# Battlestar Galactica; "The Ties That Bind" 18 April '08 (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 19, 2008, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966 "2008-04-19T02:04:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a9a28c/32.png) [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oslo_Ostragoth)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/101 "2008-04-21T04:36:04Z")
I watched the replay tonight. When Cavil and Boomer(?) are having their tete-a-tete before ramping up the civil war in a big way, there is a figure in the background with a white or blonde afro. Any speculation as to which model? ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/102 "2008-04-21T04:37:32Z")
[QUOTE=OpalCat] Yes, I do feel sympathetic toward some of the Cylons. I think that some of them changed their minds and realized killing the humans was wrong. [/QUOTE] 40 years prior they were on the verge of wiping out humanity but for some reason declared an armistice, then they come back and nuke billions and billions of humans out of existence and essentially drive them to extinction with a scant 40K or so on the run, ruthlessly hunt those few remaining, Cally’s freaked out she’s married and born a child by one of these genocidal maniacs and one of said genocidal maniacs kills her and you’re sympathetic towards them? Cool. I’m not Cally’s biggest fan but they got a great performance out her and I can’t fault her actions at all. Tori on the other hand has gone to the dark side. Tigh, Anders & Tyrol might look a bit stressed, but Tori’s got that Resident Evil zombie virus look to her, and didn’t shake it after she stopped hearing the music. > [@](#): > > Whatever! Jesus, let it go! You are aware, aren’t you, that this is a television show, and not real? Yes, it is just a show. I think the rest of us get that. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/103 "2008-04-21T04:47:34Z")
[QUOTE=levdrakont] she’s married and born a child by one of these genocidal maniacs and one of said genocidal maniacs kills her and you’re sympathetic towards them? [/QUOTE] But that isn’t the situation. The Chief is _not_ a genocidal maniac. Cylons aren’t fungible. In fact, some of them actually seem to want peace, if not outright coexistance. That’s part of the wonderful grey area of the show. Some Cylons are genocidal monsters. Some desperately want to be more human. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/104 "2008-04-21T05:31:37Z")
[QUOTE=FinnAgain] But that isn’t the situation. The Chief is _not_ a genocidal maniac. Cylons aren’t fungible. In fact, some of them actually seem to want peace, if not outright coexistance. That’s part of the wonderful grey area of the show. Some Cylons are genocidal monsters. Some desperately want to be more human. [/QUOTE] That’s great for the audience, not so much for the character Cally. You can’t really say Tyrol isn’t a genocidal maniac. The original Galactica Boomer was a sleeper with the best of intentions except for blowing up the water tanks and shooting Adama. You could argue Cally should give Tyrol the same benefit of the doubt everyone has apparently given Athena, but given the circumstances, I don’t blame Cally for freaking. BTW, Cally didn’t kill Tyrol. She wanted to get away from him while she was freaking out. Tori stalked and murdered Cally. Yes, I know Cally “killed” the original Galactic Boomer, but I don’t think that’s the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/105 "2008-04-21T06:32:58Z")
[QUOTE=levdrakon] That’s great for the audience, not so much for the character Cally. [/quote] True enough. But then again, I’ve got the bird’s eye view, I can pass judgment 😃 [QUOTE=levdrakon] You can’t really say Tyrol isn’t a genocidal maniac. The original Galactica Boomer was a sleeper with the best of intentions except for blowing up the water tanks and shooting Adama. [/quote] Well, to be fair, I do think we can say that, as he has no conscious designs towards genocide. Whether he would be capable of such a thing if he was ‘activated’, I think, is another issue. And for all we know, if he was ‘activated’, his function would be to teach the Cylons about the value of their ‘humanity’, so to speak. [QUOTE=levdrakon] BTW, Cally didn’t kill Tyrol. [/quote] Didn’t say she did, merely that she was willing and, as I saw it, tried to. Even freaking out, she could’ve said something like “Doc Cottle wants to see the baby, I need to take the rugrat and leave, now. I can’t talk” Instead, she used lethal force upside his head (literally). ---
