# Band members who hate each other **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 15, 2014, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839 "2014-06-15T19:01:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/81 "2014-06-17T14:41:44Z")
Did they guys in KISS hate each other? Sometimes. But it’s not clear to me if any one person was wholly at fault for their problems. PART of the problem is that the band was built by two guys who were tight friends and business partners (Paul and Gene) who had a plan for success… and two guys they probably regarded as hired side men along for the ride. Sometimes, if you watch footage of old interviews, you’ll see that Ace was totally drunk or stoned. He’d be making stupid, unfunny jokes and cracking himself up while Gene fumed. IF Ace was like that all the time, I can easily understand why Gene and Paul would get sick of him. Meanwhile, Ace and Peter had their own reasons to regard Gene as a jerk. I remember seeing Ace on _ **That Metal Show** _, where he pointed to a guy in the audience dressed in Kiss makeup, and quipped, “Believe me, sir, if Gene could find ANY way to make you pay to wear that makeup, he would.” If Gene thought Ace was a drunken idiot, and Ace thought Gene was a money-grubbing prick, I have a feeling they were BOTH right! ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/82 "2014-06-17T17:31:42Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > Metallica’s management hired [Phil Towle](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Towle) as a performance enhancement coach, but he also served as a mediator between feuding members. Shortly before Metallica released _St. Anger_, I saw an interview with James Hetfield where he said that the group recorded the album because they wanted to create an album that didn’t have a lot of “negative, fucked up energy” behind it. So, obviously there was a lot of friction behind the scenes. When I bought the album, I quickly realized that the negative, f—ed up energy was a vital component of the band’s sound. (_St. Anger_ is easily the worst Metallica album, by a wide margin.) ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/83 "2014-06-17T18:10:03Z")
> [@KinkiNipponTourist](#): > > Now John, John was a first-class prick. That’s putting it mildly, if daughter Mackenzie is to be believed. (I do.) ---
**Author:** ![yanceylebeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yanceylebeef/32/12290_2.png) [@yanceylebeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yanceylebeef)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/84 "2014-06-17T18:23:37Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > Ron Torkelson was apparently not well liked by the rest of Armada. Even Herman Menderchuk. Loved Trampoline Girl. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/85 "2014-06-17T18:23:51Z")
> [@TreacherousCretin](#): > > That’s putting it mildly, if daughter Mackenzie is to be believed. (I do.) I thought Mackenzie regarded John as an drunk/stoned, clueless, inattentive, out-to-lunch Dad more than as a prick. Mackenzie, like her sister Bijou, could be out all night partying, drinking, taking drugs and getting into trouble because her Dad didn’t notice or care what she was up to. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/86 "2014-06-17T18:29:04Z")
I’m pretty sure **TreacherousCretin** is talking about John molesting Mackenzie… ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/87 "2014-06-18T01:07:05Z")
> [@faithfool](#): > > I’m pretty sure **TreacherousCretin** is talking about John molesting Mackenzie… for ten years. And coking her up at age eleven. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/88 "2014-06-18T02:34:58Z")
> [@faithfool](#): > > I’m pretty sure **TreacherousCretin** is talking about John molesting Mackenzie… That would do it. Thanks, I’d never heard that. Although… even as an adult, Mackenzie toured with John in a reformed version of the Mamas and the Papas (one that included Spanky McFarland in place of Cass Elliott). Hard to imagine why she’d keep working wiuth him after all he’d done. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/89 "2014-06-18T02:52:45Z")
It was more than molestation. They had a [consensual sexual relationship](http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/mackenzie-phillips-sexual-affair-dad/story?id=8647172) for about 10 years. Well, she backed off the “consensual” part, and likened it more to [Stockholm Syndrome](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mackenzie_Phillips#Allegations_of_sexual_relationship_with_father). ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/90 "2014-06-18T13:19:14Z")
I’m not sure anyone knows the full details, but the aptly named country/folk duo the [The Civil Wars](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Civil_Wars) had a fabulously successful first album (by folk music standards) and then broke up citing irreconcilable differences. ---
**Author:** ![Apocalypso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Apocalypso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apocalypso)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/91 "2014-06-18T15:54:47Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Did they guys in KISS hate each other? Sometimes. But it’s not clear to me if any one person was wholly at fault for their problems. > > PART of the problem is that the band was built by two guys who were tight friends and business partners (Paul and Gene) who had a plan for success… and two guys they probably regarded as hired side men along for the ride. > > Sometimes, if you watch footage of old interviews, you’ll see that Ace was totally drunk or stoned. He’d be making stupid, unfunny jokes and cracking himself up while Gene fumed. IF Ace was like that all the time, I can easily understand why Gene and Paul would get sick of him. > > Meanwhile, Ace and Peter had their own reasons to regard Gene as a jerk. I remember seeing Ace on _ **That Metal