# Attn MSM: A GI killed in Iraq is not "killed in the War on Terror" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 1, 2007, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248 "2007-05-01T02:16:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/1 "2007-05-01T02:16:28Z")
Just saw this usage employed on the local 10:00 news. One local guy killed in Afghanistan, one in Iraq, and the reporter described both as soldiers “killed in the War on Terror.” WRT Afghanistan you could make a case for that if you stretch it, but Iraq?!!! All honor to our country’s fallen, but that’s no excuse for mischaracterizing their mission. How often is this usage used without comment or examination? (It was a Fox channel, BTW, but not Fox **News.** I would’ve expected that to make a difference.) ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/2 "2007-05-01T02:30:10Z")
Just keep talking. That’s the kind of ironclad logic that’s just going to chase all kinds of voters your way. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/3 "2007-05-01T02:39:26Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > That’s the kind of ironclad logic that’s just going to chase all kinds of voters your way. Apparently most of the voters [have got there already](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_War#Iraq_War_and_U.S._War_on_Terrorism): > [@](#): > > In April 2003, one month after the invasion, another poll found that 77% of Americans agreed that the Iraq War was part of the War on Terrorism. These numbers have fallen […] a January 2007 poll found that 57% of Americans in general feel that the Iraq War is not part of the War on Terror. Moreover, a 2006 poll found that only 9% of Americans felt the war in Iraq was helping to decrease terrorism. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/4 "2007-05-01T03:05:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Just keep talking. That’s the kind of ironclad logic that’s just going to chase all kinds of voters your way. One side is sending soldiers off to be killed. And the other side is against that. Yes, this election will be too close to call. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/5 "2007-05-01T03:13:06Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] That’s the kind of ironclad logic that’s just going to chase all kinds of voters your way. [/QUOTE] Logic is for arguments. I did not think “Iraq War != War on Terror” was even a matter open for debate on this board at this point. **You** don’t seriously believe the one has anything to do with the other, do you? ---
**Author:** ![Giraffe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giraffe/32/129_2.png) [@Giraffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giraffe)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/6 "2007-05-01T03:41:49Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] Just keep talking. That’s the kind of ironclad logic that’s just going to chase all kinds of voters your way. [/QUOTE] What office is **BrainGlutton** running for, exactly? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/7 "2007-05-01T04:03:15Z")
I will always picture the war in Iraq as the square peg that was rammed into the round hole of the war on terror “toy” set, sure Bush managed to make it fit, but sadly many in America are still in denial that Bush broke the “toy” in the process. “one war at a time, gentlemen” - Lincoln (to his cabinet, that wanted to go to war with England for an incident that occurred while the US Civil War was going on.) ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/8 "2007-05-01T10:17:10Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] Just keep talking. That’s the kind of ironclad logic that’s just going to chase all kinds of voters your way. [/QUOTE] If you locate a point, will you bring it to us? ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/9 "2007-05-01T11:35:28Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Logic is for arguments. I did not think “Iraq War != War on Terror” was even a matter open for debate on this board at this point. **You** don’t seriously believe the one has anything to do with the other, do you? [/QUOTE] It didn’t. It does now. And not in the way the current Admin would like to believe. Iraq is helping to breed terrorists and terrorists sentiment at a frightening rate. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/10 "2007-05-01T12:59:13Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] Just keep talking. That’s the kind of ironclad logic that’s just going to chase all kinds of voters your way. [/QUOTE] Please explain to the class exactly how Saddam flew a plane into the WTC. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/11 "2007-05-01T12:59:33Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] Just keep talking. That’s the kind of ironclad logic that’s just going to chase all kinds of voters your way. [/QUOTE] Gosh, another Rightard who is so concerned about helping out the Democrats. Keep your help. Your advice isn’t needed. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/12 "2007-05-01T13:08:32Z")
[QUOTE=ShibbOleth] It didn’t. It does now. And not in the way the current Admin would like to believe. Iraq is helping to breed terrorists and terrorists sentiment at a frightening rate. [/QUOTE] Indeed. Maybe we should call our Iraq adventure the “war **for** terror,” to remind us all of the own-goal quality it’s had from the beginning in that respect. ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/13 "2007-05-01T14:07:30Z")
