# Batman vs Superman: Jesse Eisenberg is Lex Luthor & Jeremy Irons is Alfred **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 31, 2014, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222 "2014-01-31T18:35:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![drastic\_quench](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e36b37/32.png) [@drastic\_quench](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drastic_quench)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/41 "2014-02-03T04:29:43Z")
This is insane! I can’t believe they cast that Aussie pretty boy Heath Ledger for the role of The Joker! He’s barely cut out for teeny bopper rom coms! Obviously his performance won’t be able to touch the timeless classic that was Jack Nicholson. These new re-imaginings are crap; this whole film is bound to fail. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/42 "2014-02-03T05:05:53Z")
> [@drastic\_quench](#): > > This is insane! I can’t believe they cast that Aussie pretty boy Heath Ledger for the role of The Joker! He’s barely cut out for teeny bopper rom coms! Obviously his performance won’t be able to touch the timeless classic that was Jack Nicholson. These new re-imaginings are crap; this whole film is bound to fail. I was _skeptical_ when I heard Ledger had been cast as Joker, but here’s the difference: [ul]The first film in that series was excellent and Christopher Nolan had proven vision, competence, and an engaging aesthetic. The first film in _this_ series was a complete mess with Zack Snyder barely treading water in a soup of too many cooks.[/ul] This new movie may turn out to be awesome . . . but the first in the series doesn’t stand as evidence that the filmmakers’ heads are anywhere but up their asses. ---
**Author:** ![drastic\_quench](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e36b37/32.png) [@drastic\_quench](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drastic_quench)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/43 "2014-02-03T05:25:27Z")
I thought Superman Returns was an abortion, and in light of that failed relaunch, I gave Man of Steel a solid B. It’s no classic, but it more than competes with the solo-character Marvel films – which has to have been the brass ring at WB. I mean, here we are discussing the coming sequel, so the first film already proved out as a launch pad for the new film DCU. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/44 "2014-02-03T05:53:36Z")
> [@drastic\_quench](#): > > I mean, here we are discussing the coming sequel, so the first film already proved out as a launch pad for the new film DCU. No. If you want to give a movie credit for the Superman & Batman movie, thank _Avengers_, not _Man of Steel_. _Man of Steel_ simply failed to be so catastrophically bad as to kill Warner Bros.'/DC’s aspirations of making their own Marvel Cinematic Universe. ---
**Author:** ![drastic\_quench](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e36b37/32.png) [@drastic\_quench](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drastic_quench)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/45 "2014-02-03T06:58:37Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > No. If you want to give a movie credit for the Superman & Batman movie, thank _Avengers_, not _Man of Steel_. _Man of Steel_ simply failed to be so catastrophically bad as to kill Warner Bros.'/DC’s aspirations of making their own Marvel Cinematic Universe. I see what you’re getting at, but it doesn’t work that way. There’s no way DC/WB would have launched right into hugely expensive and risky a group flick without at least one bankable solo movie - which was Man of Steel. It was supposed to be Green Lantern. After that tanked, the plans of retaining Bale as Batman for a Justice League movie (using GL as a springboard ala Iron Man) were shot. So MoS was their last chance, and it payed off. It’s right in league with Iron Man 1’s numbers 318 million to 291 million for MoS. That bankable success gets WB a serious shot at Avenger money - north of 600 million. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/46 "2014-02-03T07:37:48Z")
> [@drastic\_quench](#): > > There’s no way DC/WB would have launched right into hugely expensive and risky a group flick without at least one bankable solo movie Which is far too few. They’re trying to fast-track what Marvel did with patience, a long term strategy, and vision. > [@](#): > > It’s right in league with Iron Man 1’s numbers 318 million to 291 million for MoS. Marvel got those numbers with a character that- outside of comic book readers- people didn’t know. Superman is pretty much _the_ comic book superhero. He’s an American icon. _Man of Steel_ should have beat _Iron Man_ on name recognition alone. I’m sure you’re sincere in your fondness for _Man of Steel_ and lots of other people liked it too, but lots of people didn’t. _Man of Steel_’s box office came from being a well hyped familiar property being released in the summer. It didn’t get much word of mouth support. It didn’t _excite_ people the way the first Iron Man movie did (or Nolan’s Batman movies for that matter). Again, for all I know the Superman/Batman movie is going to be awesome. But the lack of confidence that so many people have in the project is well founded. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/47 "2014-02-03T14:07:06Z")
Shouldn’t you actually _watch the film_ before making decisions as to whether an actor is right for the part? People were whining about Michael Keaton until the day after the film came out, after all. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/48 "2014-02-03T14:55:39Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Shouldn’t you actually _watch the film_ before making decisions as to whether an actor is right for the part? People were whining about Michael Keaton until the day after the film came out, after all. Can I now decide that Ben Affleck is the wrong choice if you’re shooting a Daredevil movie? Because I’ve seen him try to use a scary voice as the most intimidating masked vigilante in NYC, and, man, he ain’t right for the part. