# Battlestar Galactica 4.17 - "No Exit" (spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 13, 2009, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696 "2009-02-13T16:22:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/261 "2009-02-18T04:58:51Z")
Yeah, Cavil destroyed the mass batch of 7s, but did he destroy the original? He evidently interacted with the 7 enough to develop a jealousy complex about him. ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/262 "2009-02-18T05:18:48Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > WTF? When Felix got back to The Bucket and had the remains of his leg chopped off. While he was recuperating, he started his little chanting/singing thing. Yeah, I guess it could have been interpreted as having a Jewish “sound” to it (not that I am more than passing familiar with Jewish songs, from movies and TV and stuff). ---
**Author:** ![melodyharmonius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/melodyharmonius/32/21310_2.png) [@melodyharmonius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/melodyharmonius)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/263 "2009-02-18T05:25:11Z")
Sorry - to me some of the melodies remind me of the Jewish songs I used to hear my neighbors sing - they are beautiful to me. [Here’s a youtube of his singing](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3gUY940chg&NR=1) ---
**Author:** ![melodyharmonius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/melodyharmonius/32/21310_2.png) [@melodyharmonius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/melodyharmonius)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/264 "2009-02-18T05:31:48Z")
okay - so i have a thought. So Kara Thrace is the “Harbinger of Death” right? and Daniel is dead, right? But if she were the offspring or mutant formation of the dead Cylon - would that link up? ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/265 "2009-02-18T12:00:21Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > Separate Resurrection Hub: Boom! > Starbuck is a Cylon model: Boom! LOL… but even though Cavil made them resurrect in the basestar, their original resurrection station might still be out there - in orbit around Earth, or in their subluminal ship, or in their resurrection lab at the ‘colony’. I’m hoping they will be able to use one of these to resurrect Anders should he flatline. And It’s possible the #7 has something to do with Starbuck… > [@Rich\_Mann](#): > > So all of Cavil’s moral indignation over the rebel Cylon’s looking for the final five was pure hypocrisy? Yeah, sounds about right for him. I’m really really confused about this… Was this really the same Cavil that was in this episode? It would seem so, since they both were with Boomer. But didn’t Deanna kill that Cavil on the Hub with Boomer watching? Somebody _please_ explain this to me. > [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Where did Boomer get the raptor and how does she know the location of Galactica? I think they got the raptor when she defected or maybe when Baltar was exiled? > [@Rubystreak](#): > > How could he? There is no rezzing anymore, which is why Cavil wanted to lay open Ellen’s head, to find out how to rebuild that technology. Ellen said, even if she had her equipment back on “the colony,” she couldn’t use it without all of the Five working together. Their original resurrection ship may still be out there… > [@Lightray](#): > > Here’s what I find myself wondering: Remember when we first met Ellen Tigh? Lying, conniving, selfish, willing to let others suffer as long as she got what she wanted? _That_ Ellen Tigh, whom we all loathed? Wow original Ellen was completely different person, and very likeable. And quite worthy of the ‘final five’ reverence. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > I did not interpret John’s comment about “having seen it” as proof of Oedipality. Well they had sex with each other on New Caprica before Ellen and before she got her memories back. > [@alphaboi867](#): > > If it’s not really our Earth then there’s another planet out there with a continent that looks just like North America. We saw a glimpse in All Along the Watchtower right after Kara went through the wormhole (another thing to be explained. They might not be the same planet. We haven’t seen any earth-like pictures of the planet since they’ve actually been there. And there was Kara’s comment about a ‘yellow moon’. > [@Merijeek](#): > > Is there any reason to believe that Daniel-the-prototype didn’t survive? His _line_ got sabotaged, but that doesn’t mean the first one didn’t I was wondering this too. Although when they non-permanently boxed Deanna they killed off all the preexisting copies first. So maybe Daniel got boxed and _then_ sabotaged. > [@Uosdwis\_R.Dewoh](#): > > Anders mentioned that the final five got warning signs of the cylon attack on the colonies in the form of people nobody else could see. > [@Hellestal](#): > > I replayed the exposition scene when the nurse interrupts. This is what Anders says: “Back on earth, the warning signs that we got, it looked different to each one of us. I saw a woman. Tori, you saw a man. Funny, no one, no one else could see them. Galen, you thought that (nurse interrupts, hard to hear) that you had- had a chip in your head.” Yeah, and he also mentioned something about ‘angels’. I would guess that the final five’s visions and Baltar and Six’s head versions of each other are related phenomena. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/266 "2009-02-18T12:39:33Z")
I think ‘Daniel’ has got to have something to do with Starbuck, because: 1. The whole “what is Starbuck” thing is not even close to resolved. 2. The use of an unlikely term like “artistic” in an episode that was so thick with exposition that there was hardly time to take a breath. An artistic Cylon? Why throw something like that out there unless it connected some other dots? 3. There’s no questioning who is the artistic person on the show. Starbuck painting the Eye of Jupiter was a minor multi-episode arc. Nobody else has even picked up a crayon, IIRC. I’m positive it was calculated. The only question is whether it was a calculated misdirection or not. We’ll find out soon enough. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/267 "2009-02-18T16:21:32Z")
