# \[b\]Interested Observer\[/b\] and other vaccine disinformers: ARGH! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 15, 2009, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971 "2009-02-15T18:13:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2009, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/41 "2009-02-17T22:11:50Z")
> [@SisterCoyote](#): > > Wring: Karl’s human, but she doctors on animals. > > To answer curlcoat’s question (sort of), children (and some adults) get a combination of vaccines: MMR (Measles-Mumps-Rubella [German Measles]) and DPT (Diphtheria-Pertussis-Tetanus) shots. So, yes, children are getting immunized against three diseases in one go. As I recall, the MMR shot has to be given in two doses over the course of two weeks (I had to be re-immunized as an adult to attend classes at my local University, since my vaccination records have vanished into the mists of time). > > I believe there are other immunizations given, but I’m damned if I can remember what any of them are. College kids have to get MMR boosters generally speaking - it’s one of those requirements. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2009, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/42 "2009-02-17T22:28:56Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > This seems to go back to concerns about what all these vaccinations are doing to immune systems. When I was young, 35-40 years ago, we barely got sick from chicken pox, much less die of it! A disease doesn’t have to be deadly to be unpleasant. Why wouldn’t you want to avoid an illness if you possibly could? > [@](#): > > OTOH, there is all of these immune related problems going on in children these days. (And, it doesn’t help that so many children are raised in what are essentially bubbles these days, what with all of the “germ fighting” products out there.) Cite? > [@](#): > > Yes. However, children are showing the same symptoms that dogs were that lead to studies on the long term affects frequent and unnecessary vaccination. Which vaccines do you think unnecessary and why? > [@](#): > > As I say, I don’t have and never will have any children, so it’s not like I’m going to end up sending evil unvaccinated children to school. But if I were a mother I’d be exploring the middle ground of not giving them everything possible that is out there, and doing it a bit slower. Considering that many of the illnesses we vaccinate against are contagious let me say that I’m grateful you’re not a mom. Either your pediatrician says you shouldn’t vaccinate for medical reasons so you don’t . . . or you vaccinate. What “middle ground” is there? Vaccine science goes back just about longer than any medical procedure out there. Time and time and time again vaccines have proven efficacious. Most of us have never known anyone sterile from mumps or deafened from HiB or made brain dead from measles. Most of us have never met a sufferer of congenital rubella or seen someone die incredibly painfully from tetanus. Smallpox has been gone for decades and polio is nearly there. We don’t go to bed frightened at night that our children will be consigned to iron lungs from polio or our faces disfigured from the pox or that diphtheria could slowly strangle the people we love. To pretend otherwise is fallacy. Worse dangerous contagious fallacy. ---
**Author:** ![Jenaroph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Jenaroph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jenaroph)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2009, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/43 "2009-02-17T22:37:28Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > This seems to go back to concerns about what all these vaccinations are doing to immune systems. When I was young, 35-40 years ago, we barely got sick from chicken pox, much less die of it! Cases varied, even back then. Your memories are rose-colored. I was 5 when I had a moderate case, over Christmas vacation. I remember itching a lot, and getting icky pink lotion baths for several days. My little brother had such a mild case, my mother says that she might not have noticed his 6 or 7 pockmarks if my sister and I hadn’t been sick at the same time. Oh yeah, my sister. She was miserable. She was covered head to toe, and had them inside her mouth and nose as well. She cried a lot and couldn’t eat much. To this day she has scars. I wouldn’t call her barely sick. This was circa 1977. (Is 32 years close enough to 35?) Every winter the chicken pox would go around, and every year news would travel about the kid who was sick - really sick - sick enough to go to the hospital. We all knew the name of that one guy who was unfortunate enough to have gotten the chicken pox _twice_. Where we were, if you’d reached the age of 10 before getting it, it was unusual. There were 10 kids out of over 20 in my kindergarten class who came to school the day before Christmas vacation the year I got sick. The rest ALL had chicken pox. It was a fact of life, it was a rite of passage in a sense, but it was not simply something to brush off. