# Automatic Transmission With Higher MPG Than Manual? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 2, 2011, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260 "2011-03-02T20:23:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Philster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/13edae/32.png) [@Philster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Philster)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2011, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/41 "2011-03-03T19:50:09Z")
Your dark-ages reckoning is as helpful as 4-speed manual transmission. In time, it (6, 7+ speed automatics) will all filter down to the masses. Or simple, efficient, 'kiss-my-perfect ass" CVT transmissions will. I know… CVT transmission is redundant. . ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2011, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/42 "2011-03-03T20:17:38Z")
> [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > Personally, I’d gain no benefit in switching to an automatic. You sound just like my Grandmother, when we were trying to persuade her to move beyond a corded, black dial telephone that hung on her kitchen wall. ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2011, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/43 "2011-03-03T21:20:29Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > You sound just like my Grandmother, when we were trying to persuade her to move beyond a corded, black dial telephone that hung on her kitchen wall. Driving a manual causes me no incovenience on a day-to-day basis. I’m looking for a new car at the moment. The auto version of the model I’m looking to buy costs more and has slightly worse performance and significantly worse mileage figures (44mpg vs 40mpg). I’m not blind to the advantages of autos. If I did a lot of city driving I’d consider getting one. A manual in a queue of traffic quickly gets tedious. Some manuals I can get in and drive without any problems, others I struggle with because the clutch pedal takes getting used to. I especially appreciate having an auto when on holiday in mainland Europe, going from a right hand to a left hand drive. With a manual, I keep banging my hand on the door, as I expect the gear lever to be on the other side. > [@Broomstick](#): > > The difference is that computer controls can somewhat compensate for the inadequacy of a driver in a way that a purely mechanical device cannot. This will enable Clueless Driver to get better mileage from an automatic than a manual. This gets bandied about a lot, but is it true? At what point does being in the wrong gear have more effect than an inherantly less efficient transmission? It would take some detailed analysis to work this out. Remember, drive an auto with a heavy right foot and it will stay in a lower gear for longer. > [@Broomstick](#): > > But let’s be honest, an intelligent and informed and skilled driver will probably get better milegae yet, whether using an auto or a manual. Yes, that’s true. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2011, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/44 "2011-03-03T21:35:01Z")
> [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > This gets bandied about a lot, but is it true? At what point does being in the wrong gear have more effect than an inherantly less efficient transmission? It would take some detailed analysis to work this out. Remember, drive an auto with a heavy right foot and it will stay in a lower gear for longer. Dunno. But while I reliably get 40 mpg with my auto-trans Toyota I’ve meet several people with the same model who can’t seem to squeeze more than 30 mpg out of it. My observations are informal, but I suspect at least part of the difference is that I avoid jack rabbit starts, as opposed to being enthused about them, and when the opportunity arises that I can safely coast to a red light I do so, as opposed to racing to be the first at the light. Multiply that by a half dozen more very simple techniques and it accounts for much if not all of the difference. Admittedly, no transmission will compensate for some of the above, but that’s partly my point - it’s not just the transmission that counts. As my husband is disabled and can’t safely operate a manual transmission my vehicles will remain automatics so long as we continue to be married. I haven’t found the performance difference significant _for my routine driving_. Certainly, there have been occasions where a manual transmission might have been advantageous but I can count those on the fingers of one hand and my auto-trans managed it, even if somewhat less efficiently. It is clear to me that at least some of the appeal of manuals is not efficiency or frugality but rather psychological on some level. You know what, if you just prefer manuals I’m totally fine with that, but be honest that it’s a _preference_. For every situation where a manual shows an advantage I could probably come up with a counter-example where the automatic provides one, even if it’s only convenience (the classic one is stop and go traffic, which is less of a hassle in an automatic). As noted, it’s becoming less of a difference every year. ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2011, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/45 "2011-03-03T22:30:38Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Admittedly, no transmission will compensate for some of the above, but that’s partly my point - it’s not just the transmission that counts. You’re right, driving style will have more effect on economy than the transmission, that’s been well studied and proven. > [@Broomstick](#): > > I haven’t found the performance difference significant _for my routine driving_. I tend to agree. I’ve only found it to be a problem when driving autos with very small engines. The 1.2 L auto I drove was not fun, while the same car with a manual was fine. > [@Broomstick](#): > > You know what, if you just prefer manuals I’m totally fine with that, but be honest that it’s a _preference_. There are advantages and disadvantages to both types of transmission, and it’s largely user preference deciding which factors are more important. As I said in my last post, if my circumstances were different I’d consider getting an auto. I’m just taking issue with a few of the things presented as facts in this thread, of which some are misleading and some may be true but are unproven. After all, this is GQ, not IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/46 "2011-03-04T00:03:00Z")