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/49 "2014-02-03T17:46:25Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Shouldn’t you actually _watch the film_ before making decisions as to whether an actor is right for the part? I’m on record as saying the new movie may well be awesome but, again, this is the second film in a series. People have the first film upon which to base their level of confidence in the creative team for this series. Some people liked _Man of Steel_ and have high hopes for the series going forward. Other people thought _Man of Steel_ was a mess and based upon _watching the film_ have very little confidence that this series will be well executed. For the record, I think Jesse Eisenberg is a great actor and could really surprise people by being a great Luthor. It was the whole “And we’re going to put Wonder Woman in the movie too!!!” announcement that finally squashed the little bit of benefit of doubt I was willing to grant. It definitely sounds like they’re trying to get their own _Avengers_ success without putting in the hard work and thoughtful planning that made it work for Marvel. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/50 "2014-02-03T18:10:26Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > It was the whole “And we’re going to put Wonder Woman in the movie too!!!” announcement that finally squashed the little bit of benefit of doubt I was willing to grant. It definitely sounds like they’re trying to get their own _Avengers_ success without putting in the hard work and thoughtful planning that made it work for Marvel. Don’t forget the “And a cameo from The Flash!” announcement. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/51 "2014-02-03T18:28:49Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > For the record, I think Jesse Eisenberg is a great actor and could really surprise people by being a great Luthor. It was the whole “And we’re going to put Wonder Woman in the movie too!!!” announcement that finally squashed the little bit of benefit of doubt I was willing to grant. It definitely sounds like they’re trying to get their own _Avengers_ success without putting in the hard work and thoughtful planning that made it work for Marvel. Right. Jesse Eisenberg is great at playing assholes, and what is Lex Luthor but a giant asshole? I have no problem imagining Mark Zuckerberg as the most evil man on Earth. Say you wanted to control everyone on the planet - how would you do it? Collect every bit of information about them and addict them. This is a brilliant piece of casting. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/52 "2014-02-03T18:28:51Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Don’t forget the “And a cameo from The Flash!” announcement. :smack: I didn’t know that until just now reading your post! Where’s the pukey smilie when you need it!?!?!? ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/53 "2014-02-03T19:29:46Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > I blame it all on Richard Donner, or Ilya Salkind, or Mario Puzo, or whoever the genius was who decided way back in the original conception of **Superman: The Movie** that Gene Hackman would play Luthor as more of a genial con man (with hair) Hackman’s Luthor was as bald as the comic books version - he just wore a piece, which came off when he was captured. ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/54 "2014-02-03T19:39:03Z")
The movie is going to suck, undoubtedly, but not because of Irons and Eisenberg. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/55 "2014-02-03T21:53:35Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > Hackman’s Luthor was as bald as the comic books version - he just wore a piece, which came off when he was captured. Fair enough, but in MY mind, Luthor never wears a toupee. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/56 "2014-02-03T21:56:00Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > Fair enough, but in MY mind, Luthor never wears a toupee. If it was good enough for Elliot S! Maggin, it’s good enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2014, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/57 "2014-02-04T00:20:45Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > Right. Jesse Eisenberg is great at playing assholes, and what is Lex Luthor but a giant asshole? Lex Luthor is Captain Ahab - a great man with major character flaws. You can’t just shove Jim Carrey into the role and expect him to fit on the basis that they’re both jerks. Lex Luthor needs to have charisma and conviction, to be the kind of man who would oppose a god. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2014, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/58 "2014-02-04T02:54:03Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > Lex Luthor is Captain Ahab - a great man with major character flaws. And that’s different from a giant asshole in what way? > [@](#): > > You can’t just shove Jim Carrey into the role and expect him to fit on the basis that they’re both jerks. Good thing that didn’t cast Jim Carey then. > [@](#): > > Lex Luthor needs to have charisma and conviction, to be the kind of man who would oppose a god. As I said, Jesse Eisenberg is a far better actor than people give him credit to be. Check out his work in _Zombieland_. ---
**Author:** ![drastic\_quench](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e36b37/32.png) [@drastic\_quench](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drastic_quench)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2014, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/59 "2014-02-04T03:17:03Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > As I said, Jesse Eisenberg is a far better actor than people give him credit to be. Check out his work in _Zombieland_. No, no. The Squid and the Whale is his best performance. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2014, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222/60 "2014-02-04T03:28:11Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > And that’s different from a giant asshole in what way? It’s different because there are different _types_ of asshole. There are zealots and fratboys and used car salesmen, and their assholishness is going to to show itself in vastly different ways. It’s the same reason why Reginald Hudlin’s infamous portrayal of Doctor Doom sucked. > [@](#): > > As I said, Jesse Eisenberg is a far better actor than people give him credit to be. Check out his work in _Zombieland_. I _have_ seen _Zombieland_. I remain unconvinced. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/batman-vs-superman-jesse-eisenberg-is-lex-luthor-jeremy-irons-is-alfred/680222.md?page=4)