Buddha-nature?

[BrainGlutton]

@AskNott

This Thoth fella really gets around. The illustration in one of your links shows him to have the head of a bird with a long, thin bill.

I read in Durant’s Our Oriental Heritage that Thoth, the ibis-headed god, was considered the god of medicine (among other things) because Egyptian physicians used the ibis’ long, slender bill as an enema syringe. Which has nothing to do with this discussion, but it’s too good to leave out.

[BrainGlutton]

BTW, for the real Twisted Dope on Atlantis, see here – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of_the_SubGenius:

The Church claims that “true” SubGeniuses are not actually human, but rather are descendants of the Yeti. According to Revelation X: The ‘Bob’ Apocryphon (published in 1994), SubGenii are actually the mutant offspring of a forbidden sexual union that took place millions of years ago between a resident of Atlantis and a human; at that time, humans were little more than a slave race. The resulting offspring was the catalyst that led to the fall of Atlantis. SubGenii often refer to one another as “Yeti” (or yetynsyni), though this origin story is generally not well known outside of the Church itself. The heritage of the Yeti is said to give SubGenius members access to magical powers, an ability to psychically overpower non-yetisyn and way more hair on their ass than your average half-evolved monkeyboy.

[DrDeth]

@scotandrsn

Now a TV special I saw a number of years ago followed some researchers who postied that the Ancient Greek phrase translated here as “greater in extent than Libya and Asia” is very similar to the phrase for “in between” or “in the middle of”, and may have ben botched in transcription. I don’t know any ancient Greek, so I can’t opine on the veracity of this. But it is my understanding that this notion is what led to Santorini being the candidate.
The ruins of the apparantly Minoan civlization on Santorini seem to indicate it could have conformed to this physical description, and earlier this year, I saw an item where geologists had located the volcano that created the earthquake that created the tsunami that took them out. It seemed fairly sound.

Santorini was way smaller than Libya so even “in between” doesn’t work. And where’s the giant walls of pure metal?

About the only thing that makes Santorini fit is that it was kinda roundish and it blew up and mostly sank. Of course- Atlantis didn’t blow up, either. And the Greeks knew about volcanoes, so Santorini wouldn’t be some big mystery.

Nope- Plato made it up.

[Polycarp]

In the spirit of the estimable David Waite, who has elucidated matters religious over in GD with the works of Helena P. Blavatsky and the other Theosophists, I thought it was only fair to provide some background on probably the most bizarre part of Atlantism:

Theosophy alleges that humanity, or something vaguely like it, dates back through most of the Phanerozoic Eon, divided into several root races. Herewith a history of Atlantis, with pseudo-geological “evidence,” from a Theosophy website. (Extra added bonus: a picture of Helena scowling adorns the page.) And herewith the Esoteric Psychology of the psychic rays and their effect on the root races and subraces.

Needless to say, this stuff is so far at odds with anything related to accurate science of any sort (anthropology, geology, etc.) that it isn’t even playing in the same ballpark. But there’s something fascinating about the monumental structure of insanity to it all.

[tomndebb]

Waitaminute? Now we’ve got issues with gay Atlantis?

[Alistair_McCello]

Santorini was way smaller than Libya so even “in between” doesn’t work.

I think scotandrsn meant locationaly in-between Libya, which to the Greeks was all of North Africa, and Asia, which would be Turkey. In that case it does work.

For the record I am of the opinion that Plato made it up, though perhaps it was loosely based on stories of an older civilization.

As for your insistence that all of the facts fit perfectly for it to even have been based on something other than pure imagination, do you really think that Troy and a Pan-Hellenic alliance fought over a woman? And with the direct help of the gods even? Or that the Minoans really had a labyrinth in which they kept a minator? You can’t literalize a myth and then expect to find reality in it. But that doesn’t mean myths aren’t based on something real.