[QUOTE=tdn] Please explain to the class exactly how Saddam flew a plane into the WTC. [/QUOTE] I love this. The fighting in Iraq absolutely is part of the larger war on terror. It’s simply astounding that you guys still can’t grasp this. You really seem to believe that unless Saddam personally had something to do with 9/11 Iraq can’t be a part of the war on terrorism. It’s been explained many times on the boards. It’s so obvious that it’s just common sense. Yet you guys just can’t wrap your minds around it. It’s fascinating. There are two separate ideas: 1. You don’t think Iraq _should be_ a part of the war on terror. 2. You don’t think Iraq _is_ a part of the war on terror. Somehow the hatred for all things Bush has fused these concepts and you can’t grasp that they are different. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/14 "2007-05-01T14:29:09Z")
[QUOTE=Debaser] I love this. … There are two separate ideas: 1. You don’t think Iraq _should be_ a part of the war on terror. 2. You don’t think Iraq _is_ a part of the war on terror. Somehow the hatred for all things Bush has fused these concepts and you can’t grasp that they are different. [/QUOTE] So, why Iraq in particular? What sort of a threat was it to the US, more than, e.g., Syria? How was it hosting more terrorists than, e.g., Pakistan? And for bonus points, from which country did the majority of the 9-11 terrorists come from? And from which country did they get most of their funding? (Hint: Its name does not start with the letter “I”). ---
**Author:** ![stolichnaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bcef8e/32.png) [@stolichnaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stolichnaya)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/15 "2007-05-01T14:32:01Z")
I understand that Iraq has been said to be part of the war on terror. That I completely understand. I understand that we are fighting terrorists in Iraq. I get that too. I’ll bet you anything that we could upset any government in the middle east and deploy an occupying force (or in Africa, or even South/Central America, or Europe, or Canada, or Ancient Greece, or Fraggle Rock) and you will see responses that you could legitimately characterize as “terrorism”. Does this mean that the war on Fraggle Rock is part of the War on Terror? ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/16 "2007-05-01T14:33:00Z")
[QUOTE=Debaser] Somehow the hatred for all things Bush has fused these concepts and you can’t grasp that they are different. [/QUOTE] That, or it’s impossible for you to tell what’s actually going on when all you can see from your vantage point are George’s cheeks. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![athelas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5e9695/32.png) [@athelas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/athelas)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/17 "2007-05-01T15:02:17Z")
[QUOTE=Little Nemo] One side is sending soldiers off to be killed. And the other side is against that. Yes, this election will be too close to call. [/QUOTE] I totally agree. This Lincoln guy will never get reelected. ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/18 "2007-05-01T15:08:52Z")
[QUOTE=Giles] So, why Iraq in particular? What sort of a threat was it to the US, more than, e.g., Syria? How was it hosting more terrorists than, e.g., Pakistan? And for bonus points, from which country did the majority of the 9-11 terrorists come from? And from which country did they get most of their funding? (Hint: Its name does not start with the letter “I”). [/QUOTE] See, those are all reasons why you think Iraq _shouldn’t_ have been made a part of the war on terror. You’ve got a valid point that some other countries also supported and sponsored terrorists just as Saddam’s Iraq did. Although, I think it’s silly to simply consider the 9/11 terrorists came from as a basis for how we should treat Saudi Arabia. Cho was South Korean, but we’re not talking about invading or punishing South Korea because of his rampage. Look, if you want to argue that Iraq should not have been made a part of the war on terrorism than go ahead. There’s some valid arguments to be made there. Certainly many of the reasons given to invade were false. Where you lose me is arguing that it’s **not** a part of the larger war on terror. Clearly it is. 9/11 caused the US to begin a large scale war against terror of which Iraq is now a central part. Arguing otherwise is just denying reality. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/19 "2007-05-01T15:21:57Z")
Not sure I follow the reasoning here. “OK, Iraq wasn’t part of the War on Terra before the Iraq invasion, but it is _now_”. Was there a specific moment when this occured? Was it when AlQ foreign fighters came flooding in? Can anyone prove that any such thing actually happened, or are we forced to rely on the unimpeachable (snicker) candor of The Leader? Can you actually prove any of this, or have you simply swallowed another spoonful of yummy brown goodness? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2007, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248/20 "2007-05-01T15:23:47Z")
[QUOTE=Debaser] Where you lose me is arguing that it’s **not** a part of the larger war on terror. Clearly it is. 9/11 caused the US to begin a large scale war against terror of which Iraq is now a central part. **Arguing otherwise is just denying reality**. [/QUOTE] – bolding mine. No. Your “argument” is _creating its own reality_. BIG difference. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/attn-msm-a-gi-killed-in-iraq-is-not-killed-in-the-war-on-terror/402248.md?page=2)