# Baseball bleachers torn down after ruling that girls softball team's seats must be equal **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 1, 2014, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051 "2014-04-01T04:41:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/41 "2014-04-01T16:40:36Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Dog in the manger politics. > > Parents do not “provide the boys”. They provide THEIR kids. Are they obligated to pay for other kids as well, while those kids’ parents don’t contribute? Aren’t they doing this already, seeing as how their kids won’t be going to that school forever? Future students (that aren’t their children) will receive a benefit even though those future parents didn’t contribute to the cause now. That wasn’t very eloquent, but what I’m asking is what’s the difference between providing for softball players that aren’t your kids and providing for future baseball players that aren’t your kids? The only difference is that your children get to take advantage of it NOW - and if that’s the whole argument then it’s a weak and selfish one. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/42 "2014-04-01T16:42:43Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > I think schools would be better off if they had a combined booster organization which raised money for all the sports rather than a dozen separate ones (girls software, boys baseball, boys football, girls field hockey…) The girl’s software team always gets shit on. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/43 "2014-04-01T16:44:32Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > Aren’t they doing this already, seeing as how their kids won’t be going to that school forever? Future students (that aren’t their children) will receive a benefit even though those future parents didn’t contribute to the cause now. > > That wasn’t very eloquent, but what I’m asking is what’s the difference between providing for softball players that aren’t your kids and providing for future baseball players that aren’t your kids? The only difference is that your children get to take advantage of it NOW - and if that’s the whole argument then it’s a weak and selfish one. Damn those selfish parents building the bleachers. Praises to the altruistic government officials who forced those bleachers to be torn down so that the boys’ facilities would be just as bad as the girls’. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/44 "2014-04-01T16:49:22Z")
The parents are not obligated to do anything at all. The school is obligated to ensure the teams get equal treatment. These bleachers and scoreboards are permanently installed fixtures on school grounds, that makes it the responsibility of the school to ensure the construction meets Title IX, and other codes. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/45 "2014-04-01T16:53:05Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Damn those selfish parents building the bleachers. Praises to the altruistic government officials who forced those bleachers to be torn down so that the boys’ facilities would be just as bad as the girls’. So you admit the girls’ facilities were sub-standard. Now explain why the boys should get upgraded facilities and not the girls. And remember, the school approved this project and allowed it to be built on school property where it became part of the school facilities. Were there any permits or inspections of the construction? Who would be on the hook if the stands collapsed due to inferior workmanship? The school(district also) or the parents? ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/46 "2014-04-01T16:54:50Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > So you admit the girls’ facilities were sub-standard. Now explain why the boys should get upgraded facilities and not the girls. Boys’ facilities are better - there is nothing to “admit”, that’s the premise. Because boy’s parents got together, paid for them and built them. Girls’ parents didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![leftfield6](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leftfield6/32/18780_2.png) [@leftfield6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leftfield6)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/47 "2014-04-01T17:06:35Z")
So what a few people got together and did something. Not like they cured cancer or something. And certainly no reason to exempt them from the laws that are on the books. Terr, why do you hate the Constitution? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![LibrarySpy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f9ae1b/32.png) [@LibrarySpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LibrarySpy)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/48 "2014-04-01T17:27:46Z")
So the law was passed 42 years ago, before most of those parents were even born, and they’re confused? Seems like a perfect example of why the law is still needed. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/49 "2014-04-01T17:43:41Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > Meh. The parents had a choice: > > 1. Build bleachers for the girls’ field as well. > 2. Tear down the boys’ bleachers. > > They went with option 2. Personally, I think option 1 would have made a lot more sense and would have also been a nice thing to do, but what do I know? True. Here’s the problem though: no one cares about softball. This will be reflected in the allocation of scarce resources. Free-ish market, baby! ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/50 "2014-04-01T17:47:50Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Were there any permits or inspections of the construction? Who would be on the hook if the stands collapsed due to inferior workmanship? The school(district also) or the parents? Right, because this is all about the legitimate concerns about safety and the quality of the work. Not a bit of “Hey, you built this stuff for the boys that you’re interested in, and nothing for the girls that you aren’t, so down it comes and we’ll come up with a justification if we have to reach halfway to the moon for it”. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/51 "2014-04-01T18:02:43Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Right, because this is all about the legitimate concerns about safety and the quality of the work. Not a bit of “Hey, you built this stuff for the boys that you’re interested in, and nothing for the girls that you aren’t, so down it comes and we’ll come up with a justification if we have to reach halfway to the moon for it”. No, I was pointing out that deficiencies such as those can turn around bite someone in the ass. The parents may have built it but the liability falls on the school. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/52 "2014-04-01T18:08:33Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > True. Here’s the problem though: no one cares about softball. This will be reflected in the allocation of scarce resources. Free-ish market, baby! If no one cared about softball, this wouldn’t have gone to court. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/53 "2014-04-01T19:41:33Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Damn those selfish parents building the bleachers. Praises to the altruistic government officials who forced those bleachers to be torn down so that the boys’ facilities would be just as bad as the girls’. They were quite indeed quite selfish, only building better bleachers for them to be able to sit on while watching their kids’ games. They don’t watch the girls’ games, so they didn’t build anything for them. They were selfish, so they don’t get their comfy seats. They want comfortable seats, they have to do it for everyone, not just themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/54 "2014-04-01T19:43:15Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > They were selfish, so they don’t get their comfy seats. They want comfortable seats, they have to do it for everyone, not just themselves. Politics of envy. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/55 "2014-04-01T20:09:28Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Politics of envy. Fortunately for us women, way back in the 1970s Congress decided Freud was full of shit. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/56 "2014-04-01T20:14:35Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Politics of envy. No, morality based on fairness–a morality taught in pretty much every public school. You bring enough for the whole class, or you don’t get to do it at school. And that’s the key thing. These parents can be as selfish as they want on their own property, but, at school, they have to consider others. Equal extracurricular education opportunities are to be offered to both sexes. Just because the parents have the money to build what they want doesn’t mean they get to have their way. The school is public property, not their own private place. Title IX exists for a reason. I’m sorry you don’t like it. But the logic that allows for Title IX makes this an open-and-shut case. You don’t get to privilege male sports just because they are more popular. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/57 "2014-04-01T20:18:20Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Boys’ facilities are better - there is nothing to “admit”, that’s the premise. Because boy’s parents got together, paid for them and built them. Girls’ parents didn’t. Absent Title IX, and the requirement that the girls and boys facilities be comparably equipped, the boys will have all the good equipment and the girls will have shit because: > [@marshmallow](#): > > no one cares about softball. Thankfully, we had a Liberal, Hippy Dippy, Equality loving Nixon there to recognize that equality isn’t just about what the majority wants to fund. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/58 "2014-04-01T20:19:46Z")
Can we all agree at least that booster parents are the worst? ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/59 "2014-04-01T20:25:09Z")
They could have just bought portable bleachers and pulled them to each field as needed. ---
**Author:** ![AdmiralQ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8797f3/32.png) [@AdmiralQ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AdmiralQ)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2014, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051/60 "2014-04-01T20:41:57Z")
How in the world does differences in spectator seating make the facilities that are actually used - the fields themselves - worse for the girls than the boys? As long as both fields are to each sport’s specifications, safe to play on, and maintained to similar standards, where’s the problem? The actual participants use the fields, not the spectator seating. Who cares whether or not the spectators have equivalent facilities? They aren’t the ones playing the sport! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/baseball-bleachers-torn-down-after-ruling-that-girls-softball-teams-seats-must-be-equal/685051.md?page=4)