[LonesomePolecat]

@adam yax

I am drawing a blank on some of the details, but there are mesoamerican artifacts that are refered to as Atlantean, based on time, location and styles. Here is a link to a museum store replica of an Atlantean statue. Of course it is only a name and has nothing to do with the mythic, pre-historic uber city state.
Everyone should realize the true mystery is Mu.

Piker. The *real * mystery is R’leyh, where dead Cthulhu lies dreaming …

Hell, it’s at least as historical and scientific as Atlantis.

[Polycarp]

@LonesomePolecat

Piker. The *real * mystery is R’leyh, where dead Cthulhu lies dreaming …

Hell, it’s at least as historical and scientific as Atlantis.

“Does a Lemurian have Buddha nature?”
“Mu”

“Does a Great Old One have Buddha nature?”
“He can if he wants to!”

[scotandrsn]

@Alistair McCello

I think scotandrsn meant locationaly in-between Libya, which to the Greeks was all of North Africa, and Asia, which would be Turkey. In that case it does work.

’
Yes, that is what was meant by the television item I saw. A bit of animation drew a line segment between Libya and Asia (Minor), and Santorini was shown to be quite reasonably near the midpoint of that line.

A map of what was left of the island was also shown, and it was clear that what was left could easily have fit the ringed structure described by Plato at some point in the past.

[Polycarp]

@tomndebb

Waitaminute? Now we’ve got issues with gay Atlantis?

/channeling Pat Robertson
"Why do you think it was sunk?
/channeling off

[Captain_Amazing]

@BrainGlutton

But, has a dog the Buddha-nature?

Does a cow have Buddha nature?

[Ike_Witt]

@Captain Amazing

Does a cow have Buddha nature?

Woof.

[clairobscur]

@scotandrsn

The ruins of the apparantly Minoan civlization on Santorini seem to indicate it could have conformed to this physical description, and earlier this year, I saw an item where geologists had located the volcano that created the earthquake that created the tsunami that took them out. It seemed fairly sound.

I’m quite surprised because until now, when I’ve read references to Atlantis being identified with Minoean civilization, it has always been to Crete, devastated by the Tsunami caused by the Santorini eruption, and not to the tiny island of Santorini itself…

[Fish]

Wait, Atlantis was on the island of Semprini?

[rfgdxm]

@DrDeth

There was no Atlantis. Plato made it up.

Certainly there are ancient “lost” civilizations. Some fit a few of the marks of Atlantis. But if you read what Atlantis really was like (huge walls made entirely out of metal, etc), then you have to know it’s made up.

Is it possible that Plato subconsiously (or consiously) based his entirely made up Atlantis on some old stories? Sure.

But- he made it up.

I find it hard to accept Plato just made it up. Nothing in it for him to do so. Far more probable he heard someone tell of the fantastic Atlantis, and incorporated this in his writing.

[rayh]

@clairobscur

I’m quite surprised because until now, when I’ve read references to Atlantis being identified with Minoean civilization, it has always been to Crete, devastated by the Tsunami caused by the Santorini eruption, and not to the tiny island of Santorini itself…

In Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis, Indy discovers Atlantis under Knossos in Crete. I’m convinced.

[Polycarp]

The Minoan civilization was ca. 1500-1200 BC and covered Crete, parts of mainland Greece, and the southern Greek islands. It was probably centered at Knossos, but hardly limited to Crete. It was destroyed (as a high civilization) by the effects of the Santorini (Thera) eruption.

Insofar as there is a real-life referent acceptable to archaeology for the complexus of myth and legend that have come to be known as the “Atlantis legend,” it’s precisely that.

Insofar as where the term “Atlantis” referencing a sunken land came from, it’s 99.99999% positive that Plato made it up.

He may have drawn on “drowned city” stories connected with folk memory of the Santorini eruption and tsunamis. But he invented the story as we have it.

[DrDeth]

@rfgdxm

I find it hard to accept Plato just made it up. Nothing in it for him to do so. Far more probable he heard someone tell of the fantastic Atlantis, and incorporated this in his writing.

It’s an allegory, like Aesops Fables.