# Battlestar Galactica 2.13 — "Epiphanies" (there will be spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 20, 2006, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878 "2006-01-20T20:16:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![MaddyStrut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dbc845/32.png) [@MaddyStrut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaddyStrut)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/101 "2006-01-24T01:49:50Z")
I think the cylons are “born” as adults if only because the shots from the resurrection ship seemed to show a bunch of six models all in some sort of holding stalls. Maybe that’s where they hang out while not on duty, but it makes more sense that those are models awaiting download. As for why older people can’t be cylons: 1) it keeps Adama, Roslyn, and Tigh from turning out to be cylons (which would really suck) and 2) people remember them from before cylons had human-like models. I tend to think cylon models aren’t based on existing humans but for no reason other than I just prefer it that way. I didn’t think Starbuck was looking at the whole in her viper window so much as looking at Kat’s viper (probably worrying that it would explode or be uncontrollable). Or maybe it’s like me and that stupid gravel break on my car windshield. It’s slowly growing, and I can’t stop looking at the damned thing. I’ll take a “wait and see” approach to the magical baby blood. But if I have to hear Grace Park scream “my baaaaaaby” at any point, I’m going to throw my dog at the TV! ---
**Author:** ![MaddyStrut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dbc845/32.png) [@MaddyStrut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaddyStrut)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/102 "2006-01-24T01:51:39Z")
> [@MaddyStrut](#): > > …I’m going to throw my dog at the TV! Err, my DRINK! :smack: I’m going to throw my DRINK at the TV. I don’t know why I typed “dog.” :smack: Great. Now I’m going to have the ASPCA on my ass. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/103 "2006-01-24T01:55:51Z")
> [@MaddyStrut](#): > > Now I’m going to have the ASPCA on my ass. :smack: Depends upon the dog. And it’s ASPCAES. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/104 "2006-01-24T02:08:10Z")
> [@Grossbottom](#): > > We know six of the twelve. Gina/Six, Sharon/Boomer, Doral (PR guy), Leoben (ammo depot guy), the **Australian reporter** chick (what was her name), and Simon the Creepy Ovary Doctor. …AHEM. _New Zealand_ reporter, thank you very much! ( Via Caprica, of course… 😉 ) ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/105 "2006-01-24T02:10:54Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#): > > I thought it was established that the Cylons were _more_ vulnerable to radiation than humans are–back in the miniseries, on that planet inside the “ion storm” (or whatever the frak it was) where they went to resupply and found a “Leoben Conoy” model. No, like **levdrakon** said, that was unique to that particular form of radiation. **carnivorousplant** , I see where you’re coming from about Adama not being a Cylon, but I don’t think it proves wether Cylons have childhoods one way or the other. They could be made fully grown, and still not be able to impersonate specific real humans for all the reasons I laid out in my post to **Gaspode**. Plus, the implication behind the whole eternal life through downloading to new bodies that the Cylons have going implies that their new bodies are fully adult when they wake up again. Of course, I suppose it’s possible that the bodies start off as children and grow up in a pod until they’re ready for a download… ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/106 "2006-01-24T02:46:57Z")
I think **Miller** is right about all Cylons being “adult” models. Baby Cylons don’t make sense if they are so fascinated with “breeding.” Besides: Spoilers for an upcoming episode involve Boomer after she is assassinated, being rebooted on Caprica.as mentioned by **Cervaise** above. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/107 "2006-01-24T03:06:14Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > I think **Miller** is right about all Cylons being “adult” models. So I wonder how they make them. Are they assembled from seperately grown parts, like Dr. Frankenstein assembled his monster? Are they grown from a lump of goop? Do they hatch fully grown like Orcs? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/108 "2006-01-24T03:08:18Z")
“Organically deposited material?” Maybe they’re grown in tanks like sea monkeys? Who knows? Hopefully Moore will either tell us, or leave it unseen but known. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/109 "2006-01-24T03:26:08Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Maybe they’re grown in tanks like sea monkeys? Sea Mnkeys are brine shrimp and hatch from eggs. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/110 "2006-01-24T04:03:22Z")
I stand by my analogy. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/111 "2006-01-24T04:14:48Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > I stand by my analogy. 😃 As you should. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/112 "2006-01-24T05:01:28Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > About the Cylon cancer cure. If you think about it, this really didn’t come entirely out of left fielf. The Cylons nuked Caprica, and it’s been established that humans need a regular supply of anti-rad medications to survive there. But the Cylons clearly intend to re-occupy the planet, and there are lots of human models walking around down there. Either they plan to take regular anti-radiation supplements for the rest of their lives while they’re down there, or something in Cylon physiology makes them immune to the effects of the radiation, which could extend to some agent in their blood retarding tumor growth. Heck, it might have been part of the original design concept, with the long-term intent of nuking Caprica until they’re the only people who can safely live there. iirc there was a scene on Caprica where Boomer is skipping her anti rad meds saying she already took them or something…pretty sure she was only taking them to fool Helo. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/113 "2006-01-24T06:59:25Z")
