# ATM Etiquette **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 20, 2010, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797 "2010-10-20T16:56:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![kittenblue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ba8739/32.png) [@kittenblue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kittenblue)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2010, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/21 "2010-10-20T23:52:59Z")
That isn’t enough space. I’d feel uncomfortable as a woman if you came inside and waited. We’d have to jostle to get by each other! There are very few of those vestibules where I bank, but people always wait outside. If a man came inside one I’d feel like I was locked in a box with a stranger who is standing between me and the door. Cameras and passcards wouldn’t reassure me, and I’d have to turn around and look at you to make sure you weren’t all hooded up. ---
**Author:** ![SeaDragonTattoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@SeaDragonTattoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SeaDragonTattoo)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/22 "2010-10-21T00:25:19Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > The flaw here is that this is the entryway. If you’re going into the bank, you _have_ to pass by whoever’s using the ATM. It’s not a privacy booth, and the ones I’ve seen have been huge, with something like 15 feet between the ATM and the far wall. > > My vote is for overly skittish. You bet your ass that area is covered by a camera, plus the security door. There’s enough room for personal space, it’s a bad place for a robbery to go down, and you can’t get in if you don’t have a bank card anyway. If the bank is open, there are two unlocked doors that allow unimpeded access in and out. People don’t usually feel claustrophobic or crowded in that situation. When the bank is closed, it is a small cube with one entrance which is locked. Granted that locked door can only be unlocked by someone with a bank card, but if the cube is only 5x5, that’s feeling a bit crowded. Your experience may be a large 15’ long space, but that’s really not what they’re all like. I would feel a little weird waiting in a 5’ space with a stranger using an ATM. As a female, I wouldn’t enter the space if someone were already in there - except maybe if it was pouring outside. If it was a big area, 10-15 feet long, I probably would go in. ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/23 "2010-10-21T00:36:34Z")
> [@kittenblue](#): > > That isn’t enough space. I’d feel uncomfortable as a woman if you came inside and waited. We’d have to jostle to get by each other! There are very few of those vestibules where I bank, but people always wait outside. If a man came inside one I’d feel like I was locked in a box with a stranger who is standing between me and the door. Cameras and passcards wouldn’t reassure me, and I’d have to turn around and look at you to make sure you weren’t all hooded up. Please tell me this is schtick? One of the major pet peeves in my life is (you’ll pardon the ensuing description, it doesn’t do it justice) the personal safety codex that women seem to believe is their right, as a gender, to define and enforce to the world as some monolithic social contract. Protip: I don’t give a shit if you (global you) feel uncomfortable, as a woman, about anything based solely on your gender. And I certainly couldn’t give two flying craps if my gender, apropos of nothing else, happens to give you a bout of safety-induced claustrophobia. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/24 "2010-10-21T00:45:29Z")
As others have said, she was touchy, you were nice. Quite frankly, I’d feel much more uncomfortable if I noticed a strange man standing outside of the vestibule - waiting for me to get money, away from the view of the security cameras. ---
**Author:** ![Otara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a88e4f/32.png) [@Otara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otara)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/25 "2010-10-21T00:59:34Z")
“One of the major pet peeves in my life is (you’ll pardon the ensuing description, it doesn’t do it justice) the personal safety codex that women seem to believe is their right, as a gender, to define and enforce to the world as some monolithic social contract.” Women generally have to worry a bit more about people using excuses to brush against them and the like. Its not about social contracts really, its about dealing with different things. Otara ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/26 "2010-10-21T01:04:11Z")
> [@Otara](#): > > Women generally have to worry a bit more about people using excuses to brush against them and the like. > > Its not about social contracts really, its about dealing with different things. > > Otara how about they worry about it when there’s actually grounds to worry, instead of going out into the world thinking that every stranger around every corner is just chomping at the bit to rape or molest them? ---
