# Battlestar Galactica 3.5 - "Collaborators" (spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 27, 2006, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117 "2006-10-27T14:29:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/141 "2006-10-29T14:46:31Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] But the Cylon invasion changed everything! [/QUOTE] Why do you hate the Twelve Colonies? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/142 "2006-10-29T17:10:03Z")
[QUOTE=Oakminster] The problem of what to do with Hera seems to me a political rather than a military issue. Rosilyn promoted Adama to Admiral, so I get the impression that the Colonial Military is subject to some degree of civilian authority. [/quote] Normally the military would be subject to civilian authority, but this is a special - and sometimes silly - situation. If Roz has the authority to promote Adama then at the first sign of trouble with Cain she should have just promoted him above her. Whatever rank that would be. Uber-Admiral? Super-duper Uber Fleet Admiral? I could argue Hera is a military issue though. Helo is military. Boomer is military _and_ Cylon. Hera is half-Cylon. Seems very much a military issue to me. > [@](#): > > It could be that Adama was not in the loop because Rosilyn determined he had no need to know. He might not like that choice, but as a career military man, I think he’d accept it…just as he accepted Baltar’s decision to colonize New Caprica, even though he disagreed. Could be, but those two have really blurred the lines already between what’s military and what’s civilian/political. Early in the series they made it clear military decisions are Adama’s and Adama’s alone. But by the end of season two Adama was willing to submit to civilian authority. Now at the beginning of season three Roz & Zarek seem to have confirmed you only get to play president if Adama says you get to play president. Zarek was screwed anyway though. Adama came pretty close to saying “your presidency is over.” But Roslyn, with her greater knowledge of the Articles, already had him cornered. He didn’t have the authority to try, convict and execute collaborators without legal representation. She could have initiated impeachment proceedings anyway I guess, and Adama was more than willing to toss him jail and if Roz gave him legal reason to do so, it was a slam-dunk. I’m almost surprised they even bothered offering him the VP. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/143 "2006-10-29T17:28:04Z")
[QUOTE=Lightray] I _still_ say that frack makes more sense, since the “c” gives it more similarity to what it’s replacing. [/QUOTE] Frak is a four-letter word. As far as I know, the only off-color words that have five-letters are “bitch,” “pussy,” “prick,” “fucko,” and “boxey.” ---
**Author:** ![Balduran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cc9497/32.png) [@Balduran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balduran)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/144 "2006-10-29T17:42:57Z")
[QUOTE=Loopydude] With mountains of info. right at his fingertips that could have shown without a shadow of a doubt that _he_ made it possible? Even if they didn’t know about the precise mechanism of drop off, he could have convinced anyone if he was simply willing to explain it beyond “I helped you from the inside!” Any common member of the Cylon’s human police force would of course use that excuse, but what would set Gaeta apart is the very precise information that he shared with the insurgency, the reams of documents, and all their content. I just can’t buy it. I can’t see how anyone could. [/QUOTE] Day late I know, but I want to play devil’s fanwank on this one. I bet pretty much the only proof he has that he was the informant is the dogbowl. All the other specific details he knows, others would just assume he knew about them because he was there (or he read the reports of the insurgent strikes). It doesn’t necessarily mean that he was the one who passed the information on. Perhaps they assumed it was somebody working under Gaeta who stole the information from him to pass on. Then, after the fact Gaeta pretended it was him who was passing it to save his own ass. This seems a more plausable interpretation when you remember that at this point people hated Gaeta, their first reaction would be to disbelieve him. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/145 "2006-10-29T18:17:51Z")
[QUOTE=levdrakon] If Roz has the authority to promote Adama then at the first sign of trouble with Cain she should have just promoted him above her. [/QUOTE] Or demoted her. [QUOTE=levdrakon] I could argue Hera is a military issue though. Helo is military. Boomer is military _and_ Cylon. Hera is half-Cylon. Seems very much a military issue to me. [/QUOTE] Seems dangerously close to locking George Takaei and his family up here in Arkansas in '42 because they were Japanese. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![middleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9a140/32.png) [@middleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/middleman)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/146 "2006-10-29T18:50:04Z")
[QUOTE=Balduran] Day late I know, but I want to play devil’s fanwank on this one. I bet pretty much the only proof he has that he was the informant is the dogbowl. All the other specific details he knows, others would just assume he knew about them because he was there (or he read the reports of the insurgent strikes). It doesn’t necessarily mean that he was the one who passed the information on. Perhaps they assumed it was somebody working under Gaeta who stole the information from him to pass on. Then, after the fact Gaeta pretended it was him who was passing it to save his own ass. This seems a more plausable interpretation when you remember that at this point people hated Gaeta, their first reaction would be to disbelieve him. [/QUOTE] But he could offer WHAT was passed before he was interrogated about it. Ex.- Don Rumsfeld knows what memos are drafted in the Pentagon, but he doesn’t know which ONES have been passed to the New York Times. One other thing: I hope they play up the fact that Adama cannot understand what the NC’s are feeling because he wasn’t there. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/147 "2006-10-29T18:57:15Z")