Show** _, where he pointed to a guy in the audience dressed in Kiss makeup, and quipped, “Believe me, sir, if Gene could find ANY way to make you pay to wear that makeup, he would.” > > If Gene thought Ace was a drunken idiot, and Ace thought Gene was a money-grubbing prick, I have a feeling they were BOTH right! The ironic thing is, Gene and Paul didn’t want band friction to become a distraction, so they did their best to portray the band as a united and equal front. They wrote up a contract during the early days giving all 4 band members equal profits (which lasted long after Ace and Peter were kicked out), and tried to run the band as democratically as possible, but Ace and Peter just weren’t interested and would show up for practices and meetings stoned, drunk, or not at all. I haven’t read any of the other band members stories so I don’t have any other point of view, but Gene comes across as a colossal, soulless, money-grubbing, egomaniac prick. In his own book. Which is also reinforced by his television series. But no one in the band comes up smelling like roses. The wonder is that they stayed together as long as they did. ---
**Author:** ![Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/intergalactic_gladiator/32/112_2.png) [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Intergalactic_Gladiator)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/92 "2014-06-18T16:24:19Z")
Nigel Tufnel walked off stage and left Spinal Tap in the middle of a concert. You can get more acrimonious than that. ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/93 "2014-06-18T16:25:10Z")
They went through a lot of drummers, too. ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/94 "2014-06-18T16:46:26Z")
> [@Apocalypso](#): > > I haven’t read any of the other band members stories so I don’t have any other point of view, but Gene comes across as a colossal, soulless, money-grubbing, egomaniac prick. In his own book. Which is also reinforced by his television series. Simmons did an interview with Terry Gross on NPR’s Fresh Air many years ago that exposes his ego. It’s the only time I’ve ever heard Gross get majorly flustered. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/95 "2014-06-18T16:46:39Z")
No cite, but Billy Gibbons mentioned in an interview that there is a number of reasons each member of ZZ Top travel separately when on tour. He didn’t give any of those reasons, however. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/96 "2014-06-18T18:01:19Z")
> [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](#): > > Nigel Tufnel walked off stage and left Spinal Tap in the middle of a concert. You can get more acrimonious than that. Not sure which came first, but that was reminiscent of \*\*Heart \*\* when Roger Fisher cracked and stormed off stage after he and Nancy Wilson broke up. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/97 "2014-06-18T18:07:57Z")
Barry Gibb says that he wasn’t close to his brothers Maurice and Robin before their deaths. He regrets that they were no longer friends. He says he was closer to their youngest brother Andy than to either Robin or Maurice. > **[The worst part of losing my brothers? We weren't even friends at the end: In...](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2356426/Barry-Gibb-tells-guilt-remorse-loneliness-the-Bee-Gees.html)** > > Barry Gibb's wife Linda told him - as the last surviving Bee Gee - to stop moping over the death of his brothers, get off his backside and make music again, writes DAVID WIGG. ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/98 "2014-06-18T18:38:17Z")
Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you the Norwegian band [Mayhem](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayhem_(band)). Some tidbits: > [@](#): > > Dead and Euronymous “got on each other’s nerves a lot” and “weren’t really friends at the end”. Hellhammer recalls that Dead once went outside to sleep in the woods because Euronymous was playing synth music that Dead hated. Euronymous then went outside and began shooting into the air with a shotgun. Varg Vikernes claims that Dead once stabbed Euronymous with a knife. > [@](#): > > On 8 April 1991, Dead committed suicide in the house owned by the band. He was found by Euronymous with slit wrists and a shotgun wound to the head. Dead’s suicide note notably read “Excuse all the blood, cheers.” and included an apology for firing the weapon indoors. Instead of calling the police, Euronymous went to a nearby store and bought a disposable camera to photograph the corpse, after re-arranging some items. > [@](#): > > In time, rumors spread that Euronymous had made a stew with bits of Dead’s brain and had made necklaces with bits of his skull. Moreover, Euronymous claimed to have given these necklaces to musicians he deemed worthy, which was confirmed by several other members of the scene, like Bård ‘Faust’ Eithun and Metalion. And finally: > [@](#): > > On 10 August 1993, Vikernes murdered Euronymous. On that night, Vikernes and Ruch travelled from Bergen 518 km to Euronymous’ apartment in Oslo. Upon their arrival, a confrontation began, which ended when Vikernes fatally stabbed Euronymous. His body was found outside the apartment with twenty-three cut wounds — two to the head, five to the neck and sixteen to the back. Vikernes claims that Euronymous had plotted to torture him to death and videotape the event, using a meeting about an unsigned contract as a pretext. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/99 "2014-06-18T19:32:56Z")
> [@Maserschmidt](#): > > I keep reading this thread title as “Board members who hate each other”. I do too. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839/100 "2014-06-18T19:47:44Z")
As for The Police thing, I had always heard it as Sting and Andy were best buds and lived close to each other and hung out together while Stewart was just the third guy in the band. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/band-members-who-hate-each-other/690839.md?page=6)