# Ban ice hockey, or reform it, or something! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 19, 2002, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107 "2002-03-19T21:38:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![scotth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b9e5f3/32.png) [@scotth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scotth)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2002, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/21 "2002-03-20T17:25:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bordelond \* > \*\* > > No, no … curving the glass inwards cuts down the available angle for a bee-line puck shot (or a defelection, for that matter) to get into the stands. \*\* This is clearly not true. The beeline shots that are a danger to the spectators are fired from well away from the boards and the glass. The only thing that makes a significant difference is the height of the glass. The higher the glass goes, more rows are protected from line drives. With the same amount of glass, curving the top in would actually reduce protection by lowering the top of the glass some small amount. When a person is a spectator in the rows low enough that a puck could get there, one spots the danger areas on the ice by looking at how much of the rink can be seen without looking through the glass. If you can see a particular spot on the ice from your seat, a puck coming from that spot could hit you. Of course small adjustments need to be made for the gravity and/or aerodynamic curving. ---
**Author:** ![Zoff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/6de8d8/32.png) [@Zoff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoff)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2002, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/22 "2002-03-20T17:44:19Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by bordelond_ > No, no … curving the glass inwards cuts down the available angle for a bee-line puck shot (or a defelection, for that matter) to get into the stands. As scotth mentioned, the really hot pucks come from shots well away from the glass (generally between the blue line and the top of the faceoff circle). I don’t think the curvature would prevent anything the current straight tops wouldn’t. The curved glass _might_ deflect a puck down here and there. But the pucks that would be deflected by curved glass currently hit the glass and pop rather harmlessly into the stands. The dangerous pucks are the beeline pucks and I don’t think curved glass will do anything about those. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2002, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/23 "2002-03-20T18:15:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by scotth \* > **With the same amount of glass, curving the top in would actually reduce protection by lowering the top of the glass some small amount.** I have to concede your “same amount of glass” point. Just curving in existing amount of glass would not lead to a net gain of rows protected. However, neither would it lose protection, because the upper edge of the glass would be closer to the shooter than it would be if the glass were straight up and down. Therefore, the puck would have to take a more vertical trajectory to leave the field of play – and the more vertical the trajectory, the more velocity the puck loses as it approaches the apex of its flight. You would need more raw glass for the “curvature” idea to be employed – but not much more. What I’m thinking about leaves the top edge of the glass at least as high above the rink surface as it is now – not lower – despite the curvature. ---
**Author:** ![Drastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Drastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drastic)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2002, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/24 "2002-03-20T18:21:29Z")
The puck should be replaced with Nerf, likewise for the sticks. The players should walk to where it goes, and then have a round-robin rock-paper-scissors contest to determine who gets a turn to hit it. ---
**Author:** ![ElwoodCuse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/edb3f5/32.png) [@ElwoodCuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElwoodCuse)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2002, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/25 "2002-03-21T05:51:20Z")
Never mind the logistics, how about the simple fact the curving the glass at the top would completely alter the way hockey is played? ---
**Author:** ![Zoff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/6de8d8/32.png) [@Zoff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoff)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2002, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/26 "2002-03-21T13:11:38Z")
bordelond, I still don’t see how the curvature would help. It’s the shots that miss the glass that are the danger and I don’t really see how curving the glass helps the issue. A puck that would hit the curved portion would currently hit the flat portion and that would be enough to take a lot off of the speed. I also agree with ElwoodCuse that you would be altering the game. The curved glass would alter the way pucks travel around the glass and would knock some pucks that were no danger to fans back into play. Given that there has only been one death ever, that the curvature is of, at best, dubious utility, and that the curvature would alter play I don’t think it’s a good idea. This isn’t an incident that cries out for reform. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2002, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/27 "2002-03-21T16:48:56Z")
There was some race I believe in the 60s where the car went flying into the stands and killed 71 people. That stupid useless sport is still around, and people still go see it every year. Stupid kneejerkers who think the point of life is just being able to breathe and anything else is unecessary. I bet more little girls in the course of history have cut themselves badly on their broken pottery tea-sets and bled to death than have died at a hockey game. Erek ---
**Author:** ![My\_Darn\_Snake\_Legs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f14d63/32.png) [@My\_Darn\_Snake\_Legs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/My_Darn_Snake_Legs)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2002, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/28 "2002-03-21T17:22:22Z")
Here’s something else about the injury to the little girl that is interesting: the puck striking her in the head is **not** what killed her. She did not just drop dead at the scene as many people seem to suppose. She died hours later at a hospital from swelling of the brain. As I remember, what actually made this happen was **not** the puck hitting her, but rather the way in which her head snapped back after it did. An artery was pinched, which restricted blood flow and caused her brain to swell. Why didn’t the doctors notice this until after she was dead? Shouldn’t they have seen that her brain was swelling? This sound’s like the doctor’s fault, not the hockey player’s. –==the sax man==– ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2002, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/29 "2002-03-21T17:43:36Z")
one word solution. Netting. ---
**Author:** ![Ennui](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ennui/32/3396_2.png) [@Ennui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ennui)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2002, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/30 "2002-03-21T21:38:41Z")
I got your solution right here, and it might even boost ratings. A squad of highly trained skeet shooters positioned strategically around the arena. The moment any puck flies above the glass the zamboni man yells _“PULL.”_ ---
