# Bagpipe Horror Stories - Qadgop, is it possible? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 22, 2002, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165 "2002-09-22T19:54:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/1 "2002-09-22T19:54:03Z")
So I was at my bagpipe lesson yesterday, piping away with my instructor eyeing me critically, making comments on the reed, the tune, etc. Suddenly he says: “Don’t stand with your feet apart. Always stand with them together.” Innocently, I say: “Why? does it look better?” “No,” says he, matter-of-factly. “If you pipe with your feet apart, you can rupture yourself.” So now I have yet another thing to think about while playing the pipes. In addition to trying to memorise the tune, keep my fingers working, blowing rythmically and squeezing the bag, I have to keep my feet together to avoid a hernia? I’m starting to think they’re the Devil’s own instrument. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/2 "2002-09-22T19:58:58Z")
“Some men there are love not a gaping pig; Some, that are mad if they behold a cat; And others, when the bagpipe sings i’ the nose, Cannot contain their urine.” Merchant of Venice, Act IV, Scene 1 ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/3 "2002-09-22T20:15:06Z")
Oh, my dear, you have NO IDEA of the scope of the obscene possibilities that ran through my head while I waited for your thread to load… 😃 And, oddly enough, Googling the unlikely search string of “causes hernia wind instrument” did turn up something. [http://www.alextech.demon.co.uk/wac2023.htm](http://www.alextech.demon.co.uk/wac2023.htm) > [@](#): > > An example of this is a trumpet player who was suffering from pain and tension in the abdomen. In fact he was generating so much tension in his lower abdomen that he was at risk of giving himself a hernia. It transpired that he was attempting to carry out instructions given to him by a teacher many years earlier with regard to breathing. However, in his attempts to find abdominal breathing and support he was actually pushing, with as much force as he could muster, down onto the pelvic floor. “Trumpeter hernia”. Although he’s actually a sax player. [http://jazzinstituteofchicago.org/index.asp?target=/jazzgram/people/sullivan.asp](http://jazzinstituteofchicago.org/index.asp?target=/jazzgram/people/sullivan.asp) > [@](#): > > Accompanying Ira Sullivan > > by Kenny Fredrickson > > The author, a pianist, is a Chicagoan who worked with many of the big names in jazz during the '50s and '60s. > > \< snip \> > > One night his featured tenor man, Haig Chitjian, trying to emulate Illinois Jacquet, blew so hard (at the chicks in the audience) that he sustained a hernia which curtailed his career (but had no effect on his love life). > > \< snip \> > > Although there are certainly scores of unpublishable Haig Chitjian anecdotes, here are some that might be repeated. > > Rather than face hernia surgery (which terrified him), Haig began inserting an unopened package of Marlboro cigarettes (hard box) between his belt buckle and his stomach whenever playing the saxophone. The story he told people was that it kept him from exploding during his solos. So, hernias. [http://www.lebanonhealth.com/condi/364.htm](http://www.lebanonhealth.com/condi/364.htm) > [@](#): > > In an inguinal hernia, the intestine or the bladder protrudes through the abdominal wall or into the inguinal canal, in the groin. About 80 percent of all hernias are inguinal, and most occur in men because of a natural weakness in this area. > > In an incisional hernia, the intestines push through the abdominal wall at the site of previous abdominal surgery. This type is most common in elderly and overweight people who are inactive after abdominal surgery. > > A femoral hernia occurs when the bladder or intestine enters the canal carrying the femoral artery into the upper thigh. Femoral hernias are most common in women, especially those who are pregnant or obese (see Obesity). > > In an umbilical hernia, part of the small intestine passes through the abdominal wall near the navel. Common in newborns, it also often afflicts obese women or those who have had many children. > > Causes > > Ultimately, all hernias are caused by a combination of weakness of a muscle or fascia and strain: A weak spot in the muscle tears under the pressure of strain, and an internal organ or tissue then pushes through the tear. Sometimes the muscle weakness is present at birth; more often, it occurs later in life. Poor nutrition, smoking and overexertion all can weaken muscles and make hernias more likely. Anything that causes muscle strain (see Sprains and Strains) can then induce hernia, including obesity, lifting heavy objects, diarrhea or constipation, or persistent coughing. And I looked up “hernias bagpipes” and found this. [http://www.wspd.wellington.net.nz/pipebands/ergoharness.htm](http://www.wspd.wellington.net.nz/pipebands/ergoharness.htm) > [@](#): > > Optional waist-belt corset to prevent hernias when playing that special “big reed” - helps acheive a military bearing too! After looking at it for a while, I have to believe it’s serious, although the whole page reads like one of those Kinky Sex Toy pages. > [@](#): > > Is slippage taking the fun out of your piping? WSPD’s new bagpipe harness “puts the weight on your shoulders”! Or maybe it’s just me… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/4 "2002-09-22T20:24:38Z")
Yes, you can hurt yourself playing bagpipes. Some years ago, a pipe major in the Chicago area herniated his _diaphragm_ while in concert. He more or less fell over as if pole-axed and started turning various shades of blue. Mouth-to-mouth and variations kept him alive long enough to make it to the operating room and emergency surgery. Granted, this is an exceedingly rare complication. Even so, the man in question managed a repeat performance of the hernia several years later in very similar conditions. At which point his surgeon suggested he play a somewhat softer reed and maybe slow down a bit. Much more likely is the traditional groin-based hernia, but don’t exaggerate the dangers… the vast majority of pipers do NOT suffer from hernias. Take reasonable precautions, and if something does give way, see a doctor, OK? ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2002, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/5 "2002-09-22T20:52:54Z")