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGrenze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dbc845/32.png) [@KarlGrenze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGrenze)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2009, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/44 "2009-02-17T22:40:59Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Give vaccines yes, give annual multi-disease boosters, no. [As here](http://www.itsfortheanimals.com/DODDS-CHG-VACC-PROTOCOLS.HTM). Your cites appear to be talking about the immediate results from being vaccinated once, rather than long term affects of multiple, close together vaccinations. And the second cite was from a study of 33 dogs of the same breed (and most likely the same family). Not too compelling… Hmm… I’m a bit confused by your points, please explain a bit. On one point you’re talking about _annual boosters of the same vaccine type_ in animals (after their initial series is over), something which is being moved away from because it has been proven that many animals retain effective titers in all or most of the vaccine components even after a year (or more) has passed. My own dog has a 3- years rabies vaccine and is only getting annual combo boosters because she is a blood donor (and she skipped a year). OTOH, I think this thread is talking more about _first time vaccination series_ in kids. Which is why I looked up for the cite about first time vaccination in dogs, to, you know, make it comparable. And why I mentioned that in animals, they’re moving away not from using more vaccines, but from more boosters. Others have shown that humans do not necessarily get more boosters, but instead more vaccines as better newer ones are being developed. And again, the site you mentioned is not talking about first time vaccines, but instead of repeated boosters (something not happening in humans). BTW, a recent article (Lack of association between repeated vaccination and thyroiditis in laboratory Beagles. Scott-Moncrieff JC, Glickman NW, Glickman LT, HogenEsch H. J Vet Intern Med. 2006 Jul-Aug;20(4):818-21.) refutes one of the claims in the site you.. eh.. cited. Please note it is written by the same authors as the one used in that site. Meaning they went back and investigated it again. ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2009, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/45 "2009-02-17T22:55:26Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Well fed, living in clean surroundings, not exposed to third world diseases, all of that. Yes, uncontrolled diarrhea is more serious in a very young baby/puppy, but what I don’t get is how the well fed, living in clean surroundings, not exposed to third world diseases etc baby would end up getting life threatening diarrhea - pups living like that don’t. And I don’t think I’ve ever known anyone whose baby did either. Is this one of those “just in case a one in a million thing happens” sort of thing? I responded to your original post regarding whether or not diarrhea could truly be life-threatening to children with my understanding that yes, diarrhea could indeed truly be life-threatening to children in a relatively small period of time due to the differences in body size between children and adults (more rapid dehydration, more rapid electrolyte imbalance, etc.). I was unaware that this was going to be another one of your “I’ve never seen it happen, therefore it doesn’t exist and those concerns are invalid” posts. ---
**Author:** ![the\_Lady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bb73d2/32.png) [@the\_Lady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_Lady)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2009, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/46 "2009-02-17T23:14:54Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Well fed, living in clean surroundings, not exposed to third world diseases, all of that. Yes, uncontrolled diarrhea is more serious in a very young baby/puppy, but what I don’t get is how the well fed, living in clean surroundings, not exposed to third world diseases etc baby would end up getting life threatening diarrhea - pups living like that don’t. And I don’t think I’ve ever known anyone whose baby did either. Is this one of those “just in case a one in a million thing happens” sort of thing? Well, it wasn’t diarrhea, but I spent a slightly anxious afternoon at the hospital with my 5 month old two years ago. She had gotten some random tummy bug, and wasn’t keeping anything down. She was 100% breastfed at that point, so it wasn’t food-poisoning or anything. Babies that little dehydrate really quickly - when you puke up anything you take in… ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2009, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/47 "2009-02-17T23:26:07Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > Good online sources on this subject: Wow, it looks like I wasn’t far off on the number of vaccinations kids get before school age - if I read the chart right, it’s 37 before the age of 7. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2009, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/48 "2009-02-17T23:45:26Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > \Well fed, living in clean surroundings, not exposed to third world diseases, all of that. Yes, uncontrolled diarrhea is more serious in a very young baby/puppy, but what I don’t get is how the well fed, living in clean surroundings, not exposed to third world diseases etc baby would end up getting life threatening diarrhea - pups living like that don’t. And I don’t think I’ve ever known anyone whose baby did either. Is this one of those “just in case a one in a million thing happens” sort of thing?\ A couple of years ago I had to make an emergency room visit for dehydration from a case of apocalyptic diarrhea - at 40 years old, with a good knowledge of not getting dehydrated, in good health and living in clean conditions. When the bugs hit you, sometimes they just HIT you - I can easily see a young child being hospitalized with the bug I had. ---
**Author:** ![ENugent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/4af34b/32.png) [@ENugent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ENugent)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2009, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/49 "2009-02-17T23:53:55Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > All I saw was that there are more diseases being vaxed against, not the number of actual shots young children get. I read somewhere that a child will have had 50 shots by the time they start school - is this not true? The CDC vaccination schedule is [here](http://cdc.gov/vaccines/recs/schedules/default.htm). According to this, at age 6, a child should have had At birth: HepB 1 month: HepB 2 months: DTap, Hib, IPV (polio), PCV7 (pneumococcus), Rotavirus 4 months: DTap, Hib, IPV, PCV7, Rotavirus 6 months: DTap, Hib, PCV7, Rotavirus 6-18 months: HepB, IPV 12-15 months: Hib, PCV7, MMR (measles, mumps, rubella), Varicella (chicken pox) 12-23 months: HepA 15-18 months: DTap 18+ months: HepA 4-6 years: DTap, IPV, MMR, Varicella In addition, two flu shots in the first flu season after age 6 months, and one each subsequent year. Adding it up, I get a maximum of 36 shots by age 6. But I know that my son’s Rotavirus vaccine was oral, not an injection, and there may also be combo shots not accounted for in the list above. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/50 "2009-02-18T00:06:54Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Wow, it looks like I wasn’t far off on the number of vaccinations kids get before school age - if I read the chart right, it’s 37 before the age of 7. When I read the chart for ages 0-6, I see 11 separate recommended vaccines. If you add up total doses at different visits over that time, you might get to 37 shots. We’ve already talked about how scant an immune exposure that is, compared to all the bugs and antigens that bombard kids’ immune systems from the moment they’re born, and the potential severity of the actual diseases the shots protect children from. So what’s your point? It just _sounds_ like too much immunization to you? You’d encourage parents to pick and choose what shots their kids get, and to skip and/or delay protection because of some negative non-fact based impression you have, and the people who’ve devoted their lives to caring for children and fighting infectious disease should be ignored? ---
**Author:** ![ENugent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/4af34b/32.png) [@ENugent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ENugent)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/51 "2009-02-18T00:08:47Z")
> [@featherlou](#): > > I did a whole bunch of research and did a long, comprehensive post on the seriousness of commonly vaccinated childhood diseases about a year ago if anyone wants to search that up. It was chilling to find out about all of that - there’s a reason that we developed vaccinations for these diseases. [Found it](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10125195) Thanks for doing the research. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/52 "2009-02-18T00:10:36Z")
You know, back in the 1800’s, before vaccines, there were very few deaths due to car accidents. Very few. You could look it up. Now, we have literally thousands of people killed every year by car accidents. I think that you can see where I’m going here… Plus, I knew a guy that had his son vaccinated, and on the way home from the Doctor’s office… BAM! Killed by an oncoming truck. Just like that. So sad. And all caused by vaccines. ---
