# Australian Cricket Team Conspired to Tamper With The Ball **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [March 25, 2018, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153 "2018-03-25T07:38:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2018, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/61 "2018-03-28T16:56:37Z")
> [@Krav\_Manga](#): > > I have to wonder whether Lehmann is spared to avoid another Mickey Arthur fiasco (whose career Warner killed as well). Sure Warner may tip a bucket of shit on everyone still, but he has lost all credibility. [Wonder what became of him](http://www.thehindu.com/sport/cricket/champions-trophy-win-a-massive-boost-for-pakistan-cricket-mickey-arthur/article19102680.ece)? ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2018, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/62 "2018-03-28T20:41:04Z")
> [@Cumbrian](#): > > Smith and Warner - 1 year bans from International, Sheffield Shield and BBL cricket. > Bancroft - 9 months ban from same. Good start. Next comes the punitive financial losses. And so, the next time some mintie chewing, coke swilling, grass seed picking, Nosekote applying yobbo thinks he’ll be immune from sanction if they take a shortcut through the rule book they might recall the fate of two of the top ICC 5 batsman in the world who tried similar bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Krav\_Manga](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/krav_manga/32/3153_2.png) [@Krav\_Manga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Krav_Manga)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/63 "2018-03-29T02:41:32Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > Homeworkgate, which ended Arthur’s stint as coach occurred on the 2012-13 Australian tour of India. > The refusniks were Shane Watson, James Pattinson, Mitchell Johnson and Usman Khawaja. > Dave Warner wasn’t in the squad. Homeworkgate began Arthur’s fall, but the final nail was Warner punching Root and Australia’s dire performance in the Champion’s trophy. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/64 "2018-03-29T12:49:47Z")
Did this article ever nail this issue - whoa! > [@](#): > > On Sunday March 25 2018, Australians all over the country woke to some shocking news. > > Australia had cheated at cricket. > > While the rest of the world simply shrugged and thought “Well of course they have,” before chortling at the Baldrick-like cunning of the whole sorry enterprise, Australians were inexplicably but genuinely surprised. > [@](#): > > The Sandpaper Three have twin problems: Australians thought their team were the goodies and their fury at learning the truth has demanded a sacrifice. Meanwhile the rest of the world knew Warner, Smith and Bancroft to be a trio of cackling jackasses and so sympathy is limited. > > Warner is perhaps the most obnoxious personality in cricket, a dizzying mix of cartoonishly unpleasant behaviour and pious, sanctimonious judgement of others. > > Bancroft, meanwhile, spent the afterglow of his Test debut attempting to humiliate a fellow professional while Smith snickered alongside him. > > Australia’s team “culture”, for want of a less teeth-grindingly corporate word, has been toxic for years. But nobody within the board or in the country at large seemed to notice or care. > **[Australia has lost its collective mind - Cricket365](https://www.cricket365.com/top-story/australia-lost-collective-mind)** > > The draconian punishments handed down to Australia's Sandpaper Three fit the reaction to the crime rather than the offence itself, says Dave Tickner. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/65 "2018-03-29T13:41:35Z")
As an American, I’ve read this thread with interest even though I don’t what most of you are talking about half the time. The fascination comes with the amount of actual disgust and outrage this incident has caused. It sounds as though doctoring the ball a little bit is OK, but using foreign objects is beyond the pale. We’ve had similar incidents in baseball: [Joe Niekro caught with emery board (youtube video)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzxrKO-yVV8) The big difference was the reaction. The fans weren’t really outraged, and I don’t think Niekro felt any shame at all. ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/66 "2018-03-29T14:04:12Z")
So they punished him by making him go [on Letterman?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGEMk-YKWLA) ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/67 "2018-03-29T14:10:16Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#): > > As an American, I’ve read this thread with interest even though I don’t what most of you are talking about half the time. The fascination comes with the amount of actual disgust and outrage this incident has caused. It sounds as though doctoring the ball a little bit is OK, but using foreign objects is beyond the pale. We’ve had similar incidents in baseball: > > [Joe Niekro caught with emery board (youtube video)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzxrKO-yVV8) > > The big difference was the reaction. The fans weren’t really outraged, and I don’t think Niekro felt any shame at all. “Doctoring the ball” is absolutely not ok. The difference is that unlike baseball, the same ball is used for lengthy periods (about 80 “overs”, or 480 pitches). Which means that unlike Baseball, the condition of the ball as it changs, directly affects the play. The only thing players are permitted to do (legally) are 1. Shine the ball, basically meaning you can rub on your trouser leg to try and maintain the shine/smoothness 2. You are permitted to use, sweat, spit or dew tp help maintain said shine, nothing else. Since as the ball deteriorates, its behaviour changes, teams try and take advantage of it by managing the deterioration, often called “ball preparation”. Like for example, shining only one side, so there is a notale difference. The[physics of swing bowling](http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/258645.html). Somebody get \*\*Stranger on a Train \*\*in here, maybe he can explain what NASA scientist (and cricket fan) in the above article is trying to say. ---