**Author:** ![running\_piglet\_cheese](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/22d042/32.png) [@running\_piglet\_cheese](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_piglet_cheese)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/106 "2008-04-21T11:14:23Z")
Any thoughts on how this cylon/human procreation works? From what was said by Sharon on Caprica re baby farm the Cylons had been unable to become pregnant. Now we have two hybrids, human/cylon (Cally, Tyrol), and cylon/cylon (Anders/Athena). Why have these couples been sucessful while all the research/experimentation failed? ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/107 "2008-04-21T12:32:07Z")
[QUOTE=FinnAgain] Didn’t say she did, merely that she was willing and, as I saw it, tried to. Even freaking out, she could’ve said something like “Doc Cottle wants to see the baby, I need to take the rugrat and leave, now. I can’t talk” Instead, she used lethal force upside his head (literally). [/QUOTE] Aside from being depressed, abusing drugs, etc., she just found out her husband is a Cylon. I imagine that would be like finding out your husband is a serial killer, and is in league with other serial killers who are important members of your society. Wrench upside the head and run seems like a rational response under the circumstances. She was freaking out, which seems appropriate to me. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/108 "2008-04-21T12:45:44Z")
[QUOTE=FinnAgain] And, consider, if they were created as babies, and aged naturally, and think they’re humans… isn’t it kinda, well, racist to say that they’re bad just because they’re Cylon? [/QUOTE] No, that’s like saying the guys you are at war with are bad by definition of being a member of the group. ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/109 "2008-04-21T13:46:41Z")
Moderator interjects: OK, it looks like everyone has calmed down, but PLEASE, folks, remember that this is fiction, and entertainment/art. It is possible for different people to have totally different takes on it, or appreciation/hatred; and it is supposed to be possible for us to discuss those different views without insulting each other. ---
**Author:** ![Keweenaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/da6949/32.png) [@Keweenaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keweenaw)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/110 "2008-04-21T14:17:42Z")
[QUOTE=OpalCat] I have to agree that Tory isn’t evil. Once Callie showed she was willing to kill her own kid, she was fundamentally unstable and the only realistic way to handle the situation was to get rid of her. Tory did what she needed to do to rescue the kid. [/QUOTE] It’s not the act of spacing Callie itself that seemed evil to me, the argument above is valid. It’s that Tory’s seemed to lack of any sense of guilt or angst about it. She seemed to be trying to imitate an early six model’s cold attitude and indifference. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/111 "2008-04-21T14:33:12Z")
[QUOTE=levdrakon] Cally’s freaked out she’s married and born a child by one of these genocidal maniacs and one of said genocidal maniacs kills her and you’re sympathetic towards them? [/quote] Not _them_. The final 4/5s. They never knew they were Cylons. They have no memories of planning a genocide. I put myself in their place … what if I woke up one day and discovered I was a Cylon? Yeah, I sympathize with them. [QUOTE=levdrakon] You could argue Cally should give Tyrol the same benefit of the doubt everyone has apparently given Athena, but given the circumstances, I don’t blame Cally for freaking. [/quote] No, _I_ give Tyrol that benefit of the doubt. I don’t say that Cally _should_ think one way or the other. > [@](#): > > BTW, Cally didn’t kill Tyrol. She wanted to get away from him while she was freaking out. Tori stalked and murdered Cally. > > Yes, I know Cally “killed” the original Galactic Boomer, but I don’t think that’s the same thing. Yeah. Cally’s killing of Boomer was a premeditated murder of someone who was already in custody and posed no direct threat to her. It was much worse. ---
**Author:** ![VunderBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/839c29/32.png) [@VunderBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VunderBob)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/112 "2008-04-21T14:34:16Z")
[QUOTE=running piglet cheese] Any thoughts on how this cylon/human procreation works? From what was said by Sharon on Caprica re baby farm the Cylons had been unable to become pregnant. Now we have two hybrids, human/cylon (Cally, Tyrol), and cylon/cylon (Anders/Athena). Why have these couples been sucessful while all the research/experimentation failed? [/QUOTE] That was Helo that knocked up Athena, not Anders. The kid is human/cylon. ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/113 "2008-04-21T14:35:15Z")
We’re still missing the last model. Boy, won’t Tori be embarrassed when it turns out she spaced the final humanform Cylon? ---