I’m sorry if I’ve missed anyone mentioning it in this thread, but FWIW, someone on the BSG LJ group pointed out that there is a character named Daniel in the new series _Caprica_. So, again, FWIW, I think a lot of the speculation about anyone we already know being Daniel is destined to be fruitless. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/268 "2009-02-18T16:36:22Z")
Post-spoiler label: That spoiler is a minor fact about the upcoming spinoff series _Caprica._ Please, people, **label** the spoilers so we know what’s in them. It’s not that hard. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/269 "2009-02-18T16:54:48Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > Post-spoiler label: That spoiler is a minor fact about the upcoming spinoff series _Caprica._ > > Please, people, **label** the spoilers so we know what’s in them. It’s not that hard. My apologies. I’m new to the idea of being in on something about BSG that everybody else doesn’t already take for granted, having watched practically the entire series in the last 6 months or so. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/270 "2009-02-18T20:56:18Z")
> [@KneadToKnow](#): > > I’m sorry if I’ve missed anyone mentioning it in this thread, but FWIW, someone on the BSG LJ group pointed out that there is > > a character named Daniel in the new series _Caprica_. > > So, again, FWIW, I think a lot of the speculation about anyone we already know being Daniel is destined to be fruitless. Potential spoilers for **Caprica** Right, Daniel Graystone, the creator of the original Cylon Centurions, but he can’t be number 7. The Five didn’t arrive until after the war had begun and didn’t create the skinjobs until after the Cimtar Armistice. ---
**Author:** ![Lightray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightray/32/391_2.png) [@Lightray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightray)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2009, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/271 "2009-02-18T21:44:36Z")
Continuing the **Caprica** digression, and spoilers thereof: [spoiler]Daniel Graystone has also been described as a scientist or technocrat; not as an artist. However, from Moore’s podcast we know that #7 Daniel ties back to Caprica… it is possible that #7 was modeled on Daniel Graystone the same way that #1 was modeled on Ellen’s father, John. From what has been leaked, it seems that the Centurion AIs are based on the minds of Graystone’s daughter and what would have been Bill Adama’s sister, I think. Graystone was apparently motivated to restore these dead girls to life – leading to the Centurions, and eventually to the Hybrids… I’m wondering if the basestar Hybrids are based on Graystone’s daughter, then?[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/272 "2009-02-19T17:32:31Z")
Re: the **podcast** : Hulu lays the podcast over the episode, calls it “enhanced,” and streams it, usually the Wednesday after the ep first airs. No downloading needed. You may need to subscribe to the BSG clips to get them in your queue (as opposed to just full episodes). [No Exit (enhanced)](http://www.hulu.com/watch/58157/battlestar-galactica-no-exit-enhanced) Oh, and Moore always mentions what he’s drinking (been on a bourbon kick lately) , but he’s done the last few in a non-smoking cabin in Tahoe. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/273 "2009-02-19T18:41:58Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Pffft. > > #7 is Kara Thrace. See, it’s **Danielle.** Starbuck is sensitive and artistic. It’s right in front of you, so obvious that now nobody will believe it and it’s the right time for them to pull the obvious. My money is still on Kara being Athena The Lord of Kobol. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/274 "2009-02-19T19:07:17Z")
> [@Cosmic Relief](#): > > 1. There’s no questioning who is the artistic person on the show. Starbuck painting the Eye of Jupiter was a minor multi-episode arc. Nobody else has even picked up a crayon, IIRC. Well, Felix was a pretty good singer, and perhaps dancer… ---
**Author:** ![Rusalka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecd19e/32.png) [@Rusalka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rusalka)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/275 "2009-02-19T21:46:59Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > The Final Five (along with the 13th Tribe) were all Cylons. For Kara to be able to resurrect like them, but be a mere human would imply that _all humans (ie the other 12 tribes) are really Cylons_. :eek: But, I thought that was the point, the 13th tribe was human, and they just invented resurrection technology. ?? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/276 "2009-02-19T21:52:19Z")
No, the 13th Tribe, the Earth residents (us?), were Cylons. They had abandoned resurrection in favor of procreation (it’s more fun). The Five were researchers who resurrected resurrection. ---
**Author:** ![Rusalka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecd19e/32.png) [@Rusalka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rusalka)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/277 "2009-02-19T22:07:36Z")
What’s the difference between the 13th tribe and the other 12? I thought they all came from Kobol and thus were all human or cylon (pick one). They are the same, aren’t they? ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/278 "2009-02-19T22:10:00Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > No, the 13th Tribe, the Earth residents (us?), were Cylons. They had abandoned resurrection in favor of procreation (it’s more fun). The Five were researchers who resurrected resurrection. Where did resurrection originate, again? The 13th tribe invented it on Kobol, and that’s the reason for the schism? I can’t keep it straight. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/279 "2009-02-19T22:12:41Z")
> [@Cosmic Relief](#): > > Where did resurrection originate, again? The 13th tribe invented it on Kobol, and that’s the reason for the schism? I can’t keep it straight. As far as we know. But what were the Lords of Kobol, then? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2009, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696/280 "2009-02-19T22:14:27Z")
> [@Cosmic Relief](#): > > The 13th tribe invented it on Kobol, and that’s the reason for the schism? I can’t keep it straight. I think that’s right. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-4-17-no-exit-spoilers/485696.md?page=15)