# "Average Joe": Would they have the guts to reverse the sexes? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 21, 2003, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405 "2003-11-21T00:54:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/1 "2003-11-21T00:54:41Z")
The NBC reality show “Average Joe” – which features a number of average-looking guys competing for the hand of one hot chick – is a refreshing change from TV-land prettyness. I guess. But what if the genders were reversed? What if a dozen average-looking (or even downright ugly) women were competing for one handsome stud? It seems to follow logically as the next step . . . but would any network have the guts to try that? How could they convince the viewers that such a guy could envision happiness with such a woman? And who would watch it? I mean, if Richard Simmons’ “Sweatin’ to the Oldies” were broadcast in a prime-time slot, it would bomb, wouldn’t it? I raise this idea as a thought experiment that might point up some of the psychological differences between men and women, and in particular, what the sexes want in their TV programming. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/2 "2003-11-21T01:14:17Z")
FOX might. FOX would try nearly anything. ---
**Author:** ![teemingONE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b4bc9f/32.png) [@teemingONE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/teemingONE)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/3 "2003-11-21T01:41:32Z")
I don’t think so. They haven’t (to my knowledge) flipped around the smart/beautiful woman, lucky bastard formula for family sitcoms. Thats just the kind of world we live in. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/4 "2003-11-21T02:01:32Z")
Y’know, that’s just the kind of show I might watch. I’d love to see some women with depth, personality, and character on the tube… might make me watch it again. ---
**Author:** ![BlueMit11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7feea3/32.png) [@BlueMit11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlueMit11)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/5 "2003-11-21T02:38:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by teemingONE \* > \*\*I don’t think so. They haven’t (to my knowledge) flipped around the smart/beautiful woman, lucky bastard formula for family sitcoms. Thats just the kind of world we live in. \*\* Which plays into the whole theory that 90% of network television is cookie cutter crap and not worth watching. Maybe if they did have the gonads to change some of the expected and step out of their comfort zone, we’d have some decent network TV on our hands. In the meantime, I’m pretty much with **SPOOFE** on all but a couple network shows that I watch whenever I get a chance. ---
**Author:** ![FilmGeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@FilmGeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FilmGeek)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/6 "2003-11-21T04:17:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SPOOFE \* > \*\*Y’know, that’s just the kind of show I might watch. I’d love to see some women with depth, personality, and character on the tube… might make me watch it again. \*\* Do you really think that women with depth, personality and character ask to go on these crap shows? And if they do, do you think they get cast? ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/7 "2003-11-21T04:36:38Z")
Would never happen in a million years, and if it did the protests would be deafening. Equality fo the sexes may be a laudable goal, but men and women usually have very different expectations in terms of the roles and definitions they will accept in courtship. Women typically have the majority of the yes/no power in the inital stage of relationships. A beautiful woman choosing amoung average schlubs is seen as amusing, and the rejected men will go on their way, little the worse for wear. To flip this around, and have one extraordinarily handsome man chose among several average looking women, would be emotionally devastating, and an order of magnitude more humilating for the rejected women than for a man, who is used to having his overtures rejected. Women stripped of their power to choose become little more than harem girls waiting for the Pasha to choose them for the evening. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/8 "2003-11-21T04:38:21Z")
> [@](#): > > Do you really think that women with depth, personality and character ask to go on these crap shows? Nah, but what I’m saying is that a lot of the “actresses” on these shows are picked for their looks and their ability to be semi-convincing on camera. It’d just be an interesting change of pace to see some people picked for non-superficial reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/9 "2003-11-21T06:25:57Z")
Same reason why the comic strips will never show you Paige beaten up by her brother Jason in _FoxTrot_, or Andy Capp bonking his wife on the head with a frying pan. That would be _mean_. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/10 "2003-11-21T06:52:24Z")
Haven’t they already? Wasn’t that basically the idea of _The Bachelor_ and _Who Wants to Marry a Millionaire_? ---
**Author:** ![Rainbowthief](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4bbf92/32.png) [@Rainbowthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rainbowthief)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/11 "2003-11-21T07:14:08Z")
No, because those shows had beautiful women. If they got rejected, big deal, they were convinced they were “all that” anyway. It’s different for unattractive women being put in the spotlight to compete for the affections of a handsome man. That kind of rejection is shattering to the women–and to the viewers. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 7:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/12 "2003-11-21T07:50:22Z")
You know what? It’s often shattering for a man to be rejected by a woman, too. ---
**Author:** ![Headcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6bbea6/32.png) [@Headcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Headcoat)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/13 "2003-11-21T08:47:32Z")
I always wonder why people assume ugly people have better personalities than attractive people. In my experience, the homelier specimens of either gender had far worse personalities, wit, hygiene, style and intellect on average than those with good looks. It stands to reason that attractive people are more outgoing and vivacious due to confidence and approval of peers. thus exposing themselves to more experiences and interests, making them more well rounded. Their personalities develop better due more interaction with others. ---
**Author:** ![Zap\_Rowsdower](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3da27b/32.png) [@Zap\_Rowsdower](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zap_Rowsdower)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/14 "2003-11-21T14:55:33Z")
Hey, just take an attractive women and put glassess on her. That = unattractive, doesn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![slu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/74df32/32.png) [@slu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slu)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/15 "2003-11-21T14:59:48Z")
It would never get broadcast because nobody would watch it. Hot chicks sell ads. 25 ugly chicks do not. If I want to see 25 ugly chicks, I go to the cafeteria at work. > [@](#): > > _Originally Posted By Headcoat_ > I always wonder why people assume ugly people have better personalities than attractive people. You know, I have always wondered the same thing. I am pretty sure that the ratio of vapid, uninteresting, stupid people is the same for good looking and non-good looking people. In fact, I know a lot of ugly people that are downright nasty. **Headcoat** , I think you are right on about why. ---
**Author:** ![handy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@handy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handy)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/16 "2003-11-21T16:05:21Z")
They could do that in the future, sure. Of course, what is an average woman? BTW, if you haven’t watched the show lately last week they brought in three new guys, all hot looking studs. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/17 "2003-11-21T16:48:17Z")
I think the reason they don’t do it is that it would be an awfully short show. The average girls meet the guy and go into the cocktail party. The host tells the guy that these are the women he has to chose from. The man then runs away shrieking. ---
**Author:** ![riserius1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7ab992/32.png) [@riserius1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/riserius1)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/18 "2003-11-21T17:06:01Z")
Just some food for thought: Take the movie Forrest Gump. Now take the main storyline, i.e., the “romance” between a mentally slow man and a hot young female of normal intelligence. Now, reverse the genders. Everyone, to a person that I have proposed this scenario has had the same response: EEEWW!! Chris W ---
**Author:** ![Flymaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c4cdca/32.png) [@Flymaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flymaster)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/19 "2003-11-21T18:55:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SPOOFE \* > \*\*Nah, but what I’m saying is that a lot of the “actresses” on these shows are picked for their looks and their ability to be semi-convincing on camera. It’d just be an interesting change of pace to see some people picked for non-superficial reasons. \*\* But, if they were picking “average” to “homely” women, they’d be picking them for their looks, too. Just average looks, instead of exceptional good looks. It’s just as superficial. ---
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2003, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405/20 "2003-11-21T20:17:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zap\_Rowsdower \* > \*\*Hey, just take an attractive women and put glassess on her. That = unattractive, doesn’t it? \*\* Two words: Bailey Quarters [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/average-joe-would-they-have-the-guts-to-reverse-the-sexes/214405.md?page=2)