**Author:** ![SeaDragonTattoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@SeaDragonTattoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SeaDragonTattoo)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/27 "2010-10-21T01:05:36Z")
> [@kittenblue](#): > > That isn’t enough space. I’d feel uncomfortable as a woman if you came inside and waited. We’d have to jostle to get by each other! There are very few of those vestibules where I bank, but people always wait outside. If a man came inside one I’d feel like I was locked in a box with a stranger who is standing between me and the door. Cameras and passcards wouldn’t reassure me, and I’d have to turn around and look at you to make sure you weren’t all hooded up. > [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > Please tell me this is schtick? > One of the major pet peeves in my life is (you’ll pardon the ensuing description, it doesn’t do it justice) the personal safety codex that women seem to believe is their right, as a gender, to define and enforce to the world as some monolithic social contract. > > Protip: I don’t give a shit if you (global you) feel uncomfortable, as a woman, about anything based solely on your gender. And I certainly couldn’t give two flying craps if my gender, apropos of nothing else, happens to give you a bout of safety-induced claustrophobia. I’m with **kittenblue**. I would probably do exactly the same. Given a small 5’ vestibule. I probably wouldn’t ask you to leave, but I would not be totally at ease, either. So if I were walking down an alley at 3 in the morning just trying to get home from work, and a guy was behind me by less than 15 feet, I shouldn’t be on edge? I shouldn’t have my hand in my bag, with my thumb on the pepper spray trigger, just in case? I might even reverse direction and let him go along his way until the alley was empty again. Is that really so paranoid? How is that so different from being in a 5’ locked room with a strange dude? This is a big city, where people get mugged all the time. I happen to know more women who have been mugged than men - perhaps they’re just a bit of an easier target? Perhaps my own awareness and vigilance for my personal safety has, I don’t know, kept me safe so far? ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/28 "2010-10-21T01:09:53Z")
> [@SeaDragonTattoo](#): > > So if I were walking down an alley at 3 in the morning just trying to get home from work, and a guy was behind me by less than 15 feet, I shouldn’t be on edge? I shouldn’t have my hand in my bag, with my thumb on the pepper spray trigger, just in case? I might even reverse direction and let him go along his way until the alley was empty again. Is that really so paranoid? How is that so different from being in a 5’ locked room with a strange dude? This is a big city, where people get mugged all the time. I happen to know more women who have been mugged than men - perhaps they’re just a bit of an easier target? Perhaps my own awareness and vigilance for my personal safety has, I don’t know, kept me safe so far? No, you can be vigilant for your personal safety all you want. In fact, that’s probably reasonable. It’s when you start acting unreasonably, taking on some perma-victim-to-be mentality, and affecting others that it’s a problem. But, good job providing a life example where you’re walking down an alley at 3 AM in a mugging-rich city as an example of baseline behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Otara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a88e4f/32.png) [@Otara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otara)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/29 "2010-10-21T01:15:17Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > how about they worry about it when there’s actually grounds to worry, instead of going out into the world thinking that every stranger around every corner is just chomping at the bit to rape or molest them? Well you’re clearly on an angry panda roll, hope it makes you feel better. Otara ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/30 "2010-10-21T01:17:30Z")
> [@SeaDragonTattoo](#): > > I’m with **kittenblue**. I would probably do exactly the same. Given a small 5’ vestibule. I probably wouldn’t ask you to leave, but I would not be totally at ease, either. > > So if I were walking down an alley at 3 in the morning just trying to get home from work, and a guy was behind me by less than 15 feet, I shouldn’t be on edge? I shouldn’t have my hand in my bag, with my thumb on the pepper spray trigger, just in case? I might even reverse direction and let him go along his way until the alley was empty again. Is that really so paranoid? How is that so different from being in a 5’ locked room with a strange dude? This is a big city, where people get mugged all the time. I happen to know more women who have been mugged than men - perhaps they’re just a bit of an easier target? Perhaps my own awareness and vigilance for my personal safety has, I don’t know, kept me safe so far? It would be the same if the alley was equipped with a shit ton of bright lights, cameras, and would make really loud scary noises to alarm the police if you broke some of the glass in it. ---
