# Banksy sidewalk sale - This is one of the funniest & most awesome things I've ever seen!
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [October 14, 2013, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230 "2013-10-14T17:09:42Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/41 "2013-10-15T00:32:38Z")
> [@rsat3acr](#):
>
> sorry I just don’t think of him as an artist. If you paint on someone elses property without permission that makes you a vandal, doesn’t matter how clever or talented the painting is.
I don’t know if “increasing the value of something by up to one million dollars” can properly be defined as “vandalism.”
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### Author:  [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/42 "2013-10-15T00:36:29Z")
> [@WhyNot](#):
>
> The “joke” is that those three Banksy pieces that were barely worth $60 yesterday are worth tens of thousands today. And the only thing that changed is the story about them. So which is the “art” - the paint on the canvas, or the story around it? When we’re paying for the story, what’s the use of the canvas?
John Cage gets all the credit for _4’33"_ even though my grandpa had performed it a year earlier; the art itself was nothing, the story around it everything.
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### Author:  [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/43 "2013-10-15T00:44:01Z")
> [@Jophiel](#):
>
> But its monetary value only comes from its authenticity because inauthentic replicas are so easily obtained. So I didn’t spend $60 on what I presume is a knock-off only worth the canvas it’s printed on. Does that mean I don’t like the print on it? What if that print is my computer wallpaper? What if I actually love the design, I just didn’t want to pay $60 for an inauthentic piece widely and easily available on the internet any time I want to enjoy it? Maybe it’s not worth $60 to have a replica of the print on canvas when I can run it on my laser printer and stick it to my fridge with a magnet. How is declining to buy the piece a real signal that it’s not “worth much as art” when replicas and depictions of art cost nothing but a few electrons these days?
You know how much a first edition of James Audubon’s _Birds of America_ goes for? Ten million, easy. And that’s for a published book, which by definition, is a _copy._
And yet, no one ever reads a story like that, and decides it means that all literature is bullshit.
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### Author:  [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/44 "2013-10-15T01:16:16Z")
> [@Jophiel](#):
>
> Fair enough.
>
> I don’t know why I should care about a “lesson” that any high school kid should be able to impart with fifteen seconds of introspection. I don’t know what about his little experiment is newsworthy or worth discussing apart from “Haha… those people could be rich but they didn’t buy it”.
> **[Ten Thousand](https://xkcd.com/1053/)**
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### Author:  [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/45 "2013-10-15T01:22:36Z")
> [@Miller](#):
>
> You know how much a first edition of James Audubon’s _Birds of America_ goes for? Ten million, easy. And that’s for a published book, which by definition, is a _copy._
>
> And yet, no one ever reads a story like that, and decides it means that all literature is bullshit.
Nobody buys _Birds of America_ just because it’s written and illustrated by James Audubon. It is a work that can and does stand on its own merits, where wanker fodder like 4’33" is literally nothing without resorting to “So-and-so made it, so it _must_ be good” bullshit.
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### Author:  [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/46 "2013-10-15T01:23:02Z")
Remember that story about the world-famous violinist who played in the subway and nobody stop to give him money? That story was pretty silly too.
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### Author:  [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/47 "2013-10-15T01:25:38Z")
> [@Rhiannon8404](#):
>
> Or maybe they never dreamed it was real, just some guy ripping off someone else’s works.
That would have been my thought. I don’t follow modern art but Banksy is well enough known that I would recognize his style. So if I had come across that stall I would have thought “Here’s a guy selling Banksy-like paintings.”
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### Author:  [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/48 "2013-10-15T01:26:34Z")
> [@Grumman](#):
>
> Nobody buys _Birds of America_ just because it’s written and illustrated by James Audubon. It is a work that can and does stand on its own merits…
Millions of dollars’ worth?
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### Author:  [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/49 "2013-10-15T01:35:40Z")
> [@Grumman](#):
>
> Nobody buys _Birds of America_ just because it’s written and illustrated by James Audubon. It is a work that can and does stand on its own merits…
Well, not really. I mean, it’s a great work of ornithology by 19th century standards, but (and I admit I making an assumption here) I’m pretty sure in the intervening two hundred years or so since he published it, we’ve learned quite a bit more about the birds of America. We’ve also invented the camera, so we can see what the birds actually look like, instead of having to rely on the interpretation of an artist, however talented. By any objective standard, surely, a more modern ornithology book would be vastly more valuable. And yet they do not, generally speaking, fetch ten million dollars at auction.
So, I think the name on the dust jacket actually has quite a bit to do with the value of the book.
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### Author:  [@moejoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moejoe)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/50 "2013-10-15T02:14:22Z")
> [@BrokenBriton](#):
>
> I think the point is it really worked; he put it out there to prove what he does really isn’t worth much as art, he knows that and thinks the whole scene is absurd.
>
> Really, they’re simple little cartoonish canvasses and worth exactly that $60 range.
>
> The rest of the value, as he’d agree, is bullshit.
I don’t think he would say it’s bullshit, just that it’s adjustable. It’s a new way to think about the value of modern art where almost every conversation has at least one guy saying that the current method of valuing art is a scam. So here we have the artist himself lowering the cost of his work and showing that this doesn’t help, people still say it’s a scam, or assume that it is and keep walking.
Now, I love a Banksy. I think his work is smart and funny and beautiful and I would have bought a $60 canvas because I liked it and wanted to see it in my home every day. It wouldn’t matter to me that it wasn’t a “real” Banksy any more than it would bother me to have a real Warhol and know that he hadn’t actually made it with his own hands. This may have something to do with the fact that both use stencils and those are meant to be used to recreate the exact same image multiple times so a copy actually _is_ an original, but it’s also a reminder to buy what you like, not what you think you can sell later for a profit.
