# Bad things our heroes did that no one ever found out about **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 3, 2023, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989 "2023-08-03T04:35:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/21 "2023-08-04T02:38:47Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Xander: “Willow says ‘Go get them!’” “Kick his ass!” ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/22 "2023-08-04T02:44:00Z")
George MacDonald Fraser’s _Flashman_ novels is basically just a constant stream of this. The entire conceit of the series is that Harry Flashman is a coward, thief, murderer, and worse, but through luck and sheer chutzpah, is considered one of the greatest heroes of the British Empire. ---
**Author:** ![peccavi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peccavi/32/388_2.png) [@peccavi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peccavi)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/23 "2023-08-04T03:04:24Z")
There’s this classic from **Commando** : **Matrix:** Remember, Sully, when I promised to kill you last? **Sully:** That’s right, Matrix. You did. **Matrix:** I lied. _(drops him off a cliff)_ Unless this exchange later counts as someone else finding out: **Cindy:** What happened to Sully? **Matrix:** I let him go. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 10:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/24 "2023-08-04T10:11:32Z")
> [@Pavelb1](#): > > On New Battlestar Galactica, Gaius Baltar gave a nuke to a Cylon who used it to kill thousands. No one ever found out. Is he really a hero? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/25 "2023-08-04T10:21:52Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Xander’s lie was apparently hugely controversial in fandom - to the point that if you google “Xander’s lie” with no other info, you’ll get a lot of Buffy discussions/fan fiction/etc. By contrast, Giles killing Ben in cold blood after Buffy spares the guy tends to be — less controversial. ---
**Author:** ![zbuzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zbuzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zbuzz)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/26 "2023-08-04T10:29:44Z")
Insofar as he’s a hero, Don Draper’s lack of sentimentality or empathy caused two people on two separate occasions to hang themselves. ---
**Author:** ![bibliophage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bibliophage/32/7615_2.png) [@bibliophage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bibliophage)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/27 "2023-08-04T11:16:46Z")
On _Orphan Black_ Alison lets her neighbor Aynsley die when her scarf gets caught in the garbage disposal. I can’t remember if anybody ever found out. Of course Alison isn’t exactly a hero, but more of an antihero. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/28 "2023-08-04T12:07:11Z")
In C.S. Forester’s novel _Lieutenant Hornblower_, the insane captain Sawyer, who is paranoid about mutiny, and mistreats his officers severely (while indulging the crew) drives those very officers to mutiny in sheer self-preservation. In the course of trying to catch the mutinous officers plotting, he rouses his faithful among the crew to try to surround them, but the officers split up and escape. Sawyer himself ends up falling through a hatchway and being severely injured and unconscious. He later wakes up in a delirious state. It’s pretty clear from the dialogue and actions of the other officers that they believe that Hornblower pushed Sawyer down the hatchway, and they repeatedly ask him to tell them the truth about that night, but Hornblower refuses to talk about it, and never confesses, saying that the captain must have overbalanced or been precipitated in by the roll of the ship. So did heroic Hornblower actively severely injure the captain or not? As the thread title says, no one ever found out about it. But years later C. Northcote Parkinson wrote _The Life and Times of Horatio Hornblower_ in which he unequivocally states that Hornblower did it, and, in fact, he called the mutinous gathering in order to lure Captain Sawyer into a trap. Even more, he actually murdered the Captain , who was tied down in his bunk, during an action to retake the ship from prisoners who had rioted, blaming the prisoners for the act. (It’s remarked in Forester’s novel that it was odd that they would have this killed a restrained man). Parkinson was not writing authoritatively, and had no license from the Forester estate to add to the mythos, but it looks as if he was merely stating outright what Forester was heavily winking at but not explicitly stating. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/29 "2023-08-04T16:28:41Z")
> [@zbuzz](#): > > Is he really a hero? Yeah, that’s pretty firmly in the category of “bad thing a villain did”. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/30 "2023-08-04T16:36:15Z")
For your further medical critique [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/aViUuRvaCZ8/hqdefault.jpg "ER R Greene lets gunman die in elevator") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aViUuRvaCZ8) ---
**Author:** ![Nars\_Glinley](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nars_glinley/32/8177_2.png) [@Nars\_Glinley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nars_Glinley)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/31 "2023-08-04T16:40:40Z")
I’m certainly no ER doctor but I would expect that the readout would change if the patient were actually being shocked. ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/32 "2023-08-04T16:49:39Z")
Didn’t TV Superman fly somebody to a frozen mountaintop and leave them to their fate? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/33 "2023-08-04T17:28:57Z")
Remember _ **Crime Story** _, which was great in its first season and sucked in its second? Tough cop Mike Torello (Dennis Farina) turned a bad guy he had in custody over to the Mafia for their own brand of justice. That episode ended with Torello and the Mob boss exchanging knowing glances. (“I won’t tell if you won’t.”) ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/34 "2023-08-04T17:34:56Z")
Frank Nitti certainly rued the day he taunted Kevin Costner’s Eliot Ness. ---
**Author:** ![Pavelb1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/439d5e/32.png) [@Pavelb1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pavelb1)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/35 "2023-08-04T18:17:40Z")
We could fill a hundred pages with the trope of “Taunted themselves into a worse spot” ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/36 "2023-08-04T18:23:14Z")
Exactly what I came in here to mention. I even started a thread a million years ago with a title that would not make sense if you didn’t know what I was talking about, which is how I generally go about life and that’s why people think I’m crazy. Something like 'Did Horny throw crazy Sawyer into the hole?" ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/37 "2023-08-04T18:30:27Z")
Correct, there would be a spike on the rhythm strip for each defib, and as noted before, he wouldn’t be conscious. I’ve seen people go in and out of that rhythm, and it really is like a light switch. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/38 "2023-08-04T18:51:24Z")
> [@Pavelb1](#): > > We could fill a hundred pages with the trope of “Taunted themselves into a worse spot” Right, but in this particular case, no one saw what happened next. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/39 "2023-08-04T22:13:22Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > By contrast, Giles killing Ben in cold blood after Buffy spares the guy tends to be — less controversial. I don’t think anyone ever found out about that, either. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2023, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/40 "2023-08-04T22:24:11Z")
> [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](#): > > Didn’t TV Superman fly somebody to a frozen mountaintop and leave them to their fate? IIRC, he didn’t so much Leave Them To Their Fate as Leave Them With Ample Supplies At The Cabin, While Explaining That He’d Return, And, Hey, Bear In Mind That You’re Hearing This From, Y’know, Superman — but, after he left, they eventually figured, nah, let’s try our luck at climbing down. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989.md?page=3)