**Author:** ![SeaDragonTattoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@SeaDragonTattoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SeaDragonTattoo)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/31 "2010-10-21T01:30:00Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > No, you can be vigilant for your personal safety all you want. In fact, that’s probably reasonable. It’s when you start acting unreasonably, taking on some perma-victim-to-be mentality, and affecting others that it’s a problem. > > But, good job providing a life example where you’re walking down an alley at 3 AM in a mugging-rich city as an example of baseline behavior. Happens all the time. I work late shifts, don’t use a car, take the El home, and the alley is better-lit than the street, and a shorter walk. So yeah, it’s a realistic life example, and works as a reasonable model for at least 40 other women I know who work and live similarly. I get the part about affecting others, though, and probably wouldn’t have reacted as strongly as the woman in the OP about sending the guy back outside, but what **kittenblue** said about making sure to look at the guy to make sure he wasn’t hooded or otherwise shady, that’s pretty reasonable too. ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/32 "2010-10-21T01:37:25Z")
As long as you were standing far enough away you couldn’t read the screen, you’re good. ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/33 "2010-10-21T01:38:05Z")
I’d be uncomfortable. But I’d be uncomfortable if you were male or female. I was taught (and it’s the way I’ve seen most people around here act) that you don’t crowd someone at an ATM. You wait outside or in your car\*, even if it’s a vestibule type set up (I haven’t seen a vestibule with multiple ATMs, though). It’s different if the other person is just walking through to go into the bank, obviously. But basically, I was raised to be wary of someone (man or woman) waiting for the ATM within relative close distance; they may want to try to rob you after you’ve taken money out.\* I’m not the only one who does this around here, though, so it’s not just me. - Now is this _likely_? Of course not; the vaaaast majority of people hanging out at ATMs are there to use the ATM. It’s just caution. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/34 "2010-10-21T02:17:04Z")
> [@etv78](#): > > As long as you were standing far enough away you couldn’t read the screen, you’re good. Right. OP, you’re fine. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/35 "2010-10-21T05:17:54Z")
I don’t think it’s necessarily reasonable to be uncomfortable in that situation, but people are often not reasonable. I actually applaud someoen having the guts to deal with the issue that makes them uncomfortable. The only think that makes me pause is how you phrased the question. If she was employing some better-than-thou attitude, I’d be more likely to be upset by the encounter. I’d probably say something like “Well, I can’t see what you are doing, but I guess I’ll go outside.” Yes, it’s a bit passive aggressive, but it’s about the only polite way I can think of to voice my displeasure. Being confrontational isn’t called for here. ---
**Author:** ![kittenblue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ba8739/32.png) [@kittenblue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kittenblue)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/36 "2010-10-21T14:38:35Z")
And really, what help are the security cameras? I’m still left bleeding on the ground without my money. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/37 "2010-10-21T14:50:11Z")
How close were you exactly? I’d say within six feet, she’s not being paranoid. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/38 "2010-10-21T14:58:45Z")
Five feet is a bit on the tight side; I’d call it a grey area; you weren’t out of line nor was she. ---
**Author:** ![Blaster\_Master](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cab0a1/32.png) [@Blaster\_Master](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blaster_Master)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/39 "2010-10-21T15:23:35Z")
The etiquette, as far as I’ve always known, is just to make sure you leave more space than usual personal space for ATMs so as to be clear that you’re not trying to see that person’s personal information. In fact, whenever there’s a short line, particularly if I’m the only one waiting, I generally leave at least twice normal personal space between myself and the person at the front. None of the banks I’ve ever used had an indoor ATM, but I’d probably default to waiting right outside unless the area was somewhat large, such that I could leave a good 6’ or so between us, or it was particularly hot or cold or wet outside. However, in her case, unless the space is particularly small, I don’t really see a reason to object, particularly because there are cameras and, in this case, one would have to identify oneself just to enter. So, I’d say you didn’t do anything wrong and you were polite to respect her request, and she was probably excessively paranoid, but not really outside her rights to request that. ---
**Author:** ![MarkF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@MarkF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MarkF)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797/40 "2010-10-21T15:36:44Z")
I’m just amused that the Google ad is for “Free UK Dating!” and “Shatter the Ceiling” _For ambitious, professional women…_" 😃 I think you were very considerate which is no bad thing, even if the lady in question was being a tad paranoid. The only advice I would offer, should you find yourself in a similar position is; if you happen to be in charge of a penis, don’t attempt to shake hands as well! 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-etiquette/557797.md?page=3)