# ATM or ATM Machine? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 13, 2006, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648 "2006-05-13T16:21:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2006, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/41 "2006-05-14T16:26:45Z")
Sheesh! Peace, mangeorge ---
**Author:** ![Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/96bed5/32.png) [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patty_O_Furniture)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2006, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/42 "2006-05-14T19:47:59Z")
> [@Donovan](#): > > Where I work, we maintain communication to **A** utomated\*\* T\*\*eller **M** achines, and some of them communicate to ops centers using **A** synchronous **T** ransfer **M** ode… and it still pisses me off when people say ATM machine 😃 An ATM machine using an ATM DS1 as its com link? That’s a bit of overkill don’t you think? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2006, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/43 "2006-05-14T19:53:54Z")
Nobody has yet mentioned the HIV virus or LCD displays in this thread, either. And yes, they bug me. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2006, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/44 "2006-05-14T20:01:23Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Nobody has yet mentioned the HIV virus or LCD displays in this thread, either. And yes, they bug me. HI virus and LC display are pleasing to your ear? ---
**Author:** ![Hostile\_Dialect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e495f1/32.png) [@Hostile\_Dialect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hostile_Dialect)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2006, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/45 "2006-05-14T20:34:59Z")
> [@Hampshire](#): > > TCBY yogurt? In the same ballpark as MLB baseball and SCUBA apparati. There are lots of different kinds of baseball, apparati and yogurt, and it’s necessary to use the relevant acronyms as adjectives to differentiate them. **RockoSoBe** , please limit your replies to one at a time. You can consolidate all of them into one post by using the “Quote” button at the top of that nifty toolbar on the reply page. > [@kanicbird](#): > > It helps to define what type of machine or gear if you are using the term as a single part of speech. “ATM machine” and “SCUBA gear” are vastly different examples. There are many kinds of machines and gear, but you can say “I’m going down to the ATM” and be perfectly understood as in that context “ATM” can only mean one thing. If you say, however, “I’m going to buy a SCUBA”, the listener might be confused: a SCUBA what? Lesson? Pack? Vacation package? > [@mangeorge](#): > > HI virus and LC display are pleasing to your ear? “LCD” can easily be used as a noun without disturbing the flow of conversation; you’d probably be understood perfectly if you said “This laptop has a wide LCD”. Personally, though, I’d be more inclined to say “LCD monitor” as I don’t much like using the word “display” as a noun, redundancy or no. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2006, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/46 "2006-05-14T22:13:47Z")
I don’t know. I don’t think of that little display on my multimeter as a screen, though it surely is. How about HIV virus? Can “HIV” really stand alone as a noun? Are researchers working to find a way to defeat the HIV? ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2006, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/47 "2006-05-14T22:22:35Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > The phenomenon is known as RAS syndrome (which stands for Redundant Acronym Syndrome syndrome). > > I think it’s because certain acronyms and abbreviations are _too_ concise - they achieve brevity at the expense of clarity. > If, apropos of nothing, you say “I think I’ve forgotten my PIN”, you could be talking about a range of different things - needlework, engineering, etc - but calling it ‘PIN number’, despite the redundancy, is unambiguous and still easier than saying ‘personal identification number’ - which is rather too many syllables. I used “PIN number” because simply saying PIN would cause confusion. However, I use ATM all by itself because nobody I know would need the extra clarification that “ATM machine” would give. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2006, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/48 "2006-05-14T22:33:44Z")
> [@fetus](#): > > ATM machine" and “SCUBA gear” are vastly different examples. The main differences as I see them is: 1 - time - scuba is a much older term 2 - pronouncability - scuba is pronounceable as a word Now ATM doesn’t have #2, but if these machienes (of the ATM type ;)) are still around for another 50 years the meaning of the letters will be lost and it will forever be just another pronoun of a type of machine ---
**Author:** ![The\_Controvert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dec6dc/32.png) [@The\_Controvert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Controvert)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2006, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/49 "2006-05-14T22:38:53Z")
> [@d1gger](#): > > Isn’t this like a “Hot Water Heater”? If it is hot, why heat it? You heat it to keep it hot. Hot water doesn’t stay hot otherwise. Any other questions, wiseguy? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BoringDad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ad7895/32.png) [@BoringDad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BoringDad)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2006, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/50 "2006-05-14T23:38:15Z")
> [@RockoSoBe](#): > > I understand what you’re saying but PIN is a word as well as an acronym. What else could you interpret , “ATM” as? Don’t forget the original thread as trivial as it may be. > > Think before you speak…don’t be a sheep! ATM has become a defacto word. In fact, it has become a defacto adjective that can be used to modify the word machine. What has not been noted in the thread up to this point is that common usage almost never uses acronyms as nouns, even if they were originally intended as such. To use an acronym as a noun seems very clumsy to me. Thus I am not suprised that we end up with so many acronyms used as adjectives that modify a noun that are nominally part of the acronym, whether the acronym is clear on it’s own or not. ---