**Author:** ![ENugent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/4af34b/32.png) [@ENugent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ENugent)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/53 "2009-02-18T00:14:26Z")
> [@ENugent](#): > > At birth: HepB > 1 month: HepB > 2 months: DTap, Hib, IPV (polio), PCV7 (pneumococcus), Rotavirus > 4 months: DTap, Hib, IPV, PCV7, Rotavirus > 6 months: DTap, Hib, PCV7, Rotavirus > 6-18 months: HepB, IPV > 12-15 months: Hib, PCV7, MMR (measles, mumps, rubella), Varicella (chicken pox) > 12-23 months: HepA > 15-18 months: DTap > 18+ months: HepA > 4-6 years: DTap, IPV, MMR, Varicella > > In addition, two flu shots in the first flu season after age 6 months, and one each subsequent year. If you split up all of the shots above that are combo shots (DTap and MMR), you get to fifty immunizations, which is probably where the alarmist number of fifty comes from. But it’s far fewer actual antigens - I count thirteen plus the flu (which is more complicated because it changes each year). ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/54 "2009-02-18T00:35:25Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > My daughter was on the verge of hospitalization once from diarrhea, and it hadn’t gone on too long. It is possible for little kids to get dehydrated very quickly. Did she get it due to whateveritwas that the vaccine is for? Diarrhea is a symptom, not a disease, so I was kind of surprised to see a vaccine for something that the primary symptom was diarrhea. > [@](#): > > I never had mumps as a kid, but I had everything else. I think I eventually got one. In my recollection, things like the measles are far more serious for adults than for kids. I don’t know if your parents did it, but when I was a kid parents often exposed their kids to stuff like this deliberately to get it over with. One of these common diseases (measles?) is very dangerous when you are pregnant, and my wife, who had never had it, got an immunization right after the birth of our first kid to be safe for our second - and to make sure she didn’t get it from unimmunized kids she’d be exposed to. Hmm. So maybe the idea is, since parents don’t tend to allow their children to get exposed to childhood diseases any more, everyone should be vaccinated so you don’t get them as an adult? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/55 "2009-02-18T00:37:37Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > You are about the same age I am…funny how different our experiences with diseases - yes, death from chicken pox has always been rare, but its not unknown and never has been. Huh. It would never occur to me that a child could die from chicken pox. Was it because they got something else at the same time? Previously poor immune system? Gotta go look this up… ---
**Author:** ![Vlad\_Igor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/7feea3/32.png) [@Vlad\_Igor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vlad_Igor)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/56 "2009-02-18T00:43:34Z")
37 antigens/substances children are exposed to between age 3 days and 7 years: 1. dust 2. animal dander 3. plant pollen (this could be 37 things all by itself, but I’m counting it as 1) 4. Escherichia coli 5. Lactobacillus sp. 6. Staphylococcus sp. 7. Streptococcus sp. 8. Candida albicans 9. wool 10. polyaromatic hydrocarbons That’s just in the first 24 hours home from the hospital. 1. gluten 2. Arah-1, a peanut protein. 3. casein 4. dirt (as in soil from the ground, having many more that 37 items) 5. lotions 6. soaps 7. rhinoviruses 8. petting zoo animals 9. pets (other than ones present when the newborn came home) 10. fish 11. synthetic fibers 12. saw dust 13. poison ivy 14. plants and pollens from other geographic areas while on vacation (again, this could be more than 37 items). 15. various pathogens that cause a fever of unknown origin (FUO). 16. other people 17. paint 18. yeasts and fungi Well, alright I can’t come up with 37 individual things, but I have listed several classes of things that bring the total well over 37. The point is that the immune system is constantly challenged by things that are non-self. The immune system is not able to distinguish between antigens from a vaccine vs. antigens from the environment. The immune system is going to react to a flood of antigens from a vaccine the same as it will react to the flood of antigens from a rhinovirus the first time the child has a cold. FUOs are also not uncommon in the first few months of life as the immune system comes across various environmental viruses and bacteria. The idea that vaccines somehow stress the immune system differently is a baseless argument presented by anti-vaccinators who have no idea how the immune system works. Vlad/Igor ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/57 "2009-02-18T01:01:13Z")
