# Battlestar Galactica 4.14 - "A Disquiet Follows My Soul" (spoilers ahoy) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 23, 2009, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666 "2009-01-23T17:36:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2009, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/141 "2009-01-27T15:25:07Z")
Oh, I don’t know, _Pegasus_ managed to avoid that existential pitfall. ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2009, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/142 "2009-01-27T15:36:21Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > Who would order him to do that, or why would he take it on himself to do it? Hoshi loves Gaeta and holds him on a pedestal. Once that pedestal breaks, I don’t see Hoshi turning assassin. You never know though. I’m worried that since the webisodes were filmed after the series ended, they won’t bother to continue the storyline between Hoshi and Gaeta. > [@muldoonthief](#): > > I’ve got to take issue with your continued characterization of anti-Cylon feelings as racism. To extend a metaphor used above - if you’re a Jew who hates all Germans because of WWII, that’s racism. If you’re a Jew who hates a particular person because he was a guard at Auschwitz, and most of your family was killed there, that’s _not_ racism. I think it’s more like Jews hating all Germans right after World War II. It’s justifiable racism, but still racism, or at least xenophobic nationalism. In any case the real situation is probably a mix - some people being wary and cynical of their intentions, and some people just out and out fearing them as “other”. > [@melodyharmonius](#): > > 1. Did anyone else think of Ilia and Decker from ST:TM when they saw Roslyn and Adama in bed together? It just struck me as odd. Oh, and I wish my boobs were that perky looking in bed . . .. I was thinking that same exact thing lol > [@Lightray](#): > > The odd thing is, Cylons are supposed to be stronger and tougher than humans (witness Tory smacking Cally around the airlock)… so Tyrol should’ve wiped the floor with Hotdog. Presumably, Baltar’s groupies pulled them off each other. I think they weren’t strong til they got ‘activated’. Otherwise they probably would have suspected something earlier. Did we see evidence of Boomer being strong before she remembered who she really was? > [@Lightray](#): > > Recall that the workaround discussed – and rejected – at Adama’s meeting was having only _humans_ install the stuff. So that apparently would have satisfied the Quorum. Yeah, he probably should have just went ahead and done it to the ships that were under military control or that agreed to it, and when nothing untoward happened then started pressuring the rest of the fleet. It might have been a good idea to man the mining ship with military personnel and relocate the original workers. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2009, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/143 "2009-01-27T15:38:54Z")
Indeed. The Pegasus crew was leading lives with excellent long-term prospects for happiness and fulfillment. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2009, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/144 "2009-01-27T16:11:42Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > Indeed. The Pegasus crew was leading lives with excellent long-term prospects for happiness and fulfillment. As long as they didn’t dis the Skipper. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2009, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/145 "2009-01-27T16:39:11Z")
> [@jackdavinci](#): > > Yeah, he probably should have just went ahead and done it to the ships that were under military control or that agreed to it, and when nothing untoward happened then started pressuring the rest of the fleet. It might have been a good idea to man the mining ship with military personnel and relocate the original workers. Yeah, that tylium ship. If I were Adama and/or Roslyn, I’d recognize the tylium ship and miners as one of the most important members and asset of the fleet, they’d get the best accommodations and food, there would be a permanent military presence on the ship, and I’d retrain all those reporters as deck hands and they’d swab the decks of the tylium ship until the whole thing was sparkly and sweet-smelling. There would be no way that ship, of all the ships in the fleet, could ever mutiny. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2009, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/146 "2009-01-27T16:44:56Z")
> [@jackdavinci](#): > > I think it’s more like Jews hating all Germans right after World War II. It’s justifiable racism, but still racism, or at least xenophobic nationalism. In any case the real situation is probably a mix - some people being wary and cynical of their intentions, and some people just out and out fearing them as “other”. I guess which analogy works better depends on how many skin job Cylons there are. I’ve opened a new thread asking that very question. If there are millions of them, then you can make the case that the ones with the Fleet weren’t necessarily intimately involved with the destruction of the colonies, in which case, I’ll buy your explanation. But if the Cylons on the half dozen or so basestars we’ve seen are all that exist, then they’re all completely and personally guilty of genocide against the colonies, and only a fool would trust them and accept them into Fleet (or their ships). ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2009, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/147 "2009-01-27T17:15:29Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > And what would the Galactica do without the fleet? Go off and be a military dictatorship of a couple thousand people? How long would that last? Without the fleet, the Galactica has no purpose. I didn’t say to just go off and abandon them on purpose (ala Pegasus). But Galatica is the one holding **all** the cards. Why would anyone in their right mind think that they can order Adama around? Or squabble over the _system_ in which they order Adama around? Why would a former Battlestar captain leave his post and _join_ what appears to be a gigantic facade of a political system? Because he can “do more good there”? Really? If I’m stranded and wounded in a war zone, and a military special forces team comes to rescue me, I’m not going to start making demands of them. I’m going to be grateful I got rescued, and keep my mouth shut. It’d be completely irrational of me to start barking orders, because I have zero leverage in that situation. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2009, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/148 "2009-01-27T17:23:30Z")
