# Bailed-out Wells Fargo plans Las Vegas junket **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 3, 2009, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320 "2009-02-03T22:32:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Ca3799](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9f8e36/32.png) [@Ca3799](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ca3799)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/1 "2009-02-03T22:32:58Z")
Bailed-out Wells Fargo plans Las Vegas junket Company spokesperson says event is part of the bank’s culture WASHINGTON - Wells Fargo & Co., which received $25 billion in taxpayer bailout money, is planning a series of corporate junkets to Las Vegas casinos this month. Wells Fargo, once among the nation’s top writers of subprime mortgages, has booked 12 nights at the Wynn Las Vegas and its sister hotel, the Encore Las Vegas beginning Friday, said Wynn spokeswoman Michelle Loosbrock. The hotels will host the annual conference for company’s top mortgage officers. The conference is a Wells Fargo tradition. Previous years have included all-expense-paid helicopter rides, wine tasting, horseback riding in Puerto Rico and a private Jimmy Buffett concert in the Bahamas for more than 1,000 employees and guests. “I was amazed with just how lavish it was,” said Debra Rickard, a former Wells Fargo mortgage employee from Colorado who attended the events regularly until she left the company in 2004. “We stayed in top hotels, the entertainment was just unbelievable, and there were awards — you got plaques or trophies.” While the nation’s recession has led other banks, such as Bank of America, to cancel employee recognition outings, Wells Fargo has not. “Recognition events are still part of our culture,” spokeswoman Melissa Murray said. “It’s really important that our team members are still valued and recognized.” [http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28999671/](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28999671/) Can we demand our tax money back? ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/2 "2009-02-03T22:44:06Z")
> [@Ca3799](#): > > Can we demand our tax money back? Surely its gone by now. I’d be willing to settle for some Chinese justice. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/3 "2009-02-03T23:20:12Z")
Sales Club is part of the reps bonus for last year. If you earned it, you get it. If you cancel it, the top guys will leave - and they WILL get a job elsewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/4 "2009-02-03T23:26:39Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > Sales Club is part of the reps bonus for last year. Bonus for WHAT ? For losing billions and driving the company into the ground? A deranged monkey can do that, and he won’t need a bonus. ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/5 "2009-02-03T23:28:08Z")
> [@Ca3799](#): > > Bailed-out Wells Fargo plans Las Vegas junket > Company spokesperson says event is part of the bank’s culture They need to change their “culture” then. When they can make a profit and not suck the taxpayers dry with bail-out money, they can have all the “culture” they want. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/6 "2009-02-03T23:29:09Z")
Actually Wells Fargo is one of the better more [solvent banks going](http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11572319) and has never really beenin danger of going under. They were more or less FORCED to take the $25 billion. [Cite.](http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1851140,00.html) ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/7 "2009-02-03T23:29:14Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > Sales Club is part of the reps bonus for last year. If you earned it, you get it. If you cancel it, the top guys will leave - and they WILL get a job elsewhere. Are these “top guys” really all that good? Would it be a major tragedy if these “top guys” did not get an all expense paid trip to Vegas? More importantly, do you think the “somewhere else” they would go to would offer them this perk? It seems that > [@](#): > > …the nation’s recession has led other banks, such as Bank of America, to cancel employee recognition outings… ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/8 "2009-02-03T23:30:40Z")
> [@Polerius](#): > > Bonus for WHAT ? For losing billions and driving the company into the ground? A deranged monkey can do that, and he won’t need a bonus. If this is sales club, for selling a shit load of mortages like the company told them to. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/9 "2009-02-03T23:33:46Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Are these “top guys” really all that good? Would it be a major tragedy if these “top guys” did not get an all expense paid trip to Vegas? > > More importantly, do you think the “somewhere else” they would go to would offer them this perk? It seems that Top sales guys really are that good. The top 10% is amazing. The next 30% or so gets there by just working their ass off. Again - I am assuming that this is sales club - where you get to go when you hit certain milestones (top 10% of the reps, top 5% gets a suite, top 1% comes earlier for other goodies plus tee time with the CEO). Yeah - it looks bad. However, it is also part of the reps compensation for prior year performance. Cancel it and you MIGHT have problems (depending on the employment and compensation contract). ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/10 "2009-02-03T23:35:35Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > If this is sales club, for selling a shit load of mortages like the company told them to. I would assume that you should be rewarded not based on the volume of the mortgages you sold, but also on the quality of those mortgages. If you sold NINJA mortgages to people who no-way-in-hell could afford them, costing the company billions of dollars, I don’t see how that can be bonus-worthy. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/11 "2009-02-03T23:35:51Z")
Maybe it looks bad, but it’s nothing. Wells Fargo is in good shape, it is not struggling, it is well managed, I say let it keep doing whatever they genreally do to remain successful. ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/12 "2009-02-03T23:39:13Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > Maybe it looks bad, but it’s nothing. Wells Fargo is in good shape, it is not struggling, it is well managed, I say let it keep doing whatever they genreally do to remain successful. Yeah, they’re really fucking geniuses, they _only_ lost [$2.55 billion](http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11572319?nclick_check=1) in the fourth quarter. They should keep doing what they’re doing. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/13 "2009-02-03T23:42:05Z")
> [@Polerius](#): > > Yeah, they’re really fucking geniuses, they _only_ lost [$2.55 billion](http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_11572319?nclick_check=1) in the fourth quarter. They should keep doing what they’re doing. Did you even read the story? Yep they are in such bad shape that the stock price went up 32% last week. ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/14 "2009-02-03T23:43:17Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > Did you even read the story? Yep they are in such bad shape that the stock price went up 32% today. Yes, the wisdom of investors is legendary. They never over-paid for any stock. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2009, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/15 "2009-02-03T23:53:58Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > Did you even read the story? Yep they are in such bad shape that the stock price went up 32% last week. Excellent! So if they piss away more money on Las Vegas junkets, and lose $5 billion next quarter, that will mean the stock will go up 64% WIN! ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2009, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/16 "2009-02-04T02:49:12Z")
> [@Polerius](#): > > I would assume that you should be rewarded not based on the volume of the mortgages you sold, but also on the quality of those mortgages. > > If you sold NINJA mortgages to people who no-way-in-hell could afford them, costing the company billions of dollars, I don’t see how that can be bonus-worthy. I don’t know their comp plan, but it probably pays based on amount written that is approved by the underwriters. The sales guy does not get to approve the financing, credit check, or house valuation. He simply sells the mortgage plan. The really goods ones sell a LOT of mortgages. For that, they get commission plus a chance to go to club. ---
**Author:** ![Geek\_Mecha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecae2f/32.png) [@Geek\_Mecha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Geek_Mecha)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2009, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/17 "2009-02-04T02:52:46Z")
It’s now cancelled: [http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28999671/](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28999671/) ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2009, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/18 "2009-02-04T03:25:41Z")
> [@AudreyK](#): > > It’s now cancelled: > > [http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28999671/](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28999671/) Awesome! There will come a time for these junkets again, but now, using bail-out money, is not the time. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2009, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/19 "2009-02-04T03:49:34Z")
For myself, I am hoping to build a society where salesmanship skills are not the most highly rewarded attributes. But that’s just me. And a few others. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2009, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320/20 "2009-02-04T03:59:38Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > For myself, I am hoping to build a society where salesmanship skills are not the most highly rewarded attributes. But that’s just me. And a few others. Against the wall, COMMIE! -Joe [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailed-out-wells-fargo-plans-las-vegas-junket/484320.md?page=2)