# Bailout of Cruise Lines? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Quarantine Zone\ **Tags:** covid-quarantine\ **Created:** [March 20, 2020, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888 "2020-03-20T13:10:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![MikeF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MikeF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeF)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/1 "2020-03-20T13:10:17Z")
Obviously, cruise lines are being crushed by the pandemic. Someone on the interwebs noted that many companies base in tax-friendly countries in order to avoid paying U.S. taxes. Would the U.S. consider giving taxpayer money to such companies? In principle that sounds like a bad idea but maybe there are so many jobs in the U.S. dependent on those companies is makes pragmatic sense? Especially since bailouts would have to be paid back. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/2 "2020-03-20T13:13:40Z")
It maybe made sense to bail out car companies and banks, because those are huge industries that directly and indirectly affect every aspect of our lives to a major degree. But if all of the cruise lines were to go out of business, it’d make very little difference to any other aspect of modern life. And that’s even before getting into the cruise lines’ efforts to distance themselves from Uncle Sam. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/3 "2020-03-20T13:16:03Z")
> [@MikeF](#): > > Obviously, cruise lines are being crushed by the pandemic. Someone on the interwebs noted that many companies base in tax-friendly countries in order to avoid paying U.S. taxes. Would the U.S. consider giving taxpayer money to such companies? In principle that sounds like a bad idea but maybe there are so many jobs in the U.S. dependent on those companies is makes pragmatic sense? Especially since bailouts would have to be paid back. I saw a post on Facebook that made a good point: Now that we’re at essentially a 0% interest rate, they could borrow against their ships as collateral, and probably have enough cash to weather the storm. Why bail out a non-essential industry that is sitting on a whole lot of large capital investments? See Also: Airlines, although they are more needed than cruise lines. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/4 "2020-03-20T13:20:49Z")
Cruise lines dump all of their human waste, plastic and garbage into the oceans. Ships have thousands of people on board, ALL that waste is going into the ocean. No, cruise companies should most definitely NOT be bailed out. Good riddance. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/5 "2020-03-20T13:48:28Z")
I think someone has mixed up “based in the US” and “sailing under a flag of convenience” . I didn’t look up every cruise line, but Norwegian, Royal Caribbean, Carnival and Holland America are all based in the US and presumably pay US axes. But all of their ships (except one of NCLs) are registered outside the US. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/6 "2020-03-20T14:27:28Z")
I cannot begin to imagine why we would want to bail out an industry that employs few Americans and pays little in American taxes. This is certainly a very optional industry. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/7 "2020-03-20T14:32:57Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > Cruise lines dump all of their human waste, plastic and garbage into the oceans. And this isn’t true. The cruise lines don’t have a great history but they are improving and the major cruise lines have much higher standards that they usually keep up. They’ve certainly been caught polluting and should be held accountable, but they don’t dump untreated waste into the ocean unless someone has messed up. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/8 "2020-03-20T14:50:26Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > It maybe made sense to bail out car companies and banks, because those are huge industries that directly and indirectly affect every aspect of our lives to a major degree. > > But if all of the cruise lines were to go out of business, it’d make very little difference to any other aspect of modern life. > > And that’s even before getting into the cruise lines’ efforts to distance themselves from Uncle Sam. Similarly, I could see an argument for the importance of airlines but cruises and cruise ships do not seem to be a critical part of the economy or something that needs to be supported for national interest reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/9 "2020-03-20T14:51:30Z")
The giant cruise ship business needs to die. It just spreads disease and pollution and ruins environments. One might make a case for much smaller cruise ships. ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/10 "2020-03-20T15:01:44Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > One might make a case for much smaller cruise ships. The economics of which require pricing that will appeal if not exclusively to the 1%, then perhaps to the wealthiest 3 to 5%. It’s roughly analogous to the idea of restricting jet travel to planes that carry no more than 20 passengers. (But I’ll agree that cruise line bailouts are borderline abhorrent.) ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/11 "2020-03-20T15:08:43Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > The giant cruise ship business needs to die. It just spreads disease and pollution and ruins environments. The industry is also a prime example of the kind of conspicuous overconsumption that gives creedence to the image of the “Ugly American”. No bailouts for cruise lines, fraudulent tech startups, or charter school corporations, please. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/12 "2020-03-20T15:25:42Z")