> [@YamatoTwinkie](#): > > But Galatica is the one holding **all** the cards. No, actually, it’s not. If Galactica’s purpose is to preserve the remnants of humanity, then those remnants actually do have a say. They can’t be preserved against their will. > [@](#): > > If I’m stranded and wounded in a war zone, and a military special forces team comes to rescue me, I’m not going to start making demands of them. I’m going to be grateful I got rescued, and keep my mouth shut. It’d be completely irrational of me to start barking orders, because I have zero leverage in that situation. Actually, this is one of the ongoing themes of the show. At some point, if an “emergency” has lasted long enough, it’s no longer an emergency and the emergency team cannot continue to exercise extraordinary power. They’ve been fleeing the Cylons for years. It’s no longer a “war zone” in which the military gets to exercise extraordinary authority. This is how life’s going to be and people cannot be subject to a military dictatorship indefinitely. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2009, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/149 "2009-01-27T17:40:00Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > Actually, this is one of the ongoing themes of the show. At some point, if an “emergency” has lasted long enough, it’s no longer an emergency and the emergency team cannot continue to exercise extraordinary power. They’ve been fleeing the Cylons for years. It’s no longer a “war zone” in which the military gets to exercise extraordinary authority. This is how life’s going to be and people cannot be subject to a military dictatorship indefinitely. It is still an emergency. It’s just a different emergency. At first, it was escape Cylons/find Earth. Now it’s an even more abstract escape Cylons/find a habitable planet out in space somewhere. People _can_ be subjected to a military dictatorship indefinitely. There are plenty examples of it right here in our world today. A military dictatorship is far more justified in the BSG scenario than it is in, say, North Korea right now, and certainly more benevolent. I don’t blame people for wanting to maintain their illusions about being a democratic society, but unfortunately, democracy has proven to be a very costly luxury for them, time and time again. ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2009, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/150 "2009-01-27T20:39:53Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > No, actually, it’s not. If Galactica’s purpose is to preserve the remnants of humanity, then those remnants actually do have a say. They can’t be preserved against their will. Yes, just like the special forces team’s purpose is to rescue me. They can’t rescue me against my will. If I start making demands, and then threaten to leave them unless my demands were met, their response would be: “um…ok. You’re obviously not thinking straight, but have it your way…” Two days later, when they come across my corpse getting picked apart by scavengers, the _other_ rescued guys know not to open their mouths again. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/151 "2009-01-28T02:41:27Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > The odd thing is, Cylons are supposed to be stronger and tougher than humans (witness Tory smacking Cally around the airlock)… so Tyrol should’ve wiped the floor with Hotdog. Presumably, Baltar’s groupies pulled them off each other. It’s quite possible that the Cylons who haven’t been switched on aren’t running at full strength. After all, if Sharon got distracted and ripped a (cornerless) phone book in half it might ruin her cover… -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/152 "2009-01-28T12:07:41Z")
I hardly even know who Hoshi is, and don’t remember a relationship between Gaeta and an Eight on New Caprica. Did I miss an episode, or is this stuff you only get from the webisodes? ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/153 "2009-01-28T13:52:53Z")
> [@Baldwin](#): > > I hardly even know who Hoshi is, and don’t remember a relationship between Gaeta and an Eight on New Caprica. Did I miss an episode, or is this stuff you only get from the webisodes? Webisodes. Or maybe it was a director’s cut special DVD. Or the approved-as-canon videogame. Or the animated series. Or… damn, I’ve been dreading this: the dawn of the Multimedia Story Line, pioneered by Star Wars, in which you can’t follow what’s going on **just by watching the damn show**. :dubious: “Mommy, why is that robot guy who kidnapped Palpatine coughing and acting weird?” ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/154 "2009-01-28T16:26:07Z")
