# Ball-carriers no longer allowed to lower helmet outside tackle box **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 20, 2013, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492 "2013-03-20T21:21:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2013, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/61 "2013-03-22T18:43:01Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > I keep hearing this argument and it’s bullshit. It’s only recently that we’ve learned the consequences of head injuries. As in, the last ten years. Prior to that, “you just got your bell rung, get back out there.” Hell, if you’ll recall, it took Sidney Crosby getting injured for the NHL to start taking this stuff seriously. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: there is no circumstance where you do something that demonstrably damages your body, be it broken bones, torn muscles, or head injuries such that you can’t see straight, have constant headaches, etc., where you can claim ignorance of those consequences. Professional football players have suffered severe injuries since time immemorial. Frank Gifford missed an entire season in the prime of his career due to a concussion inflicted by Chuck Bednarik in 1960, 53 years ago. The players have known that they could be injured or crippled the whole time, they could not plausibly have thought otherwise except in the sense of “I’m immortal, it’ll never happen to me!” The knowledge of the exact nature of the injuries may have changed, but that’s not the same as the claim that it was concealed from them. How, precisely, do you conceal the consequences of a concussion, really? I’ve had a few, and at no time did I feel anything even remotely normal. When you’re injured, it’s a pretty good indication that it’s a bad thing, and just like all bad things they get worse when you continue to do them. For that reason, I find the players’ claims implausible. That said, I’m OK with the league doing things to minimize those injuries. They have to, simply because public opinion will not countenance these sorts of injuries for much longer. Ultimately, though, it falls on the players to protect themselves, even if it means that they sit out some games and maybe lose that fat contract. It’s their choice, they don’t have to lead with their heads, they don’t have to get pummeled week after week, they can walk away at their leisure. Football is violent. They can have (relatively) certain good health, or they can take their chances for money. Everybody makes that decision in some way when they choose their career, football players simply chose a profession that demonstrably wrecks their bodies. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2013, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/62 "2013-03-22T18:48:06Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: there is no circumstance where you do something that demonstrably damages your body, be it broken bones, torn muscles, or head injuries such that you can’t see straight, have constant headaches, etc., where you can claim ignorance of those consequences. That’s really not the only important factor. The fact that they are nevertheless being incentivized to outweigh that risk with a lot of money puts liability on the people doing that incentivization. And there’s also the fact that besides the tiny number of actual professional players who _are_ richly rewarded, there are those many, many more who never get close to those levels of reward, but suffer the same consequences. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2013, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/63 "2013-03-22T19:32:24Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > Some of you are reacting like these guys are slaves in the Colosseum. > > Football players know they’re getting into a dangerous sport, now more than ever, and still choose to play You are reacting like football is in any way important. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2013, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/64 "2013-03-22T20:07:55Z")
The pathetic loser OP admitted he has no life and that the only joy he gets out of life is football and if you take that away then he has nothing and will probably kill himself. You people are monsters for wanting to take that away from him. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2013, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/65 "2013-03-22T21:26:06Z")
Bah. The game got pussified when they started requiring _helmets_. You almost never even hear of a guy getting killed out there anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2013, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/66 "2013-03-22T22:21:01Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > There’s no evidence (yet) that CTE is an expected outcome in all cases. There are hundreds of current and former football players that do not suffer from such conditions. But yes, I’m still willing to make the trade. No, not in all cases, just in every single case checked so far. See, the issue is that the player’s brain has to be removed and sent to Boston College and not every player’s family agrees to that. But so far, if not 100%, damn close to it of the brains they’ve examined have shown varying degrees of CTE. It’s no longer if, but when. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/67 "2013-03-23T00:30:42Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > [http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/owners-pass-rules-changes-on-peel-back-blocks-overloaded-kick-formations/2013/03/19/85267e08-90f9-11e2-9173-7f87cda73b49\_story.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/owners-pass-rules-changes-on-peel-back-blocks-overloaded-kick-formations/2013/03/19/85267e08-90f9-11e2-9173-7f87cda73b49_story.html) > > ugh every year they come up with new rules to continue ruining football. why don’t they just go ahead and make it two-hand touch Ya know, if they did, there’d be no reason for the teams to not play every day. And then I might be able to start following the game. I’m not going to waste my time on a team that I have to wait a week between opportunities to root for them. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/68 "2013-03-23T00:40:32Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > I’m not a football fan and therefore ignorant. What does the subject mean exactly? Especially the “lower helmet outside tackle box” part. I think it has something to do with having a football game in the middle of a bass-fishing tournament. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/69 "2013-03-23T10:07:02Z")
I know nothing about gridiron, but if this issue is anything like it might be in cricket, then lowering your tackle (head or all of it) outside your box would be such a stupid idea I don’t get why they’d even need to outlaw it. ---
**Author:** ![Uber\_the\_Goober](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/58956e/32.png) [@Uber\_the\_Goober](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uber_the_Goober)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/70 "2013-03-23T14:39:51Z")
> [@Darth\_Sensitive](#): > > Leading with the helmet has been illegal for both sides for years in high school. > > Glad the NFL is catching up. “Leading with the helmet” and “Tucking your head down in preparation for impact” aren’t exactly the same, but can appear so, and often have similar results. Bummer, but it means that now guys necks are going to take more damage from being slung around when the non-tucked head gets whacked by a stray arm/leg/body part. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/71 "2013-03-23T23:55:45Z")
I wish they’d call it the pocket instead of the tackle box. Makes me want to go fishing every time I see that. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGauss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karlgauss/32/3713_2.png) [@KarlGauss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGauss)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/72 "2013-03-24T00:41:14Z")
> [@asterion](#): > > . . . how are the officials going to decide between leading with the helmet and diving for yardage? _Is_ this an issue? I’m sure I couldn’t tell the difference. ---
**Author:** ![Enginerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bcef8e/32.png) [@Enginerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enginerd)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/73 "2013-03-24T00:46:47Z")
I don’t think it matters. If the runner initiates contact with the crown of his helmet, regardless of why, it’s a penalty. What’s going to be more difficult is figuring out who to flag on helmet-to-helmet hits - defender or ballcarrier. The league did specifically allow for both players to be penalized on the same play - I think we’ll see a lot of offsetting personal fouls. ---
**Author:** ![R3d\_Anonymous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aeb1de/32.png) [@R3d\_Anonymous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R3d_Anonymous)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/74 "2013-03-24T04:15:20Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > So your life is ruined if you don’t get to see people get their brains scrambled, ala Mike Webster? Okay. Yeah, how DARE players not want to end up with serious brain damage! :rolleyes: Jesus. I agree with this. ---
**Author:** ![R3d\_Anonymous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aeb1de/32.png) [@R3d\_Anonymous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R3d_Anonymous)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492/75 "2013-03-24T04:21:18Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > The OP has a thing about football and preserving the violence of the game regardless of the impact on the health of players. > > [Roger Goodell continues to do everything in his power to ruin football (re: kickoffs) - The Game Room - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=674686) > [Why is it the NFL's responsibility to tell players about the effects of concussions - The Game Room - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=666999) > > In other words, he’s an idiot. This is just further proof. > [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > Folks arguing against this rule are idiots. It should be obvious to anyone that you should not be able to use your helmeted head as a bulldozer. The only real concern I have is how well it will be called, but I am sure it will be worked out. Note, it is not a penalty to just lower your head, it is a penalty if you use your helmet as a projectile. And these. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ball-carriers-no-longer-allowed-to-lower-helmet-outside-tackle-box/653492.md?page=3)