**Author:** ![Cumbrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce7236/32.png) [@Cumbrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cumbrian)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/68 "2018-03-29T14:24:27Z")
I thought I’d read enough about this but then I read the article \*\*up the junction \*\*linked to above and chortled a few times, as well as agreeing with much of it. Anyway, Lehmann is gone now too. Smith and Lehmann reduced to tears in their respective press conferences. Best line I have seen on Lehmann’s “I didn’t know what was going on” defence is that the recent Ashes series was contested between two teams coached by guys who didn’t know what was going on. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/69 "2018-03-29T14:38:19Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > …the same ball is used for lengthy periods (about 80 “overs”, or 480 pitches). Which means that unlike Baseball, the condition of the ball as it changs, directly affects the play. Why is that? Is there a specific reason to use the same ball for that long? One of the links in this thread mentioned that whacking the ball on hard ground or rubbing sweat on one side was fairly common. That’s all I meant by “doctoring,” but come to think of it, is there a cricket equivalent to a spitball? ---
**Author:** ![Cumbrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce7236/32.png) [@Cumbrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cumbrian)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/70 "2018-03-29T14:45:15Z")
Spitballs are illegal in baseball right? If so, you’re looking at the equivalent here - illegally changing the condition of the ball. Why do we use the ball for 80 overs at a time? Because we always have, I suppose, is the answer - it’s part of the game, adjusting to the condition of the ball, for both batsmen and bowlers. It’s also cheaper than replacing the ball every 6 deliveries- you don’t need hundreds of balls a season at the amateur level, so you can keep overheads down in a sport that requires pretty expensive equipment otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/71 "2018-03-29T14:51:07Z")
Some good examples of reverse swing here - remember this is over 22 yards at almost 90mph, and it’s a veeeeeery hard ball: [![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mfqy-BmMU5I) ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2018, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/72 "2018-03-29T23:54:33Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Did this article ever nail this issue - whoa! Yeah, but Tickner has gone off half sucked. > [@](#): > > Sutherland will have arrived in South Africa for the conclusion of the investigation hoping for three things: 1. that only the Sandpaper Three knew of the nefarious plot; 2. that the coach and his staff weren’t involved; 3. that this was an isolated, one-off incident. > > Happily for everyone, the investigation found precisely this. Yes the initial findings are that, the ICC issued demerit points and docked their match fees. Which I presume Tickner considers a fair cop and play on son. But the coach’s position was untenable and he’s gone. And the investigation is ongoing and there will be more. The underlying premise is Tickner would be really quite chuffed if the England team were to win through a bit of chicanery because shithey, we all do it. He put the boots into them from the cheap seat when they were rolled by NZ for 58 recently. There wasn’t the merest peep for him when England staged a remarkable effort to get within a handful of overs of saving the game. All hale the moral vacuum of the Twitteracracy. I think there can be some confidence that this particular ball tampering incident was a once off. Because it was so ineptly done, with so little effect and so little advantage gained. Patently they couldn’t have been practiced at this. As Tickner would acquiesce there are plenty of Poms and Pakistanis and Saffers they could ask for expert advice on the matter. As **AK84** points out, the most reliable way to get a ball to swing either conventionally or reverse is totally legal. The Australian cricket team have been obnoxious bores for decades. For me it passed the tipping point about the end of Taylors tenure. To make the Test side you need to be technically sound, mentally tough and have a penchant for dishing it out. A recent and specific example: Peter Neville was clearly the best glovesman in the country. He was dropped in favour of Matthew Wade who is barely First Class standard with the gloves, a substantially inferior as a batsman outside the slog and giggle of T20 and arsehole of the first water for the singular reason that he was quote “more aggressive” i.e. he sledged and abused the opposing batsmen incessantly. The Australia selectors think that is more important for a keeper than their technical merits. Yes, a populist view here might have been that we could forgive the odd unsavory moment and indiscretion as they were the best in the world. From a grass roots level, under this visage is a deeper disquiet that they were best in the world because they incessantly sledged and abused. And based on their too commonly poor track record away from the shelters and comforts of home ONLY\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\* because they incessantly sledged and abused Finally they sledge and abuse on and off the field and premeditatedly cheat when they are having a bad day and so it doesn’t matter whether they are the best in the world or not. We don’t think that’s cricket. ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2018, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153/73 "2018-03-30T00:10:28Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Some good examples of reverse swing here - remember this is over 22 yards at almost 90mph, and it’s a veeeeeery hard ball: > > [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mfqy-BmMU5I](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mfqy-BmMU5I) Wow, for a batsman, all you could hope was that you were standing at the bowlers end. But on a point of order, when India’s Irfan Pathan takes a hat trick in the first over of the 2006 Test v Pakistan in Karachi, that’s not reverse swing. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/australian-cricket-team-conspired-to-tamper-with-the-ball/811153.md?page=3)