> [@Norse](#): > > “Know how to operate” as in “the average manual-transmission-trained European driver holding a driver’s license” or as in “a person who really knows how to get the most out of the car”? > > Because, IME there’s no guarantee that even the average non-flatlander European with a manual transmission car understands simple stuff like “get your foot off the accelerator if your car is standing still and the wheels are turning”. And I live in a country with significantly more uphills than flats, covered in ice, snow and slush some 3-5 months of the year and with predominantly manual transmission-equipped cars. > > I don’t have much confidence in the “average driver”'s driving skills. I’ve been blocked by, or helped get out of a ditch, too many of my fellow drivers to retain that belief. Not everybody is [Ari Vatanen](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-R7ws741KpE) … [what is it about crazy finns and cars anyways?] [and that road is nowhere near straight, it just looks that way when you are driving insanely fast on a cow path] > [@Norse](#): > > Does that imply that they are any different from people driving automatics? any monkey can drive an automatic, if you can drive a stick, you can generally drive anything. Drive an automatic only, then Michael Meyers and his scary mask and knife will get you … as you sit in that manual tranny riceburner and whimper because you can’t get it to start or move. > [@Mk\_VII](#): > > We reckon automatics are for cripples and people who can’t drive properly. You can get a manual tranny car modified for gimp use … it is just expensive and not normally done. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/47 "2011-03-04T00:08:17Z")
Given that, at least in my country, gimps tend to have far less earning power the economic issue is not trivial. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/48 "2011-03-04T00:11:42Z")
> [@Mk\_VII](#): > > We reckon automatics are for cripples and people who can’t drive properly. Yours is an entire nation of people who couldn’t properly drive on the right side of the road if they were drunk. Or sober. ---
**Author:** ![kferr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71e660/32.png) [@kferr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kferr)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/49 "2011-03-04T08:56:20Z")
> [@Francis\_Vaughan](#): > > … However the biggest differentiator between cars in the US and Europe, and the one that forces the technology difference is simple. Fuel prices are at least double that of the US across Europe. 2.5 times in the UK. Indeed. Yesterday I filled up with Shell V-Power Diesel. £1.40/litre or $8.77 per US gallon. ---
**Author:** ![RandomLetters](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8edcca/32.png) [@RandomLetters](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RandomLetters)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 9:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/50 "2011-03-04T09:56:37Z")
> [@Francis\_Vaughan](#): > > I find the US centric idea of European cars curiously amusing. (I assume it really was intended as a joke.) Given that the single most popular car model in Britain is the BMW 3 series, there is some sort of perception gap. . Do you have a cite for that? From what I [looked up](http://www.carbuzz.co.uk/blog/post/Best-Selling-Cars-UK-2010.aspx), the best selling car in the UK last year was the Ford Fiesta, followed by the Vauxhall Astra and the Ford Focus. ---
**Author:** ![Norse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a9adbd/32.png) [@Norse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Norse)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/51 "2011-03-04T14:43:12Z")
> [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > The 1.2 L auto I drove was not fun I’m willing to bet that there are vehicles (I won’t call them “cars”) that would be even worse. The late-70s model VW Polo diesel comes to my mind. Especially the auto transmission model. OMFG, it would have been better with a sewing machine motor. > [@aruvqan](#): > > any monkey can drive an automatic, if you can drive a stick, you can generally drive anything. This is of course anecdotal, but IME there’s quite a few monkeys who can drive a stick shift. Albeit not with very impressive results. But yeah, going from auto to manual might give a few more problems than going from manual to auto. ---
**Author:** ![Hairy\_Bob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecc23a/32.png) [@Hairy\_Bob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hairy_Bob)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/52 "2011-03-04T23:23:14Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Yours is an entire nation of people who couldn’t properly drive on the right side of the road if they were drunk. Or sober. I’d much rather drive on the correct side than the right. Much less oncoming traffic that way. Seriously though, I drive an artic 1500-2000 miles a week all over the UK road network and on the whole, most drivers I meet are very good, they are courteous, keep up with the flow of traffic, could use their indicators more often but generally seem to co-exist pretty well. Until rush hour, in any case. Then the roads are clogged with twice as many cars as they are designed to handle (my estimates, may be well off tbh), many of which are driven by people who only drive to get to work and home again. As such, every journey they make is hurried, many of them tailgate, causing massive tailbacks as one car’s brake lights flash, setting off an unstoppable chain reaction which threaten to keep me away from home yet another night… Sorry I’ve gone off on one again haven’t I? Towards topic, my lorry has a 12 speed computer controlled manual gearbox, no clutch pedal. It functions essentially like an auto, but has a stalk on the steering column which controls the gearbox, and can select forward, reverse or crawler gears, can switch between manual and automatic mode, and change up or down one or two gears at a time. Additionally, there is a heavy switch under the throttle pedal, which sacrifices fuel economy for power, and shifts down to put the engine in it’s peak torque range. I generally drive it in auto, but switch to manual before ascending more than a moderately steep hill with a load on, to stop the auto changing up at just the wrong moment, losing all momentum. I did try driving it in manual for about a month, but could only average 8-9mpg over a week, compared with 9.5-10.5 in auto, down mostly the same roads, similarly loaded. Hardly an exhaustive test, I know, but on top of that, the auto is much better at being in the right gear in certain situations, like roundabouts, leaving me free to concentrate on fitting into gaps in traffic without getting in peoples way, not to mention being much less tired at the end of the day, which can only make for safer driving. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/53 "2011-03-04T23:30:21Z")
**Hairy Bob** , it sounds like you’ve got the best of both worlds there. You can let the machine do the routine stuff while using human intelligence to anticipate for less than usual situations. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260/54 "2011-03-04T23:51:48Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Given that, at least in my country, gimps tend to have far less earning power the economic issue is not trivial. I agree, I have been out of work for 18 months, I need to telecommute because any jobs that have the possibility of telecommuting you have to demonstrate your ability to work dependably, however if I actually gimp in I cause flares which means I need to stay home [before FMLA kicked in at my last job I was going in to work for 2-3 weeks and having a week or so of flare … and if I start a new job I have no FMLA. Nice catch 22.] > [@Broomstick](#): > > **Hairy Bob** , it sounds like you’ve got the best of both worlds there. You can let the machine do the routine stuff while using human intelligence to anticipate for less than usual situations. The wonders of modern automotive engineering =) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/automatic-transmission-with-higher-mpg-than-manual/573260.md?page=2)