# Avatar: Now that you've actually seen it. No spoilers in OP **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 17, 2009, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626 "2009-12-17T11:32:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 40
**Author:** ![KLR\_650](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c4cdca/32.png) [@KLR\_650](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KLR_650)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/782 "2010-01-18T15:38:41Z")
Smurfahontas. I love it. How’s this for a fantasy movie: we can all eat ice-cream and cookies every day, and it’s GOOD for you. But wait. And it’s in FOUR-D!!! And the fourth dimension is Spirituality. Beautiful, peaceful, harmonious Spirituality. And the U.S.A. is evil. And the grown-ups all have pig-faces. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/783 "2010-01-18T16:26:06Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Incidentally, that weaselly general manager-was he taken from Alien II? Same behavior-the businessman concerned with money and nothing elese. All evil executives practice putting in their office. (See _Outland_ for another example) Tropes oughtta’ have a page on this. ---
**Author:** ![Illuminatiprimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/illuminatiprimus/32/11520_2.png) [@Illuminatiprimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Illuminatiprimus)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/784 "2010-01-18T17:10:14Z")
> [@KLR\_650](#): > > Smurfahontas. I love it. > > How’s this for a fantasy movie: we can all eat ice-cream and cookies every day, and it’s GOOD for you. > > But wait. And it’s in FOUR-D!!! And the fourth dimension is Spirituality. Beautiful, peaceful, harmonious Spirituality. > > And the U.S.A. is evil. And the grown-ups all have pig-faces. Er, what? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/785 "2010-01-18T17:55:03Z")
> [@KLR\_650](#): > > Smurfahontas. I love it. > > How’s this for a fantasy movie: we can all eat ice-cream and cookies every day, and it’s GOOD for you. > > But wait. And it’s in FOUR-D!!! And the fourth dimension is Spirituality. Beautiful, peaceful, harmonious Spirituality. > > And the U.S.A. is evil. And the grown-ups all have pig-faces. Yeah! Death to Capitalist PigDogs! ---
**Author:** ![duality72](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duality72/32/3910_2.png) [@duality72](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duality72)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/786 "2010-01-18T19:50:33Z")
> [@Illuminatiprimus](#): > > Er, what? 😕 He’s making fun of the movie’s ridiculously simplistic plot. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/787 "2010-01-18T20:48:19Z")
Those dog-like monsters that were going to kill Jake (until that sexy Na’vi chick saves him)-were they hunting companions of the Na’vi? The chick obviously felt bad about killing one “this did not have to happen”. Second:those jellyfish like (or milkweed seed like) things that floated around-exactly what did they do? In Jake’s video blogs, the date is always given as month 11 of earth year 2154-this stuff happened fast! The planet Pandora orbits a Jupiter-like planet that fills the shy-wouldsuch a large moon wreak havok upon Pandora? (high tides, etc.)? ---
**Author:** ![KLR\_650](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c4cdca/32.png) [@KLR\_650](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KLR_650)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/788 "2010-01-18T21:04:30Z")
Thank you, Duality, for explaining to Illuminatiprimpus. (He’s only a bureaucrat, and an “education” one at that.) ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/789 "2010-01-18T21:31:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Second:those jellyfish like (or milkweed seed like) things that floated around-exactly what did they do? They’re seeds of some sort (I think maybe Tree of Souls-seeds), and apparently more directly in tune with Eywa than most living things (hence why them clustering on Jake was a sign from Eywa). And I didn’t notice dates on the video logs… Were they timestamped in the corner, or something? ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2010, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/790 "2010-01-18T21:39:20Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > They’re seeds of some sort (I think maybe Tree of Souls-seeds), and apparently more directly in tune with Eywa than most living things (hence why them clustering on Jake was a sign from Eywa). > > And I didn’t notice dates on the video logs… Were they timestamped in the corner, or something? Yes, the dates were in the lower lefthand corner, wih his name, class/rank, and security level. I also wondered why when the Na’vi try to get Sigourney to transfer to her Na’vi body, here earth body had to be naked (as was Jakes)-and those mold-like RS232 bus connected things were growing into his (human) body. The nights were neat on Pandora-with all those phosphorescent plants around! ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/791 "2010-01-19T08:11:23Z")