**Author:** ![aenea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c68b51/32.png) [@aenea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aenea)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2002, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/31 "2002-03-21T22:19:05Z")
Now, THAT, is a fine solution indeed. I like it! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![ScoobyTX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@ScoobyTX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ScoobyTX)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2002, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/32 "2002-03-21T22:26:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SMUsax \* > Here’s something else about the injury to the little girl that is interesting: the puck striking her in the head is **not** what killed her. She did not just drop dead at the scene as many people seem to suppose. She died hours later at a hospital from swelling of the brain. As I remember, what actually made this happen was **not** the puck hitting her, but rather the way in which her head snapped back after it did. An artery was pinched, which restricted blood flow and caused her brain to swell. > > Why didn’t the doctors notice this until after she was dead? Shouldn’t they have seen that her brain was swelling? This sound’s like the doctor’s fault, not the hockey player’s. Huh? WTF are you talking about? In most cases (TV & movie deaths not withstanding), people do not just die instantly, no matter what the cause. The hockey puck hit the girl’s head, causing a brain injury, which caused the death. The hockey puck hitting her head (although removed from DIRECT AND IMMEDIATE causation by the mechanics of the fatal injury) is what killed this girl. Your logic appears equivalent to: “Defense Lawyer: Although my client shot the victim, the bullet did not kill the decedant. He was alive when he got to the hospital, and died there of loss of blood. The jury should consider that the ER doctors did not stop this bleeding, therefore they should be charged with murder, not my client.” The hockey puck killed her. It is not the doctor’s fault, or the hockey player’s. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2002, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/33 "2002-03-21T22:55:51Z")
> [@](#): > > “It’s a miserable day,” coach Bill Deleranko said. “I figure that God’s crying along with us.” Well, there’s a comforting thought. What an asshole this guy must be. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2002, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/34 "2002-03-21T23:25:59Z")
Sorry. I was wrong. I knew I was wrong a few minutes after I posted it. **Yes, I was being an ass.** Mea culpa! Thanks for all your comments. Some good points, & I take back what I said in the OP. After I saw what I’d posted, I really expected this to be removed to the Pit. Amazingly, it hasn’t been. ::crawls away:: ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2002, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/35 "2002-03-22T00:44:37Z")
adam yax wrote: > [@](#): > > Plexiglass was the standard for about 50 years or so. In the last few years a number of new arenas have gone to se[a]mless glass. That is just that - tempered glass without the support struts that are required for plexiglass. Hrm … maybe they should use transparent aluminum. Or arenak. ---
**Author:** ![scotth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b9e5f3/32.png) [@scotth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scotth)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2002, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/36 "2002-03-22T00:53:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by foolsguinea \* > \*\*Sorry. I was wrong. I knew I was wrong a few minutes after I posted it. **Yes, I was being an ass.** Mea culpa! > > Thanks for all your comments. Some good points, & I take back what I said in the OP. > > After I saw what I’d posted, I really expected this to be removed to the Pit. Amazingly, it hasn’t been. > > ::crawls away:: \*\* Accepted! I almost couldn’t phrase my first reponse to this thread. Everything I wrote I had to erase, because if I would have posted it in GD instead of the Pit, I would have been banned. I was pissed. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2002, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/37 "2002-03-22T01:01:31Z")
according to the coroner, death was caused by an injury to an artery at the back of her head. a rather rare injury. the artery was injured by the “snap back” when she was struck on the forehead. she was able to walk to the first aid station after the injury, as time when on, the artery sheared and clotted, blocking off blood flow, causing brain swelling, stroke, and death. without the artery damage she may have survived the skull fracture in the forehead. this type of injury is very, very, difficult to spot. the other two people who were hit with the same puck had bloody wounds. to me it was a very freak accident, and injury. i don’t think we should ban hockey; but perhaps we should have fans up to a certain level wear helmuts. i’m still amazed that people played hockey without helmuts. ---
**Author:** ![ElwoodCuse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/edb3f5/32.png) [@ElwoodCuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElwoodCuse)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2002, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/38 "2002-03-22T01:52:48Z")
I’d like to thank the OP for the apology. Also, it was more than hours–it was two days afterwards. And **TwistOfFate** , we’ve been over why netting is not required or even practical. ---
**Author:** ![Oblong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/c0e974/32.png) [@Oblong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oblong)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2002, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/39 "2002-03-22T02:03:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ScoobyTX \* > \*\* > > Huh? WTF are you talking about? In most cases (TV & movie deaths not withstanding), people do not just die instantly, no matter what the cause. The hockey puck hit the girl’s head, causing a brain injury, which caused the death. The hockey puck hitting her head (although removed from DIRECT AND IMMEDIATE causation by the mechanics of the fatal injury) is what killed this girl. > > Your logic appears equivalent to: > “Defense Lawyer: Although my client shot the victim, the bullet did not kill the decedant. He was alive when he got to the hospital, and died there of loss of blood. The jury should consider that the ER doctors did not stop this bleeding, therefore they should be charged with murder, not my client.” > > The hockey puck killed her. It is not the doctor’s fault, or the hockey player’s. \*\* Sorry, you are wrong. Here’s a quote from the coroner: “The puck struck her in the forehead, causing a skull fracture and some bruising of the brain in the area,” Lewis said. “But that wasn’t what led to her death. It was the snapping back of the head and the damage to that artery.” [http://espn.go.com/nhl/news/2002/0320/1354787.html](http://espn.go.com/nhl/news/2002/0320/1354787.html) Your analogy would only be true if people dying from gunshot wounds was very very rare. People get hit in the head with pucks all the time and it doesn’t kill them. Her head snapped back at just the right speed and angle. If you read the link you will see that the pathologists have never seen anything like it. ---
**Author:** ![My\_Darn\_Snake\_Legs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f14d63/32.png) [@My\_Darn\_Snake\_Legs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/My_Darn_Snake_Legs)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2002, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107/40 "2002-03-22T02:22:09Z")
Thanks to Oblong! I was searching for the link I had read earlier, and that was the exact quote! Hahahahaha! I always like being right, but I wish you hadn’t beaten me to it 🙂 –==the sax man==– [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ban-ice-hockey-or-reform-it-or-something/99107.md?page=3)