**Author:** ![Speaker\_for\_the\_Dead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@Speaker\_for\_the\_Dead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Speaker_for_the_Dead)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2006, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/51 "2006-05-15T00:38:56Z")
> [@BoringDad](#): > > ATM has become a defacto word. In fact, it has become a defacto adjective that can be used to modify the word machine. > > What has not been noted in the thread up to this point is that common usage almost never uses acronyms as nouns, even if they were originally intended as such. To use an acronym as a noun seems very clumsy to me. Thus I am not suprised that we end up with so many acronyms used as adjectives that modify a noun that are nominally part of the acronym, whether the acronym is clear on it’s own or not. I think I would amend this to say “common usage almost never uses acronyms _that are pronounced as individual letters, rather than as words_ as nouns.” ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2006, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/52 "2006-05-15T01:05:49Z")
_“Ooh, I just got this really cool video on my computer. I want to put it on a DVD.” “So you want to burn a DVD?” “Yeah, duh.” “Well do you want to make a data DVD, or a video DVD?” “Quit being a smartass, I know what a DVD is. Video DVD is redundant.” “No see, there’s DVD video, and there’re DVD-ROMs. Sometimes you can put video on a DVD, but it isn’t really DVD video. It’s just video on a DVD. Sometimes DVD is a noun, sometimes is an adjective.” “Oh, yeah? Well fat is a noun and an adjective. How’d ya like a nice fat lip?”_ ---
**Author:** ![BoringDad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ad7895/32.png) [@BoringDad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BoringDad)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2006, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/53 "2006-05-15T01:08:01Z")
> [@Speaker for the Dead](#): > > I think I would amend this to say “common usage almost never uses acronyms _that are pronounced as individual letters, rather than as words_ as nouns.” Hmmm. Not sure I agree. After all, we say “scuba gear” with the fully pronounced word SCUBA acting as an adjective. I’m currently blanking out on other pronounced acronyms in common use, so I’m having a hard time investigating further. ---
**Author:** ![Hostile\_Dialect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e495f1/32.png) [@Hostile\_Dialect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hostile_Dialect)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2006, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/54 "2006-05-15T01:19:50Z")
DVDs, again, are irrelevant to the discussion because there are several different kinds of DVDs which can be easily confused in the same context, but there’s only one kind of ATM that you would go to in order to get cash out of your banking account. “Hey, are you gonna go bar-hopping with us?” “Yeah, but lemme run down to the ATM first.” “Wait–are you going to get cash, or tell pilots where to land?” ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2006, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/55 "2006-05-15T03:02:38Z")
> [@fetus](#): > > DVDs, again, are irrelevant to the discussion because there are several different kinds of DVDs which can be easily confused in the same context, but there’s only one kind of ATM that you would go to in order to get cash out of your banking account. > > “Hey, are you gonna go bar-hopping with us?” > “Yeah, but lemme run down to the ATM first.” > “Wait–are you going to get cash, or tell pilots where to land?” “I’m gonna pop into that drug store and get some smokes.” “Need some cash?” “Nah, they take ATMs.” :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Speaker\_for\_the\_Dead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@Speaker\_for\_the\_Dead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Speaker_for_the_Dead)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2006, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/56 "2006-05-15T03:37:09Z")
> [@BoringDad](#): > > Hmmm. Not sure I agree. After all, we say “scuba gear” with the fully pronounced word SCUBA acting as an adjective. I’m currently blanking out on other pronounced acronyms in common use, so I’m having a hard time investigating further. I’m sorry, I wasn’t clear. I didn’t mean that word-acronyms were only used as nouns, but that acronyms used as nouns are almost all word-acronyms. Hm, that’s not much clearer, but I hope you see what I mean. For example, I would say “I’ve got him on radar, so do you want me to hit him with this laser?” but also say “CCP Party members.” ---
**Author:** ![Staggerlee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/staggerlee/32/3134_2.png) [@Staggerlee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Staggerlee)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2006, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/57 "2006-05-15T12:21:10Z")
> [@RockoSoBe](#): > > Call me stupid, but I’ve found that most Americans use this acronym improperly in a sentence. An ATM is obviously defined as an Automatic or Automated Teller Machine. So why do most people refer to an ATM as an ATM machine??? “I have to run to the ATM machine to get some money.” A bit redundant don’t you think? You could save yourselves a lot of irritation by simply calling them ‘cash machines’, I’d suggest. The acronym+redundancy that niggles me is when you are on a cruise ship and someone says ‘that posh person is returning to their country of origin on the right-hand-side of the ship’. Grrr. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2006, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/58 "2006-05-15T14:04:30Z")
Yeah, the English language is full of snafu fuck-ups. (And I always thought BTK sounded like something you would order at Burger King) ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2006, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/59 "2006-05-15T14:40:36Z")
> [@mangeorge](#): > > How about HIV virus? Can “HIV” really stand alone as a noun? Are researchers working to find a way to defeat the HIV? “Does he have HIV?” works. But yeah, maybe it should be “Does he have the HIV?” ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2006, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648/60 "2006-05-15T14:51:19Z")
> [@Staggerlee](#): > > You could save yourselves a lot of irritation by simply calling them ‘cash machines’, I’d suggest. > > The acronym+redundancy that niggles me is when you are on a cruise ship and someone says ‘that posh person is returning to their country of origin on the right-hand-side of the ship’. Grrr. Posh does not stem from port out, starboard home. That’s an urban legend. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/atm-or-atm-machine/356648.md?page=4)