[QUOTE=Merijeek] Oh, wah. What you write is massive assumptions based on compressed timeframes because writers aren’t specifically demonstrating which particular bugaboo you happen to want to try to find fault about at any given moment. Then you complain when your assumptions crumble under cursory logic. I’m glad you’re done nitpicking now. Hopefully the threads will be more entertaining. -Joe [/QUOTE] Anyways, before I continue reading the rest of the thread there’s something I want to say. I think **Loopydude** is being an irritating, whining nitpicker who will never be satisfied. However, when I wrote the above I was in remarkable pain and was being a total asshole - way above and beyond the call of duty, and for that I apologize to **LD**. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/148 "2006-10-29T19:03:39Z")
[QUOTE=carnivorousplant] Or demoted her. [/QUOTE] Yeah, good luck with that. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/149 "2006-10-29T19:08:52Z")
[QUOTE=carnivorousplant] Seems dangerously close to locking George Takaei and his family up here in Arkansas in '42 because they were Japanese. 🙂 [/QUOTE] Ah, but the Cylons committed genocide against humans to a completion rate of 99.8%, and Roslyn herself considers them to be at war with the Cylons. I guess it depends how you think about it, but Roslyn got in big trouble for stealing a Cylon Raider, and really there’s not that much difference between a Raider & a Meat-bag. Or a cute little Meat-bag halfling. ---
**Author:** ![Balduran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cc9497/32.png) [@Balduran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balduran)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/150 "2006-10-29T19:10:00Z")
[QUOTE=middleman] But he could offer WHAT was passed before he was interrogated about it. Ex.- Don Rumsfeld knows what memos are drafted in the Pentagon, but he doesn’t know which ONES have been passed to the New York Times. [/QUOTE] But he could make a good guess which info has been passed after an incident has happened. Remember, this is not a population the size of the USA so there won’t be as much info flowing around. So, especially if he is as smart as everyone thinks, he will probably remember a good many of the memos being passed around. For example, the resistance gets the jamming frequency info and is able to communicate with Galactica. If later on Gaeta tells them he gave them information on the jamming frequecies they could just assume he had guessed they must of somehow gotten that info in order to be able to contact Galactica and decided to take credit for passing it on. Or maybe he suddenly recalls that a paper on his desk with Jamming info went missing and he put two and two together. ---
**Author:** ![Balduran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cc9497/32.png) [@Balduran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balduran)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/151 "2006-10-29T19:15:47Z")
What I’m trying to say is that, if he was as hated as portrayed, it would take extraordinary information for him to prove what he had done. I’m finding it easy enough to rationalise why they wouldn’t believe him and I don’t even hate him! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/152 "2006-10-29T19:24:44Z")
[QUOTE=Balduran] For example, the resistance gets the jamming frequency info and is able to communicate with Galactica. If later on Gaeta tells them he gave them information on the jamming frequecies they could just assume he had guessed they must of somehow gotten that info in order to be able to contact Galactica and decided to take credit for passing it on. Or maybe he suddenly recalls that a paper on his desk with Jamming info went missing and he put two and two together. [/QUOTE] Isn’t it a case of Occam’s Razor? You’ve got Gaeta - who you _know_ had access to the information which was passed on - and you _don’t_ have anyone else claiming they were the mysterious informant. Which is the simplest explanation? The problem is The Circle wasn’t really thinking rationally. They wanted as many people to pay as quickly as they could make them pay. Screw rationality & fairness. Sure they hated Gaeta, but they hated everyone working deep inside Baltar’s office with access to super-secret information. Would they have believed anyone, no matter what they said? ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/153 "2006-10-29T19:28:07Z")