No bail out to cruise ships should be allowed for all of the reasons you guys have already stated. I do have a question though. I see that some of the ships are offering to act as hospitals. Is this a good idea or not? I know that they seem to be really bad about spreading disease, but I’m not sure why so I’m not sure what would have to be done to make this a good idea. Can someone educate me on that? ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/13 "2020-03-20T15:42:18Z")
> [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](#): > > I see that some of the ships are offering to act as hospitals. Is this a good idea or not? I know that they seem to be really bad about spreading disease, but I’m not sure why so I’m not sure what would have to be done to make this a good idea. Can someone educate me on that? There are a couple of reasons they spread disease- one is that you have a couple of thousand people on each ship and another is that they are constantly mixing with each other. And while people might stay at home if they feel a little under the weather, they don’t typically confine themselves to their room on a ship unless they are flat out sick, in part because there is little to do in the room - it’s not like you can watch Netflix on the room’s TV - so people who feel mostly OK but have a cough, a slight fever, a mild case of the runs are still going to restaurants, to shows, to the casino. Those issues won’t present a problem if the ship is used as a hospital or infirmary and people are confined to their rooms. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/14 "2020-03-20T16:18:53Z")
That’s a good idea if it can be implemented properly. When Trump announced _Mercy_ and _Comfort_ were being deployed I looked up their stats. They have 1,000 beds apiece which is better than nothing but they’re a drop in the bucket if it really gets bad. ---
**Author:** ![This\_Just\_In\_2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@This\_Just\_In\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/This_Just_In_2)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/15 "2020-03-20T16:53:50Z")
I can’t see how a cruise ship can efficiently function as a hospital - they are small cramped rooms with no space for hospital beds and equipment. Cruise lines are just offering this as a cheap PR move. If things get this bad it would be better to be in a tent in real hospital’s parking lots (access to Medical staff). If tents won’t do then a nearby gymnasium, a hotel - due to the impending lock-down there will be many spaces available with more space and access. A hospital ship has medical staff, equipment and it is designed to treat people - not scam all their money on decadence… ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/16 "2020-03-20T17:06:55Z")
The cruise ships _would_ be useful for housing homeless people who are not sick. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/17 "2020-03-20T17:10:25Z")
Cruise ships would have to be gutted and completely refitted to operate as a ‘hospital ship’, and there is really no point to this. The US Navy (and other large navies) operate hospital ships because they can be mobile and move to the location of an incident to provide direct services without having to construct a temporary hospital facility and move all of the necessary equipment and supplies on-site. This notion of using large cruise ships as ‘hospital ships’ is really nothing more than a throwback to the era before public health when contaminated ships were quarantined off shore until the crew and passengers either died or survived. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/18 "2020-03-20T17:14:25Z")
As a general rule, IMHO: Large manufacturers are first in line for any bailout money. It’s easy to replace a car dealership, it’s difficult to replace Ford. Large fleets shouldn’t be bailed out. It’s easy to replace Delta, it’s impossible to replace Boeing. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2020, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/19 "2020-03-20T17:40:20Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > Cruise lines dump all of their human waste, plastic and garbage into the oceans. Ships have thousands of people on board, ALL that waste is going into the ocean. None of this is true. > **[Cruise secrets: Where does waste from a cruise ship go?](https://www.express.co.uk/travel/cruise/1069810/cruises-cruise-ship-waste-disposal-rubbish-management)** > > CRUISES see thousands of passengers and crew take to enormous cruise ships for weeks at a time. A huge amount of waste is produced during this time - but where does it all go? Is it simply dumped into the sea? ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2020, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888/20 "2020-03-21T03:47:45Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > I think someone has mixed up “based in the US” and “sailing under a flag of convenience” . I didn’t look up every cruise line, but Norwegian, Royal Caribbean, Carnival and Holland America are all based in the US and presumably pay US axes. But all of their ships (except one of NCLs) are registered outside the US. Do a search on “is shipping flag of convenience used to evade taxes”. Flag of convenience is used to get around regulations and taxes in the US. You don’t fly the Stars and Stripes, you don’t get the benefits. No way us taxpayers should be bailing out cruise ships. Non-essential, the ships themselves employee majority of crew from emerging markets, and they are giant floating petri dishes. We need to keep the economy going, protect infrastructure, and support the most vulnerable among us. We don’t need to bailout cruise ships. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bailout-of-cruise-lines/849888.md?page=2)