Typists are more prone to carpal tunnel syndrome. Pitchers are more prone to rotator cuff injuries. So it’s not surprising that baggers would be more prone to complications stemming from chronic elevation of abdominal and pelvic pressure (or valsavaing). Art extracts its price. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![happyheathen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5e925/32.png) [@happyheathen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/happyheathen)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/6 "2002-09-23T01:40:50Z")
Pipers are smitten for playing? might have to start believing after all 😃 ---
**Author:** ![DAVEW0071](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e19b73/32.png) [@DAVEW0071](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DAVEW0071)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/7 "2002-09-23T02:28:45Z")
Other physiological changes can occur, as well. I was friends with a piper for a number of years. He was very tall and thin. Over six feet and probably had only a 30 inch waist, if that. But he had a size 18 neck. Said it was from piping. Had a helluva time buying shirts. ---
**Author:** ![yabob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yabob/32/2821_2.png) [@yabob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yabob)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/8 "2002-09-23T02:42:18Z")
Other problems: Bagpipes and other wind instruments have traditionally been viewed as therapeutic for asthma and other respiratory conditions. But an American lung disease expert claims the bags are breeding grounds for microorganisms that lead to infections, chiefly because of the glycerine and honey used to cure them: [http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/scotland/900016.stm](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/scotland/900016.stm) > [@](#): > > Robert Sataloff says people who take up the instrument are more prone to infections and to developing large stomachs. > > … > > The academic explained: "They are more likely to have an hour-glass belly in which they develop funny-shaped distended stomachs filled with the air from playing the instrument. > > "Bagpipe players can make awful funny noises - you tend to know when you are standing next to someone who plays. Methinks the good doctor just doesn’t like bagpipes … ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/9 "2002-09-23T14:16:54Z")
Methinks the good doctor is talking through his hat. > [@](#): > > An American lung disease expert…Robert Sataloff…who works at the Thomas Jefferson University Hospital in Philadelphia… Well, yeah, he works there, but he’s not a “lung disease expert”–he’s an Ear, Nose and Throat man. [Hospital bio.](http://www.jeffersonhospital.org/e3front.dll?durki=3867&methdGt=1&step=1&gwyLnk=http://cgi.photobooks.com/scripts/troll.cgi?dbase=tjuh&loa=N&page=2&lastname=sataloff&pict_id=0008050&search_url=http://tjuh.photobooks.com) > [@](#): > > Specialties: > Otolaryngology-Head & Neck Surgery > Otolaryngology-Head & Neck Surgery - Neurotology > > Board Certifications: > Otolaryngology > > Dr. Sataloff has a focus on the nervous system as it relates to the ear and on conditions of the voice. A “lung disease specialist” would be a “pulmonary specialist” or a “pulmonologist”. Methinks the good doctor just doesn’t care for the pipes. Interesting to speculate on why he’s got a blurb on the Beeb. Maybe a journalist called him up, maybe to follow up on something he’d heard him quoted as saying at a conference, and he was happy to oblige, and the article sounds better if it’s an “American lung disease expert” than if it’s an “American ear/nose/throat expert who has an opinion about something that’s out of his field.” Or maybe the journalist just misunderstood Bob when he introduced himself. We may never know… And apparently he’s the only doctor on the entire Internet who has perceived this problem. Googling things like “lung infection bagpipes” isn’t turning up anything. Anyway, Piper, pipe away–methinks Doctor Bob is a nit. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/10 "2002-09-23T14:22:14Z")
And…just for the heckuvit, I Googled “bagpipes horror” and up came [The Clue of the Whistling Bagpipes by Carolyn Keene](http://collectbooks.about.com/library/priceguide/child/ckeene/blbagpipes.htm). Nancy Drew! " :eek: " Heh. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![yabob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yabob/32/2821_2.png) [@yabob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yabob)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2002, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/11 "2002-09-23T15:09:38Z")
Thanks for digging up the guy’s actual qualifications. The reason I went looking around for the story was that I heard a similar thing on some TV documentary (they had to impart the information accompanied by footage of a set of bagpipes comically deflating and squealing, of course). I don’t know if he would be the source of the TV story, too - I wouldn’t doubt it. ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2002, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/12 "2002-09-25T11:22:30Z")
FWIW, I don’t know a tuba player that doesn’t have a hiatal hernia. (Including myself.) Coincidence? I bet not. Most brass players I know have them as well, I suspect it’s the price we pay as wind instrumentalists. your humble TubaDiva ---
