# Bad things our heroes did that no one ever found out about **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 3, 2023, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989 "2023-08-03T04:35:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/41 "2023-08-05T00:34:36Z")
There’s one episode in ST:TOS where Kirk beams down with some crewmembers, then returns to the ship and goes many light years away to deal with a threat. The crewmembers are abandoned on the planet. ---
**Author:** ![Digger11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@Digger11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Digger11)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/42 "2023-08-05T00:42:51Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Is it wrong for Poirot to keep the secret of who the killers were in Murder on the Orient Express? Mind you, I just realized tons of characters do know about that since he discussed it with the murderers. > > I believe Sherlock Holmes did the same at least once when the victim was atrocious. Holmes doesn’t count, since his chronicler long ago published the information. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/43 "2023-08-05T00:44:21Z")
> [@Digger11](#): > > Holmes doesn’t count, since his chronicler long ago published the information. Yes, and these are bad things at least someone knows about, including the chronicler and everyone else involved in the crime. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/44 "2023-08-05T01:25:21Z")
Fine, this one is borderline, but I think it counts. Speaking of ST:TOS, In Requiem for Methuselah, Spock uses his psionic gifts to force Kirk to forget his love of Reyna. Sure, he’s doing it for good reason, or at least that’s the excuse, but it’s still non-consensual mind alteration. I pick this because Kirk and others are normally open with their actions, and while everyone knows Kirk plays fast and loose with the rules, Spock is generally different. ---
**Author:** ![dorvann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df705f/32.png) [@dorvann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dorvann)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/45 "2023-08-05T02:23:42Z")
Something that almost happened: In the Star Trek: The Next Generation episode “The Most Toys” --Data is beamed out just as he was firing a disruptor at the episode’s villain Kivas Fajo. When Data is back onboard the Enterprise Commander Riker asks why his disruptor was discharging, and Data suggests that something may have happened during transport. From the dialogue right before he was beamed out Data was definitely intent on killing Fajo. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/46 "2023-08-05T02:36:12Z")
After the Prometheus encounter in which Dukhat was killed by the orders of the paranoid and trigger-happy Captain Jankowski, Delenn gave the deciding vote, “Kill them [the humans]! Kill them all! No mercy!” She soon realized that genocide was not what Dukhat would have wanted, but it was a long, hard struggle to turn the runaway Minbari Federation from its course. ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/47 "2023-08-05T02:58:09Z")
> [@dorvann](#): > > From the dialogue right before he was beamed out Data was definitely intent on killing Fajo. Ted Cassady voice/“THAT was the equation”/TCvoice ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/48 "2023-08-05T03:26:53Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > The entire conceit of the series is that Harry Flashman is a coward, thief, murderer, and worse, but through luck and sheer chutzpah, is considered one of the greatest heroes of the British Empire. Ditto Ciaphas Cain in the Warhammer 40k novels by Sandy Mitchell. Cain is an abject coward whose goal is to do the bare minimum required of him to avoid getting killed in combat, fragged by his own soldiers, or executed for dereliction of duty, but invariably manages to fail upwards and save the Empire over and over again while just trying to not die. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/49 "2023-08-05T11:45:24Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > Speaking of ST:TOS, In Requiem for Methuselah, Spock uses his psionic gifts to force Kirk to forget his love of Reyna. Sure, he’s doing it for good reason, or at least that’s the excuse, but it’s still non-consensual mind alteration Yeah. I was goingvto mention that one. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/50 "2023-08-05T12:05:06Z")
> [@peccavi](#): > > There’s this classic from **Commando** : > > **Matrix:** Remember, Sully, when I promised to kill you last? > **Sully:** That’s right, Matrix. You did. > **Matrix:** I lied. _(drops him off a cliff)_ > > Unless this exchange later counts as someone else finding out: > > **Cindy:** What happened to Sully? > **Matrix:** I let him go. What about his “friend” on the plane who was “dead tired”? I don’t think “no one” ever found out. General Kirby may have covered it up from the general public, but I’m pretty sure he was able to put two and two together by following a trail of dead mooks who worked for that drug lord. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/51 "2023-08-05T14:36:36Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > > [@ParallelLines](#): > > > > Speaking of ST:TOS, In Requiem for Methuselah, Spock uses his psionic gifts to force Kirk to forget his love of Reyna. Sure, he’s doing it for good reason, or at least that’s the excuse, but it’s still non-consensual mind alteration > > Yeah. I was goingvto mention that one. There is not even a good reason for it. Everybody knows that Kirk really loves only his ship. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/52 "2023-08-05T14:56:59Z")
Mal once kicked a guy into the engine of his ship… I guess the bad guys found out. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/53 "2023-08-05T15:33:13Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > There is not even a good reason for it. Everybody knows that Kirk really loves only his ship. We can argue (easily!) about Kirk’s actual ability to love things other than his role, his life as a ship captain, and his ship (IMHO in that order, so he loves his ship most in terms of how it defines him, he loves himself the most) until right before the sun burns out. I would argue however, that _Spock_ honestly believes Kirk is truly suffering, and that McCoy did as well. Thus, from the POV of the person committing the ‘bad thing’ he may well feel justified. But a point of this thread is that many of the heroes and anti-heroes feel justified in the bad things done - but not enough in most cases to ever admit to doing them. Now for my nitpick - Delenn’s actions that inflamed the Earth-Mimbarri conflict were known by the Gray Council. So I don’t think it quite counts, although according to JMS, she never told Sheridan (and presumably any _other_ human) so I could see it as a specific subset of the OP. In much the same way that later on, it appeared that after telling the Mimbari to end the war, none of _them_ were told why they ended the War. Leading to much of the later caste conflict. But the nitpick remains, a closely held secret kept by a small group isn’t “No one ever found out about.” ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2023, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989/54 "2023-08-05T18:01:21Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > In a season 7 episode, Buffy throws that statement back at _Willow_ who is understandably confused, but the danger of the day was so important that they moved onto other topics The episode was “Selfless” Relevant dialogue > BUFFY > > And Anya did! She chose to become a demon. Twice. > > XANDER > > You have no idea what she’s going through. > > BUFFY > > (stands) I don’t care what she’s going through! > > XANDER > > No, of course not. You think we haven’t seen all this before? The part where you just cut us all out. Just step away from everything human and act like you’re the law. If you knew what I felt— > > BUFFY > > I killed Angel! Do you even remember that? I would have given up everything I had to be with— I loved him more than I will ever love anything in this life. And I put a sword through his heart because I had to. > > WILLOW > > And that all worked out OK. > > BUFFY > > **Do you remember cheering me on? Both of you. Do you remember giving me Willow’s message: Kick his ass.** > > WILLOW > > I never said that— > > XANDER > > This is different— [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bad-things-our-heroes-did-that-no-one-ever-found-out-about/987989.md?page=2)