> [@dactylic\_hexameter](#): > > I think this is a totally different topic. However, > > 1. It now seems that many children thought to be allergic to peanuts, actually may not be. Full article [here](http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/03/health/03well.html) > > 2. It also appears that doctor’s policies may actually have lead to an increase in true peanut allergies by recommending that children not be exposed to peanuts before the age of three. A recent British study found that early exposure actually _decreased_ the risk of developing an allergy. (more info in the above linked article). > > 3. Finally, there is a hypothesis that the sterile environment in which we raise our children actually makes more susceptible to allergies and auto-immune diseases. Article [here](http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C01EFD71231F934A15752C0A96F9C8B63). Yes, I think those things do help cause allergies (plus people who themselves have severe allergies having kids as the lady in the article). But I do think that if over vaccination is affecting immune systems, these kids would also be more likely to develop these allergies. The food allergies are the ones that I personally wonder about. I have a few true food allergies as well as several foods I don’t tolerate well. I’m also allergic to just about anything airborne. When I was tested at 25 and 35 years of age, both times I was told that since severe reactions to food allergies are rather rare, no work on a treatment/cure had been done as has been done with inhalant allergies. Now 15 years later we have a bunch of kids dieing from eating a tiny bit of peanuts? But then, raising kids in a bubble and giving score of vaccinations started at about the same time, so who is to say? Again, I _really_ glad I’m not trying to raise a kid! ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/58 "2009-02-18T01:10:10Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > But then, raising kids in a bubble and giving score of vaccinations started at about the same time, so who is to say? People with facts at their disposal? Don’t forget HDTV, cellphones, CDs, the Ipod, digital cameras, widespread use of the Internet, global warming and a bazillion other lifestyle and commerce changes have occurred at about the same time as increased allergies. But yes, we should definitely blame vaccines. Vaccines are BAD! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/59 "2009-02-18T01:25:20Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Huh. It would never occur to me that a child could die from chicken pox. Was it because they got something else at the same time? Previously poor immune system? Gotta go look this up… If chicken pox gets into the lungs in can be very dangerous - as I recall, that is what happened to the guy I knew in high school - who was around seventeen when he caught chicken pox - and it tends to be more virulent when you are older.. The scabs also are conduits for secondary infections. About one child a week dies in the United States currently from chicken pox. Its a very rare thing to die from, but it does kill. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971/60 "2009-02-18T01:29:37Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > A disease doesn’t have to be deadly to be unpleasant. Why wouldn’t you want to avoid an illness if you possibly could? Because I’m leery of the effects that vaccinations have on the immune system. So those diseases that I’m not likely to get very sick from (might less die) I don’t get vaccinated for, such as the multiple sorts of flus. Never get the shot, never get the flu even tho I supposed to be one of the high risk sorts. > [@](#): > > Cite? For which one? That food allergies (for example) are on the rise, or that more and more mothers are spending way too much energy on sterilizing their childrens’ environments? > [@](#): > > Which vaccines do you think unnecessary and why? For humans I have no idea because I haven’t really looked into exactly what is being given to kids these days or how likely it is that any child living with me would actually contract any of those diseases. After reading some of the articles on the chickenpox vaccine, I’d say I might have a problem with that one. > [@](#): > > Considering that many of the illnesses we vaccinate against are contagious let me say that I’m grateful you’re not a mom. Yes, I’m well aware that theories that are different than mainstream are not really tolerated in here. :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > Either your pediatrician says you shouldn’t vaccinate for medical reasons so you don’t . . . or you vaccinate. > > What “middle ground” is there? Not doing them all, not doing them as frequently, not doing so many at once, using titers (if those exist in humans). Definitely not just following a pediatricians advice blindly. And I’m sorry, I just ignored the rest of what you posted as it appeared to just be bordering on hysterical mom-ism. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/b-interested-observer-b-and-other-vaccine-disinformers-argh/485971.md?page=4)