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### Author:  [@rsat3acr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rsat3acr)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/51 "2013-10-15T02:24:54Z")
> [@Marley23](#):
>
> I think if you can look at a well-made and thought-provoking piece of art and say “it’s not art because it’s vandalism,” that’s an unfortunate limitation on your perception. There’s no reason it can’t be art and vandalism.
I can see his talent and would appreciate it in another context and yes it can be art and vandalism but in my mind the vandalism trumps the art aspect. Never said it wasn’t art just that it was vandalism.
I’ve seen lots of graffiti where the person doing it clearly has talent doesn’t mean it is okay to do it.
Does the fact that he is famous make it different from some high school kid doing the same thing just on a different level?
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### Author:  [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/52 "2013-10-15T03:18:57Z")
By the way, I’ve heard about how much some of Banksy’s work sells for, but as much of it is done on other people’s buildings, don’t they profit when it sells and not him? So how does he make money, to afford things like spending a month in New York?
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### Author:  [@Garula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Garula)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/53 "2013-10-15T04:59:28Z")
I’m not particularly enamored with Banksy’s work and my philosophical position puts me at odds with street artists in general, but I do really like him when he prods the art world like this. _Exit Through the Gift Shop_ is excellent and this seems to be along the same lines. The message I take away is “for god’s sake, stop worshiping big name artists as celebrities and instead embrace the ‘lesser’ works of beauty around you.”
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### Author:  [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/54 "2013-10-15T08:34:15Z")
> [@Miller](#):
>
> I once blew a question on an economics test because I’d never heard of Scotty Pippen.
>
> Fame is pretty relative to your individual interests.
Scottie Pippen the Ricardian Socialist small forward or Scottie Pippen the Neo-Keynesian small forward?
Sorry that’s silly. Of course he was the Chicago School.
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### Author:  [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/55 "2013-10-15T08:52:13Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#):
>
> By the way, I’ve heard about how much some of Banksy’s work sells for, but as much of it is done on other people’s buildings, don’t they profit when it sells and not him?
Yes, they do.
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#):
>
> So how does he make money, to afford things like spending a month in New York?
He makes prints as well (like the ones on sale, funnily enough). His work is stencil-based so easily replicable. Many other UK artists work in similar mediums, with their work originating in street art but extending to more traditional mediums. Another such artist is [Pure Evil](http://pureevilgallery.virb.com/).
I have bought limited edition prints by similar artists at a great little gallery in London called [Nelly Duff](http://www.nellyduff.com/) - they sell Banksy prints, but also much cheaper works.
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### Author:  [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/56 "2013-10-15T22:40:28Z")
[I think the old guy they got to sell the work seems nice. I congratulate the lucky folks that bought it, especially the guy who bought 4.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zX54DIpacNE)
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### Author:  [@Filbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Filbert)
#### Post date: [October 15, 2013, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/57 "2013-10-15T23:38:48Z")
He should try it here- in Bristol, England- he could join the three other regular stalls (that I’m aware of) selling Banksy prints…
A lot of the graffitti round here (including some of the Banksy stuff) was done with the consent of the owners- some I’ve heard that directly from said owners, others are in locations that need scaffolding to get to, and on a scale that takes several days to complete. Hardly spray 'n run tagging.
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### Author:  [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)
#### Post date: [October 16, 2013, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/58 "2013-10-16T18:19:38Z")
> [@Loach](#):
>
> I literally can’t name one other contemporary artist. And I’ve heard of Banksy. He is quite famous.
Just to increase the thread’s statistical data…I can’t name any single contemporary artist, and I’ve also never heard of this guy or the movie about him.
I’m intrigued however by the conceptual question of, if vandalism increases the value of the structure, does it remain vandalism? I suppose it depends on whether vandalism is defined by social, monetary, property, or legality views.
So, in his case, he’s legally committing vandalism. He’s only committing property vandalism to those owners who want to undo his ‘damage’. He’s only committing social vandalism to those who dislike graffiti or his art on aesthetic principles.
So, to sum up, this guy is 25% of an artist that I’ve never heard of, and 75% of a vandal that I’ve never heard of 🙂
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### Author:  [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)
#### Post date: [October 18, 2013, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/59 "2013-10-18T13:57:44Z")
> [@Filbert](#):
>
> He should try it here- in Bristol, England- he could join the three other regular stalls (that I’m aware of) selling Banksy prints…
He probably already has, given that Banksy is from Bristol.
> [@Filbert](#):
>
> A lot of the graffitti round here (including some of the Banksy stuff) was done with the consent of the owners- some I’ve heard that directly from said owners, others are in locations that need scaffolding to get to, and on a scale that takes several days to complete. Hardly spray 'n run tagging.
Bristol seems to have a ‘thing’ about street art - am I right in thinking it’s encouraged or even funded by the council?
I’ve just moved here! Hey neighbour!
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### Author:  [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)
#### Post date: [October 18, 2013, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/banksy-sidewalk-sale-this-is-one-of-the-funniest-most-awesome-things-ive-ever-seen/671230/60 "2013-10-18T13:59:14Z")
> [@GargoyleWB](#):
>
> So, to sum up, this guy is 25% of an artist that I’ve never heard of, and 75% of a vandal that I’ve never heard of 🙂
And you, apparently, are 0% of someone who knows anything about art.
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