# Baby It's Cold Outside - date rapey? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 12, 2016, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546 "2016-12-12T20:04:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2016, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/101 "2016-12-14T05:14:08Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > He is a she. :rolleyes: Like I can fucking tell from the name. Nice rolleyes.:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2016, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/102 "2016-12-14T08:25:53Z")
> [@Maurie](#): > > I honestly can’t think of a single song (played unedited on mainstream radio, in shopping malls, etc) that fits that bill. Do you have an example? Rap is wildly popular, it’s played on multiple media. The fact that some stations censor it doesn’t mean it’s not out there. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2016, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/103 "2016-12-14T13:20:35Z")
> [@lazybratsche](#): > > If you get a no, or even just a lack of enthusiasm with whatever sexytimes you proposed? Back off, be a decent human being, and if you’re really desperate to get your rocks off, find a willing partner. If you’re particularly interested in someone that turned you down? You can still be friends with them, and hope that they change their mind, as long as you aren’t a creepy and entitled “nice guy” about it. Sure - but if the “No” was less than emphatic, is there any set time when the guy can broach the subject again? Next date? Later that night? Is it always impermissible to rephrase the proposal? Or present another argument in support? In my experience (also shy and clueless in matters romantic), at least occasionally “No” actually meant, “Not right now,” “Not yet,” “Not that particular thing,” or many other messages. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/104 "2016-12-15T03:25:58Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > Here’s a funny attempt to make it a little less creepy to modern sensibilities: [https://youtu.be/ZSf6DughV3A](https://youtu.be/ZSf6DughV3A) > > _I really can’t stay_ > Baby, I’m fine with that > _I’ve got to go 'way_ > Baby I’m cool with that > … > _I wish I new how to break this spell_ > I don’t know what you’re talking about > … > _The neighbors might think_ > That you’re a real nice girl > _Say, what’s in this drink?_ > Pomegranate La Croix This version is terrible. It leaves the impression that the man just isn’t into the woman at all and can’t wait for her to leave. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/105 "2016-12-15T05:38:57Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > But the thing is, everything happening in the song is innocent today, just as it was in 1944. People flirt. Women act coy, not because they’re afraid but because they’re having fun with it. This is okay. This is stuff that many healthy adults do as part of the mating game. Well, there’s the disconnect. Because that is just not really true. I’m not saying that games aren’t played or that women don’t play coy at times\*. But the situation in this song would not happen today. Bringing up wanting to leave so often sounds off. But, probably most strikingly, people just don’t joke about there being stuff in someone’s drink. That shit is taken seriously. It would kill the mood. at the very least. I don’t know why this is so complicated. The song isn’t rapey in its time period, but it sounds more so today due to changing mores and a lack of appreciation for the cultural context. Both of these are easily proven: the fact that this topic comes up shows it sounds bad in a modern context. And the fact that everyone understood it just fine and can provide a perfectly cogent explanation shows it wasn’t so regarded in its time. Yeah, that’s more nuanced than “Yes it’s date-rapey” or “No, it’s not, (and how dare you think so!).” But that’s the answer. \*Examples: In college, one girl would talk all about her boyfriend, but then she’d regularly call me over to cuddle in bed with her, and give her back massages she would then brag about the next day. Or another girl who was always touching me, sitting on my lap, giving long hugs, kissing me on the cheek, sitting way too close, etc–all the while telling me about her boyfriend of the week. And I know for sure this one liked me, since she got drunk one night on Facebook and told me, years later. And, yes, I did bring these up so I wouldn’t get people acting like I’ve never been out of the house and thus couldn’t possibly know what I’m talking about. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 7:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/106 "2016-12-15T07:53:05Z")
My boo yesterday asked if I put something in her drink. I answered in the affirmative. She hit me but she drank it. 😛 The extent people joke about stuff is determined by the nature of the relationship. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/107 "2016-12-15T13:28:04Z")
Thanks **madsir**. Woulda shocked me to hear than no one has ever joked about roofies. Some way no one ever joked about a Mickey Finn. ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanub/32/132_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUB)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/108 "2016-12-15T14:02:45Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Well, there’s the disconnect. Because that is just not really true. > > I’m not saying that games aren’t played or that women don’t play coy at times\*. But the situation in this song would not happen today. Bringing up wanting to leave so often sounds off. But, probably most strikingly, people just don’t joke about there being stuff in someone’s drink. That shit is taken seriously. It would kill the mood. at the very least. > > I don’t know why this is so complicated. The song isn’t rapey in its time period, but it sounds more so today due to changing mores and a lack of appreciation for the cultural context. > > Both of these are easily proven: the fact that this topic comes up shows it sounds bad in a modern context. And the fact that everyone understood it just fine and can provide a perfectly cogent explanation shows it wasn’t so regarded in its time. > > Yeah, that’s more nuanced than “Yes it’s date-rapey” or “No, it’s not, (and how dare you think so!).” But that’s the answer. > > \*Examples: > > In college, one girl would talk all about her boyfriend, but then she’d regularly call me over to cuddle in bed with her, and give her back massages she would then brag about the next day. > > Or another girl who was always touching me, sitting on my lap, giving long hugs, kissing me on the cheek, sitting way too close, etc–all the while telling me about her boyfriend of the week. And I know for sure this one liked me, since she got drunk one night on Facebook and told me, years later. > > And, yes, I did bring these up so I wouldn’t get people acting like I’ve never been out of the house and thus couldn’t possibly know what I’m talking about. We’ll just have to agree to disagree, no big whoop, but what does your having spent your college years in the Friend Zone have to do with any of this? ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/109 "2016-12-15T14:21:36Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > This version is terrible. It leaves the impression that the man just isn’t into the woman at all and can’t wait for her to leave. Bah, you’re trying to listen to it like the original. Think of it as a novelty song. It’s funny exactly because the man’s responses are so over-the-top earnest, and because it really does seem like the woman would rather stay but the man is not playing along, so she winds up at the end out in the freezing cold. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/110 "2016-12-15T14:40:21Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Thanks **madsir**. Woulda shocked me to hear than no one has ever joked about roofies. Some way no one ever joked about a Mickey Finn. It wasn’t roofies. We were at Starbucks she was chatting with a male friend. She was drinking iced tea. Her: Get me a refill Me: Yes D Bring back refill Her: Did you spit in it? Me: Spit? No…think lower… She laughs and smacks. She has a feisty sense if humor. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/111 "2016-12-15T14:50:19Z")
> [@WOOKINPANUB](#): > > We’ll just have to agree to disagree, no big whoop Pretty much this. If someone insists that when they squint and tilt their head, they see something then I guess they see it. But I can’t share that opinion and have other things to do than squint at songs to find something to be potentially offended by. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/112 "2016-12-15T15:05:34Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > But, probably most strikingly, people just don’t joke about there being stuff in someone’s drink. The song certainly didn’t. Didn’t joke about it, didn’t allude to it, didn’t suggest it. It’s only modern perspectives based on totally different situations that are prone to think that way. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/113 "2016-12-15T19:16:32Z")
> [@WOOKINPANUB](#): > > We’ll just have to agree to disagree, no big whoop, but what does your having spent your college years in the Friend Zone have to do with any of this? Apparently it was very important for us to know this about him. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/114 "2016-12-15T19:23:40Z")
> [@Gary\_T](#): > > The song certainly didn’t. Didn’t joke about it, didn’t allude to it, didn’t suggest it. It’s only modern perspectives based on totally different situations that are prone to think that way. Yep. And this song was written in 1940 something? Geez people, thats like 4 or 5 cultural generations ago! A measly 2 or so cultural generations ago, the movie 16 candles had one “hero” getting his target woman passed out drunk and scoring some well deserved sex. The music video for “Putting on the Ritz” had people in black face for Pete’s sake. ---
**Author:** ![psychobunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/54ee81/32.png) [@psychobunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/psychobunny)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2016, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/115 "2016-12-16T02:14:52Z")
Let’s face it-the song is hopelessly dated. “No cabs to be had out there” just wouldn’t work in this day and age. He has to know that if she really wanted to go she’d get an Uber. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2016, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/116 "2016-12-16T03:22:47Z")
> [@Maurie](#): > > I honestly can’t think of a single song (played unedited on mainstream radio, in shopping malls, etc) that fits that bill. Do you have an example? [Here you go](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hhu-OyHqZM). ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2016, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/117 "2016-12-16T04:54:13Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > Bah, you’re trying to listen to it like the original. Think of it as a novelty song. It’s funny exactly because the man’s responses are so over-the-top earnest, and because it really does seem like the woman would rather stay but the man is not playing along, so she winds up at the end out in the freezing cold. I think of the original as a novelty song. This soulless version lacks any of the charm the original had. I’ve heard a lot of versions of the original but this is the first one I just thought was terrible. ---
**Author:** ![turner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/22d042/32.png) [@turner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/turner)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2016, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/118 "2016-12-16T22:07:43Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Today’s PC crowd make it sound like people are expected to go out on dates, go back to someone’s apartment and the following happens: > > Man: “My dear, would you like to engage in coitus?” > Woman: “Why, indeed I do! Let me fellate you with great alacrity first!” > \ I agree and this is OUTSTANDING! ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2016, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/119 "2016-12-17T01:21:28Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > **Deck the Halls** is about some homosexual named Donald? 😉 I actually had to go through the song to get what the hell you were talkin about willis. :smack: On topic, awful song, but I think the critics are reading too much into it and it says more about them than the song. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546/120 "2016-12-19T20:50:36Z")
> [@WOOKINPANUB](#): > > whatever pussified (yep, I said it) version “Pussified” version? Is that one where the “aw, c’mon, stay” character a woman who hopes to convince the “no, I gotta go” character to try a bit of lesbian experimentation? 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baby-its-cold-outside-date-rapey/774546.md?page=5)