> [@YamatoTwinkie](#): > > Yes, just like the special forces team’s purpose is to rescue me. They can’t rescue me against my will. If I start making demands, and then threaten to leave them unless my demands were met, their response would be: “um…ok. You’re obviously not thinking straight, but have it your way…” > > Two days later, when they come across my corpse getting picked apart by scavengers, the _other_ rescued guys know not to open their mouths again. You’re being sarcastic here, but I’m dead serious. You can’t rescue someone in a manner that the rescuee objects to, particularly if the rescue operation is going to last several years. At some point an emergency is no longer an emergency and self-governance is restored. ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/155 "2009-01-28T17:22:39Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > You’re being sarcastic here, but I’m dead serious. You can’t rescue someone in a manner that the rescuee objects to, particularly if the rescue operation is going to last several years. At some point an emergency is no longer an emergency and self-governance is restored. Wishful thinking and directly contrary to the premises of the show. Self-governance is a meaningless ploy in the current BSG situation; you go where the refuelling ship go, or you don’t go anywhere at all. The Galactica has the guns and know-how to blow the refueling ship out of the sky or to occupy it with a unified force loyal to the Galactica. Only the necessity of maintaining the barest vestiges of a democratic process has kept Adama from broaching this threat, lest a mutiny should become a realistic proposition. The obvious choice for Adama to quell the mutiny would be to invade the refueling ship, disable the FTL, point all guns at it and say “my way or the highway.” That is, if he’s convinced he’s right. The mutineers know that - that’s why their first act of mutiny was to attempt to isolate and secure the refuelling ship. That didn’t work and that is why this mutiny is essentially already hopeless, unless they assassinate and transplant the Adamas and Roslin. (Which is what I would do in their situation.) ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/156 "2009-01-28T19:14:56Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > At some point an emergency is no longer an emergency and self-governance is restored. People don’t just have self-government for the sake of having government. Government exists to provide services to the people. What does the existing Colonial1-based government provide? I can’t really notice much, and whatever it does do is absolutely dwarfed by Galactica. Again, it really goes back to my question that nobody seemed to want to take a stab at yet. Why did Apollo feel he’d be more useful as a government official than as a CAG? Even best case scenerio, what did he _think_ he’d be doing? Being really awesome at spinning questions for “the press?” Being a really inspiring council member? What good is **any** of that the second a Cylon fleet shows up? I think Ron Moore was more interested in creating a “West Wing in space” than he was coming up with a plausible government system given the situation. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/157 "2009-01-28T19:17:34Z")
> [@Gukumatz](#): > > Wishful thinking and directly contrary to the premises of the show. Self-governance is a meaningless ploy in the current BSG situation; you go where the refuelling ship go, or you don’t go anywhere at all. The Galactica has the guns and know-how to blow the refueling ship out of the sky or to occupy it with a unified force loyal to the Galactica. Only the necessity of maintaining the barest vestiges of a democratic process has kept Adama from broaching this threat, lest a mutiny should become a realistic proposition. One has to wonder why an emergency can’t last several years, first of all. Every opportunity The People has had to assert their right to self-governance has ended in disaster. At this point, perhaps Adama should end the charade and just declare martial law. Not sure why it even took him so long, except all signs point to him being a huge softie. Every meaningful officer he has has committed some form of mutiny or blatant disregard of orders, yet no one ever suffers lasting consequences. He just isn’t mean enough. Sadly, it’s come to open mutiny now. It’ll be interesting to see if how he will quell this latest uprising, and if he’ll finally be tough enough to dole out meaningful consequences. > [@](#): > > That didn’t work and that is why this mutiny is essentially already hopeless, unless they assassinate and transplant the Adamas and Roslin. (Which is what I would do in their situation.) Hmmm. You’re right, that would be the only thing that would put power permanently into the rebels’ hands. Will they have the balls to do it? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/158 "2009-01-28T19:30:24Z")
> [@YamatoTwinkie](#): > > Why did Apollo feel he’d be more useful as a government official than as a CAG? He wasn’t thinking about being useful, but about showing his independence - as long as he was his father’s subordinate, he’d never see himself as a grown-up man. [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/159 "2009-01-28T20:56:02Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > He wasn’t thinking about being useful, but about showing his independence - as long as he was his father’s subordinate, he’d never see himself as a grown-up man. I think that answer is pure rubbish given how pathetic his job&responsibilities are now in comparison to what they used to be. I don’t think any “grown-up man” would make that decision, given the daily life-or-death struggle they seem to find themselves in. Anyway, I distinctly remember Apollo giving the “I think I can do more good there” reason to Adama when he decided to give up his wings. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666/160 "2009-01-28T21:01:02Z")
> [@YamatoTwinkie](#): > > I think that answer is pure rubbish given how pathetic his job&responsibilities are now in comparison to what they used to be. I don’t think any “grown-up man” would make that decision, given the daily life-or-death struggle they seem to find themselves in. Anyway, I distinctly remember Apollo giving the “I think I can do more good there” reason to Adama when he decided to give up his wings. IMO Lee’s always been kind of an idiot, so ElvisL1ves’ answer works for me. Of course, Lee would have to rationalize his adolescent rebellion with some grandiose altruistic pretense about “doing good.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-14-a-disquiet-follows-my-soul-spoilers-ahoy/482666.md?page=9)