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/114 "2008-04-21T14:58:25Z")
[QUOTE=carnivorousplant] Does anyone know from how far away and in what position those stars would still be seen as a constellation? [/QUOTE] Of the 15 brightest stars in Orion, only one (at 26 ly) is within 200 light years of earth. 2nd and 3rd place are 243 ly and 427 ly respectively. With some hand-wavy trig, I’d say Orion would still be very recognizable as a constellation until at least 50 ly away from earth. There’s a hell of a lot of stars within 50 ly. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/115 "2008-04-21T15:02:57Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > The obvious question is why they didn’t come up with a more space-efficient way of having the Vipers come back to the ship than devoting a huge landing area to them. Fanwankery: Because having a huge landing area allows for (a) damaged ships to have a better chance to land successfully, and (b) having a lot of ships land in a short time, followed by an immediate hyperspace jump, to escape a bad situation. I believe they’ve shown this on a few episodes. If you had to land the vipers one at a time like an aircraft carrier, you could lose the Battlestar before you had time to escape. [QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] And the pilots on Demetrius will have to put on spacesuits to get into their Vipers. Won’t be easy. [/quote] The flight suit is a space suit. Remember when Lee ejected from the stealth viper and was floating in space for a while? [QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] Where’d the Six who kicks Adama’s ass in the previews come from? Is it our old friend Shelley Godfrey, back from cold storage somewhere? [/quote] Assuming you mean the Six who kicks Tigh’s ass - it’s the one locked up in the brig who escaped from a Basestar with Athena and Hera. I think, but am not certain cause it’s hard keeping track of all this, she’s the reincarnation of the Six who seduced Baltar & put the Cylon viruses in all the defense software back on Caprica. ---
**Author:** ![Frazzled](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frazzled/32/3368_2.png) [@Frazzled](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frazzled)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/116 "2008-04-21T15:10:42Z")
[QUOTE=GargoyleWB] Of the 15 brightest stars in Orion, only one (at 26 ly) is within 200 light years of earth. 2nd and 3rd place are 243 ly and 427 ly respectively. With some hand-wavy trig, I’d say Orion would still be very recognizable as a constellation until at least 50 ly away from earth. There’s a hell of a lot of stars within 50 ly. [/QUOTE] The stars in Orion are spread out over three dimensions so any change of perspective will change the appearance of the constellation. Given the apparent size of the constellation and the orientation of the stars presented in the show I still think the Cylons found whatever clue was in the nebula at the end of last season and have found Earth. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/117 "2008-04-21T15:19:18Z")
Why do I continue to watch this show? Tory? She the one who is the aide to the President, right? Yet Tory see the open access hatch. Tory knows where that leads to and what it could mean. Tory knows how to operate the launch tube even when it’s in maintence mode? Of course it’s her because in this show, only women kick ass. And yes Apollo counts as woman. (now-a-days anyway) ---
**Author:** ![Frazzled](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frazzled/32/3368_2.png) [@Frazzled](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frazzled)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/118 "2008-04-21T15:27:13Z")
[QUOTE=Frazzled] I still think the Cylons found whatever clue was in the nebula at the end of last season and have found Earth. [/QUOTE] Let me add that I think that whatever the Cylons found in the nebula is also responsible for activating the final five (I have a really long commute and was thinking about this on the way in today 🙂 ) ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/119 "2008-04-21T15:33:15Z")
[QUOTE=Zebra] And yes Apollo counts as woman. (now-a-days anyway) [/QUOTE] He seems to have been acting awfully sissy lately. The meeting with the President comes to mind. Is it the actor or the character? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2008, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966/120 "2008-04-21T15:49:18Z")
[QUOTE=Lightnin’] We’re still missing the last model. Boy, won’t Tori be embarrassed when it turns out she spaced the final humanform Cylon? [/QUOTE] …she killed Doc Cottle?!? 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/battlestar-galactica-the-ties-that-bind-18-april-08-open-spoilers/445966.md?page=7)