**Author:** ![RiverRunner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/977dab/32.png) [@RiverRunner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RiverRunner)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2002, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/13 "2002-09-25T14:33:26Z")
Just had to butt in: **Bagpipe Hernias** = band name! I love bagpipe music. You may now return to your regularly scheduled thread. RR ---
**Author:** ![7string](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/7/8baadc/32.png) [@7string](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/7string)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2002, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/14 "2002-09-25T16:26:18Z")
Welcome to hell’s symphony! Here are your bagpipes. Please stand between the banjos and the accordians. ---
**Author:** ![7string](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/7/8baadc/32.png) [@7string](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/7string)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2002, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/15 "2002-09-25T16:34:51Z")
Welcome to hell’s symphony! Here are your bagpipes. Please stand between the banjos and the accordians. Oh, TubaDiva, a Tuba is a brass instrument. Not a wind instrument which typically contains reeds. Unless they’ve greatly changed the tuba and didn’t tell me. They really are supposed to clear all of those things through me 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2002, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/16 "2002-09-25T17:45:42Z")
I may have missed it, but was the original question answered regarding the effectiveness of preventing a hernia by standing with your legs together as opposed to legs apart? ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2002, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/17 "2002-09-25T17:55:29Z")
[HIJACK] > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by 7string \* > **Oh, TubaDiva, a Tuba is a brass instrument. Not a wind instrument which typically contains reeds. Unless they’ve greatly changed the tuba and didn’t tell me.** :smack: Your pompous presumption notwithstanding, apparently someone has neglected to tell you several things about the nature of wind instruments, or you neglected to listen. While there are people who refer to the woodwinds specifically as “winds,” through shortening of the name, brass instruments are _also_ wind instruments in that wind (breathing) is the foundation of sound production for both kinds of instruments. “Brass” referring to instruments is actually short for “brasswind.” Thus “woodwind” and “brasswind”; i.e. both wind instruments. For some reason, in English people rarely say “brasswind” anymore, but some still do. Do a google search on brasswind and see how many pages you find. This is why a “wind ensemble” contains brass instruments. And why a “wind quintet” contains a horn (“French” horn to English speakers if you want another misnomer). Why the short name for “woodwinds” is “winds” instead of “wood” (thus not following the manner for brass instruments) is a mystery to me. Note that the flute has no reed, but is both a wind instrument and a woodwind. Most flutes today are made of metal, but in their historical origin they were made of wood. The term woodwind originally referred to the construction of this instrument, not the existence of a reed. Recorders also have no reeds, but are wind instruments (and woodwinds). Saxophones are made of metal, but are called woodwinds because of the reed; this is because saxophones are a much more recent development than the other woodwinds. Student model woodwinds are sometimes made of plastic or polypropylene. Musicians are not necessarily consistent. I hope this clears things up. Knorf (a professional bassoonist) [/HIJACK] ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2002, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/18 "2002-09-25T18:05:32Z")
As long as people are gaggling in their astonishment regarding the misfortune of hernias among performers of wind instruments, I’ll add that hernias are a not infrequent problem for oboists and bassoonists as well, due to the large backpressure from blowing into the tiny aperture of the reed. It’s worse for oboists than bassoonists. Knorf ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2002, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/19 "2002-09-25T18:48:02Z")
And while we’re at it on the terminology, sousaphones are often made of fiberglass, but called “brass” nonetheless. And while we’re on the subject of tubas, cornets, French horns, and euphonia are strictly speaking considered tubas, as they are conically bored, and what most folks call a tuba is properly a bass tuba. By the way, Ms. Diva, I’ve never had a hernia, but I only played for eight years (and not at all in the past three). I’ve really got to get myself my own horn one of these days… ---
**Author:** ![7string](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/7/8baadc/32.png) [@7string](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/7string)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2002, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165/20 "2002-09-25T19:17:27Z")
Jeez, Knorf. I’m very sorry. I bow down to your superior intellect. What was I thinkin taking on a professional baffoonist? So, let me get this straight. It takes wind to work them thar insterments? You mean like the wind in your head? Or is it like the one coming from your ass? Though, I do admit they sound (Smell?) suspiciously similar. Now, don’t get your knickers in a knot. I’m just picking on you. Let’s see if you people that blow for a living have a sense of humor. I don’t normally use emoticons and I didn’t know the proper one for the winky graphic to show. However I did attempt to place one at the end of my post to portray a sense of goofing. Maybe you were a little light headed from blowing so much and missed it, so I’ve included one that should show the graphic. 😛 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bagpipe-horror-stories-qadgop-is-it-possible/129165.md?page=2)