> [@KLR\_650](#): > > Smurfahontas. I love it. > > How’s this for a fantasy movie: we can all eat ice-cream and cookies every day, and it’s GOOD for you. > > But wait. And it’s in FOUR-D!!! And the fourth dimension is Spirituality. Beautiful, peaceful, harmonious Spirituality. > > And the U.S.A. is evil. And the grown-ups all have pig-faces. I think you’re taking this movie a wee bit too seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Illuminatiprimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/illuminatiprimus/32/11520_2.png) [@Illuminatiprimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Illuminatiprimus)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/792 "2010-01-19T10:28:32Z")
> [@KLR\_650](#): > > Thank you, Duality, for explaining to Illuminatiprimpus. (He’s only a bureaucrat, and an “education” one at that.) Yeah, we don’t know much. I only know how to make tea and sharpen pencils. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 10:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/793 "2010-01-19T10:59:09Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Saw it last night-and I was impressed! By the end, those alien chicks were looking pretty hot! > That said, isn’t this movie just “Dances With Wolves” updated to 2154? This seems to be a Rorschach blot of a film; I’ve heard it called an “obvious” copy of all sorts of films and books. > [@ralph124c](#): > > The Na’vi language sounds a lot like the lakota (did Cameron copy it?), It was made for the film. > [@KLR\_650](#): > > Avatar is “Dances with Smurfs,” a phrase I only wish I’d coined. I’ve heard that before, and I really can’t take it seriously. I imagine a bunch of Na’vi roughing up Gargamel. “We hear you have a problem with blue people…” Why Smurfs and not, say, [Nac Mac Feegle](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nac_Mac_Feegle) instead? Smurfs are boring; _Avatar_ recast with ten foot tall Nac Mac Feegle would be funny. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/794 "2010-01-19T17:25:35Z")
I saw it a second time and liked it even more. Once you know that it’s a simple plot you can just enjoy the power of the images all the more. And some of the scenes do pack in a lot of emotional punch: the blazing aftermath of the attack on the big tree for instance. In many ways I think it’s best to think of the film as a piece of religious mythology from the Na’vi point of view. As in a lot of mythology, you don’t have nuanced characters or a complicated plot but an elemental battle between good and evil. The issue is whether the medium vividly dramatizes the battle between the two and the movie does a splendid job in that regard. The early scenes with the Na’vi do a magnificent job of portraying their world and ethos; I can’t think of another film where an entire ecosystem is created and explored in such loving detail. And like I said the post-apocalyptic scenes depicting the onslaught of evil are very powerful; I also agree with **Mangetout** Lang gave a hell of a performance, IMO the best in the film. I also appreciate the screenplay more after a second viewing. There aren’t many standout lines but there is also very little fat in the script. Almost every scene and line serves a purpose and illuminates some later scene. One theme that struck me as more important on a second viewing was Sully’s alienation from other human beings because of his handicap contrasted with the way he is accepted as a full member of the Na’vi. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/795 "2010-01-19T19:21:59Z")
Saw it last night in 3D and liked it a lot. Amazing visuals, with a level of detail that was just _amazing_. Definitely the kind of movie you gotta see on the big screen. A predictable and unsubtle script, all in all, but I didn’t particularly mind. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2010, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/796 "2010-01-19T20:45:04Z")