> [@](#): > > As for why older people can’t be cylons: 1) it keeps Adama, Roslyn, and Tigh from turning out to be cylons (which would really suck) and 2) people remember them from before cylons had human-like models. I tend to think cylon models aren’t based on existing humans but for no reason other than I just prefer it that way. From what we’ve seen so far, it seems pretty clear that each Cylon model is an original entity not based on any previously existing person. Boomer seems quite insistent that she IS Sharon Valerii, which implies that there never was a real person of that name. The model was integrated into Colonial society with an untraceable backstory (born on a now-abandoned mining colony and her parents are dead), and the other humanoid Cylons were probably moved into place in a similar fashion. The 12 models were probably designed long before the attack, probably making it near impossible for them to have planned on replacing specific persons within the remnant of society. ---
**Author:** ![stochastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e19b73/32.png) [@stochastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stochastic)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/114 "2006-01-24T07:04:11Z")
> [@Critical1](#): > > iirc there was a scene on Caprica where Boomer is skipping her anti rad meds saying she already took them or something…pretty sure she was only taking them to fool Helo. It’s always bugged that no technical explanation is given as to why Baltar would need a nuke to build a Cylon detector, but in light of **Critical1 and Miller’s** observations it makes sense: only cylon blood could withstand being passed through a detector using a high radiation source; normal human blood would be destroyed in such a detector. It also helps explain why Baltar was fretting over how long it would take to screen all the blood samples with his detector: each sample probably needs to be exposed to the source for a minimum amount of time to receive enough rads for the test to be valid. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/115 "2006-01-24T07:04:50Z")
> [@Critical1](#): > > iirc there was a scene on Caprica where Boomer is skipping her anti rad meds saying she already took them or something…pretty sure she was only taking them to fool Helo. Some people disagree with me about this, but there was also the part when Boomer said “they don’t work as well now, huh?” That was after Helo found out about Boomer, they were on the run and he was showing signs of radiation sickness. It seemed to me that Boomer had been “luckily” finding Cylon anti-radiation meds, but once they were on the run, he had to rely on regular human anti-radiation meds that didn’t work as well. So I got the impression Cylons have better meds for it. I don’t expect Ron Moore will ever go back & clarify that, though. ---
**Author:** ![Scupper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Scupper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scupper)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 8:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/116 "2006-01-24T08:40:39Z")
Okay, kids. Here comes my recently-ramped-up (all 26 eps plus the miniseries in about a week) overconfident rookie analysis! First, a prediction: It would be very sad for Chief Tyrol if he took solace in the arms of Callie … because **Callie is a toaster. Possibly a four-slicer.** 1. She conveniently killed Boomer[sub]1[/sub] before she could be examined or interrogated fully. 2. She suddenly lost her nerve at just the right juncture to force Baltar to “be a man” and learn how self destructive and awful humans are. And Six seemed awfully happy about that. 3. She had no loyalty or gratitude for Baltar’s actions, just used them to blackmail him when it was convenient. 4. She is very protective of the Chief, one of the “cylon lovers.” 5. She sure did recover fast from the bullet to the gut she took on board the _Astral Queen_, didn’t she? Of course, Adama did too, but we don’t see him slogging through the forests of Kobol right after… well, nevermind about Adama, we’re talking about Callie, here. 6. She’s only been in the fleet a short time, having joined up “to pay for dental school” or, as we say on the thirteenth colony, “to betray and murder the human race.” Now, while you are still reeling from my powerful and insightful analysis, some general opinions: I personally found the first season to be more powerful than the second has been, with the exception of Ressurrection Ship Pt. 1, which was fantastic. Roslin is my favorite character and I am retroactively infuriated that she did not even get nominated for an Emmy. I am very glad I started watching this show, even this late in the game, but I’m going to be mighty pissed if this superbaby crap gets a lot of attention. I wouldn’t pay much attention to the “only 12 cylon models” thing. I mean, it’s not like they can’t lie. Anyway, the cylons are so religion-obsessed, that I’m pretty sure they have a special model for the 13th colony. Maybe that’s Pop Tart. I dunno. But it seems to me that blowing a whole cylon model on Lucy Lawless’s guest shot would be awfully wasteful down the line. Yes, Six with natural hair is much, much hotter than platinum blonde Six. But Sharon’s still cuter, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2006, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/117 "2006-01-24T16:46:30Z")
> [@Scupper](#): > > (all 26 eps plus the miniseries in about a week) Welcome! > [@Scupper](#): > > **Callie is a toaster.** Noooooo! Actually, you’re right; of all the supporting characters, she’s probably the most likely suspect for a revelation of Cylonhood. Still, I’d be crushed, because Cally is Teh Cut3ne55. > [@Scupper](#): > > Six with natural hair is much, much hotter than platinum blonde Six. Word. ---
**Author:** ![HelloKitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecccb3/32.png) [@HelloKitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HelloKitty)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2006, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/118 "2006-01-25T01:12:48Z")
> [@Grossbottom](#): > > Even though I rated this epidode a bit low, someone lent me the first season of ‘24’ this weekend. Gahh. Makes you appreciate even a lukewarm episode of BSG. Thaaaaat’s interesting…I was just thinking of trying to procure some DVD’s of the first season of **24** , thinking maybe it is of comparable quality to BSG. Thanks for the heads up!! ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2006, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/119 "2006-01-25T01:50:00Z")
> [@HelloKitty](#): > > thinking maybe it is of comparable quality to BSG. Thanks for the heads up!! Well, they know a little more about computer networking than Ron Moore… 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2006, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878/120 "2006-01-25T03:09:39Z")
> [@HelloKitty](#): > > Thaaaaat’s interesting…I was just thinking of trying to procure some DVD’s of the first season of **24** , thinking maybe it is of comparable quality to BSG. Thanks for the heads up!! Watch it on A&E. Admiral Cain is in season two. 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-2-13-epiphanies-there-will-be-spoilers/340878.md?page=5)