[QUOTE=carnivorousplant] Just listened to the podcast. Gaeta and Tyrol were the only ones who knew the bowl was a signal. They didn’t know who each other were. Gaeta has been trying to tell everyone what he did, but no one believed him. Tighe was not drunk when he dissed Adama. [/QUOTE] Woohoo! I’m batting 1.000! Eat me, suckers! Regarding Kat as CAG, I don’t see why people are so hard on her. Yeah, she was an arrogant insubordinate know-it-all bitch with a god complex…but so was Galactica’s last CAG…and she was The Best CAG In The Fleet! > [@](#): > > Whilst we are on the frack vs. frak topic: anyone else miss all the other little BSGisms from the original series? Felgarcarb. Centon. Yahrn. God, no. Not even a little bit. > [@](#): > > Perhaps he will consider the legality of taking someone’s child from them. Killing Boomer was “unauthorized discharge of a firearm”, what is a half-unhuman considered? Obviously, his feelings about Boomer have changed since then, seeing as how he allowed her to marry his XO and get reinstated into the military. But back then? I think she was still being led around at the end of a shock collar. > [@](#): > > Normally the military would be subject to civilian authority, but this is a special - and sometimes silly - situation. If Roz has the authority to promote Adama then at the first sign of trouble with Cain she should have just promoted him above her. Whatever rank that would be. Uber-Admiral? Super-duper Uber Fleet Admiral? Nah. Cain had no intention of doing anything but humoring Roslin when it was convenient. When it comes down to it, The President in this situation (and in many others, sadly) is the President because the military allows it. If she’d tried to promote Adama about Cain she would have been and ex-president as fast as a team of Marines could have made it over to Colonial One. > [@](#): > > But he could offer WHAT was passed before he was interrogated about it. To whom? What if he’s passing on information to a collaborator who can then use the information when their ass is in a sling? Tell everyone your secret information and now it’s not a secret. “Omega Source passed on the prison security codes. Everyone knows that. Oh, so now you’re saying you’re Omega Source? Welcome to the airlock, toaster lover”. Finally, I can’t find out who plays Roslin’s Chief of Staff right now. She looks like a young Pam Grier with old Pam Grier’s nosejob. Anyone know her name? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/154 "2006-10-29T19:37:04Z")
[QUOTE=Merijeek] Killing Boomer was “unauthorized discharge of a firearm”, what is a half-unhuman considered? Obviously, his feelings about Boomer have changed since then, seeing as how he allowed her to marry his XO and get reinstated into the military. [/QUOTE] Obviously, it will be used as a theatrical device to cause conflict. My problem is that I’m discussing it from my sense of fairness, which got me in trouble all the way from the Cub Scouts through Graduate School. [QUOTE=Merijeek] I think she was still being led around at the end of a shock collar. [/QUOTE] Kinky. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/155 "2006-10-29T19:42:57Z")
[QUOTE=Merijeek] Nah. Cain had no intention of doing anything but humoring Roslin when it was convenient. When it comes down to it, The President in this situation (and in many others, sadly) is the President because the military allows it. If she’d tried to promote Adama about Cain she would have been and ex-president as fast as a team of Marines could have made it over to Colonial One. [/QUOTE] That’s basically my point. “Bill, I’m taking one of your officers and stealing the Cylon Raider.” “Your presidency is terminated and you’re under arrest.” “Bill, I’m promoting you to Admiral.” “I humbly submit to your civilian authority.” ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/156 "2006-10-29T20:08:13Z")
[QUOTE=Merijeek] I think **Loopydude** is being an irritating, whining nitpicker who will never be satisfied. However, when I wrote the above I was in remarkable pain and was being a total asshole - way above and beyond the call of duty, and for that I apologize to **LD**. -Joe [/QUOTE] Wow. I don’t know what to say. And by that, having seen the above words, I really don’t know what to say. Thanks, I guess, for the Hell of it. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/157 "2006-10-29T20:14:23Z")
[QUOTE=Loopydude] Wow. I don’t know what to say. And by that, having seen the above words, I really don’t know what to say. Thanks, I guess, for the Hell of it. [/QUOTE] Yup. I’m an enigma. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/158 "2006-10-29T20:20:52Z")
[QUOTE=AndyPolley] Just to be a little nit-picky…Tigh was the XO for the entire year that passed in LDYB part II. He & Elen only went down to NC on what seemed like the very day the cylons landed. Talk about bad timing. So Adama has had a different xo for about 4 months. [/QUOTE] Not at all! That is quite correct, and worthy of note. So much has changed over those four months it feels like a year or more, and Tigh is no exception. It would also be nice to learn as much as is reasonable about happened the year before, during the four months of the occupation, or both, that got Sharon out of her cell and into a Colonial uniform. At any rate, I bet going back to Tigh as assistant principal in the CIC is still going to feel like a hangover. ---
**Author:** ![MilTan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71e660/32.png) [@MilTan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MilTan)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/159 "2006-10-29T20:32:42Z")
[QUOTE=Merijeek] Finally, I can’t find out who plays Roslin’s Chief of Staff right now. She looks like a young Pam Grier with old Pam Grier’s nosejob. Anyone know her name? [/QUOTE] [Rekha Sharma](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0788907/) whose character has a decidedly non-Indian name, which confuses things. But back off. I saw her first! ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2006, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117/160 "2006-10-29T21:00:34Z")
[QUOTE=Loopydude] It would also be nice to learn as much as is reasonable about happened the year before, during the four months of the occupation, or both, that got Sharon out of her cell and into a Colonial uniform. [/QUOTE] We will. There are episodes planned that flash back to the missing year. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-3-5-collaborators-spoilers/378117.md?page=9)