> [@](#): > > I also wondered why when the Na’vi try to get Sigourney to transfer to her Na’vi body, here earth body had to be naked (as was Jakes)-and those mold-like RS232 bus connected things were growing into his (human) body. I can think of two obvious reasons. First, it’s Sigourney friggin’ Weaver. Any excuse to get her naked is a good one. Second, from an in-story perspective, the tendrils probably had to connect to her in many places, and the shamans might not have even known precisely where they’d need to connect. Best to give it the benefit of the doubt, and not have clothes blocking the tendrils anywhere. > [@](#): > > I also appreciate the screenplay more after a second viewing. There aren’t many standout lines but there is also very little fat in the script. Almost every scene and line serves a purpose and illuminates some later scene. This is true; it was a very efficient script. It also did a good job of giving us a tremendous amount of information about this new world, without it ever feeling like an info-dump. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2010, 7:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/797 "2010-01-20T07:40:07Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I can think of two obvious reasons. First, it’s Sigourney friggin’ Weaver. Any excuse to get her naked is a good one. Second, from an in-story perspective, the tendrils probably had to connect to her in many places, and the shamans might not have even known precisely where they’d need to connect. Best to give it the benefit of the doubt, and not have clothes blocking the tendrils anywhere. Anyone get a _Nausicaa_ vibe from those scenes? ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2010, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/798 "2010-01-20T14:25:02Z")
> **['Avatar' pulled from 1,628 Chinese movie screens](https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2010-jan-19-la-fi-ct-china-avatar19-2010jan19-story.html)** > > 'Avatar' pulled from 1,628 Chinese movie screens Apparently someone noticed that a movie decrying the forced relocation of indigenous peoples for the sake of industrial development doesn’t exactly mesh with government policy. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2010, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/799 "2010-01-20T14:40:53Z")
Does this have to be posted in _every_ fscking Avatar thread? It’s got nothing to do with this thread’s discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Equipoise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/equipoise/32/151_2.png) [@Equipoise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Equipoise)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2010, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/800 "2010-01-20T20:25:51Z")
It is about Avatar after all. China’s only yanking the 2D version. The 3D/IMAX versions will continue to play for those who can afford to pay extra. It does cut down on the revenue though since there aren’t as many 3D/IMAX theaters in China. It’s funny, [I found this article](http://www.cinematical.com/2009/11/05/avatar-could-earn-back-its-budget-from-china-alone/) written way back in November about a month before it opened, about how well it would do in China. This article was dead on at how popular it would be, but of course they couldn’t possibly predict that China would yank the 2D versions. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2010, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626/801 "2010-01-20T20:52:20Z")
I just read this from the New York Times: [Luminous 3-D Jungle Is a Biologist’s Dream](http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/19/science/19essay.html?scp=1&sq=avatar%20biology&st=cse) As a tropical biologist, the article really sums up for me why I liked the movie so much: > [@](#): > > When watching a Hollywood movie that has robed itself in the themes and paraphernalia of science, a scientist expects to feel anything from annoyance to infuriation at facts misconstrued or processes misrepresented. What a scientist does not expect is to enter into a state of ecstatic wonderment, to have the urge to leap up and shout: “Yes! That’s exactly what it’s like!” > … > So it is time for all the biologists who have not yet done so to shut their laptops and run from their laboratories directly to the movie theaters, put on 3-D glasses and watch the film “Avatar.” … Because the director James Cameron’s otherworldly tale of romance and battle, aliens and armadas, has somehow managed to do what no other film has done. It has recreated what is the heart of biology: the naked, heart-stopping wonder of really seeing the living world. > … > But rather than having us giggling at a tribble or worrying over the safety of the children when a T. rex attacks, Mr. Cameron somehow has the audience seeing organisms in the tropical-forest-gone-mad of the planet Pandora just the way a biologist sees them. With each glance, we are reminded of organisms we already know, while marveling over the new and trying quickly to put this novelty into some kind of sensible place in the mind. While there were a few things that were implausible (among them a sentient race that looked so much like humans) overall I was just blown away by the attention to detail in creating an entire alien ecology. I’ve never seen a movie that accomplished this anywhere near as well. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626.md?page=39) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/avatar-now-that-youve-actually-seen-it-no-spoilers-in-op/521626.md?page=41)