That guy said that the car came in that way. He’s not going to admit he did the damage. Driving over a manicured lawn would not do any damage to the car, it happened some other way.
I’m not making my point clearly apparently. Other than airport car rentals, I have found standard practice to be that there’s a walk-around inspection when you pick up the car. The agent and you walk around the car and if there’s any damage–say a scratch on a fender–it’s documented and you initial that there’s no other damage. When you get back, the same thing occurs, as you’re standing by the car you’re dropping off, with the original documentation as the baseline. If there’s damage that wasn’t noted when you picked it up, it happened while you had the car. The practice is conducted without the car being driven away, specifically to avoid the types of arguments you’re suggesting. And, again, you’re ignoring the fact that the driver doesn’t seem to dispute that the damage occurred on her watch, by virtue of the fact that she submitted a claim to her insurance company.
“I did not cause that damage, nor will I be submitting a claim” can’t occur with the inspection process I described. “I didn’t cause that damage, but I’ll be submitting a claim” is a complete non sequitur.
All right, the OP is going to have to clarify this. I was reading it as if the report of the damage came in after the drop off. If she acknowledged the damage when it was dropped off, which seems unlikely from just a walk-around, then it really doesn’t matter how it happened.
Exactly. As far as the rental place is concerned, it doesn’t matter how it happened as long as your insurance covers it. How it happens is a detail for your insurer. Depending upon circumstances and the type of coverage, the driver’s actions could result in the claim being affected or possibly a ding in the driver’s rates, if they found the actions to be reflective of poor driving or judgment.
My father’s golden rule: Do not volunteer information.
Words to live by.
I was present at the pick up, but not the drop off. There was definitely no inspection of the undercarriage when we picked it up (is there ever?!).
To clarify:
My wife dropped off the car just as the Enterprise office was closing. They did a brief walk-around and everyone signed off on it. About an hour after returning the car, they called her and told her they found (unspecified) damage to the undercarriage.
The reason my wife called her insurance is because the car was being provided to her by her insurance (her car was totaled in another incident the previous week).
They signed off on it. They are the experts on the condition of rental cars dropped off. That car was fine when she dropped it off according to them. She should have hung up the phone when they called and never called the insurance company.
Given the last facts provided, I basically agree with this. (I might have called the insurance company to let them know there might be a bogus story.) If your wife had no reason to believe she did any damage, and they signed off on the car, I would not have responded to a later call with an assumption that I must have cause the damage, or that it couldn’t have been there when I picked it up.
One question: Why did she think driving through the field was relevant to the conversation?
I dunno. She was upset and was just kind of babbling.
And GEICO called yesterday evening and said it’s resolved. They essentially told Enterprise to go fuck themselves: Enterprise accepted the car back and countersigned the agreement upon receipt of the vehicle, so it’s their problem.
That sounds like the right resolution to me.
Because it was the only unusual condition she exposed the undercarriage to. And honest people tend to think the people they’re dealing with are honest, and she was trying to solve the mystery with them. Maybe.
Be honest, but don’t volunteer anything. Insurance fraud generally isn’t prosecuted much - insurance companies have to hand the law enforcement agencies cases on a silver platter - but it is surprisingly easy to get a conviction if you make affirmative misrepresentations. Not mentioning something you weren’t asked about is way different though.
Anyway, “driving a car across a field” is not an automatic or even likely cause of undertray damage. Unless she heard a bang or knows she beached it on a rock or something, it’s just as likely to have been caused by debris on a highway.
I have worked in the insurance industry for almost 10 years. I spent just over 3 years as an Independent Agent, almost 2yrs as an adjuster and the past 4.5yrs as a Premium Auditor for Commercial policies (Workers Comp and General Liability). I’ve worked with dozens of insurance companies over the years, so I can speak on the subject with some degree of “inside” information.
The job of almost every adjuster in the field is to close every claim at the lowest cost possible- period! They first look for any excuse to deny the claim altogether, even if the law doesn’t support their denial. Most claimants don’t know their legal rights or how to proceed after a claim is denied and they count on that. If they can’t find a way to deny the claim initially, they will use anything you say or do against you if they possibly can. If they are forced to actually pay the claim, they will do anything possible to minimize the amount paid.
Working with an adjuster from your own insurer is usually a little easier than one from another party’s insurer…but not much easier. The only thing working in your favor with your own insurer is that they may want to retain you as a customer after the claim. If you’ve been with the same company for a few years and have no claims in the past three years, they usually want to keep your business and will pay a claim of a few thousand dollars to do so. It varies greatly from one company to another.
Another very unpleasant factor in your situation is the party claiming damage- a car rental agency. They are not known for their honesty or ethical business practices. Their claims against renters usually include additional costs such as ‘loss of revenue’ due to the car being out of commission while it is repaired and other costs that most insurers will NOT pay. They also are known for blaming damage on the most recent renter at the time they notice it, not necessarily when the damage occurred.
Unfortunately, you may have another wrinkle to deal with because of your wife’s “full disclosure”. Insurance companies will NOT cover damage that they consider to be “intentional”. It is possible that driving a car across a field could be considered as intentionally damaging the car. If so, they can refuse to pay and you will be forced to pay out of pocket for any damage.
Going forward, your wife (and anyone dealing with any insurance company representative in the future) should say as little as possible. Provide brief answers when necessary and say “I’m not sure” or “I don’t recall” (even if you DO recall). They can’t nail you for insurance fraud for providing vague or ambiguous answers, but they can for lying if they can prove that you lied!
If you are going to be forced to pay some/all of the damage yourself, insist on the car being inspected by a mechanic or body shop professional of your choice (at your expense). They can determine whether the damage could have been caused by your wife driving through a field. If the insurance company covers the damage, the adjuster will do the same thing.
A few final pieces of advice-
1- Tell your wife not to speak to ANYONE at the car rental agency as long as the insurance company is processing the claim.
2- If the insurance company denies the claim and the rental agency demands that you pay the damages, you should consider consulting an attorney (especially if damages are over $1000 or so). A firmly worded letter from an attorney can often make things like this go away. Trust me, I’ve seen it work many times!
3- Call and report the credit card used to rent the car as LOST to the issuing bank. They will issue a new card with a different number. Otherwise, they rental agency may try to charge some/all of the claimed damages to your card at any time. They won’t be able to do that once you have a new card number issued!
Good luck!
Wow, Beelzebubba. Um. All I can say to your post (because of the forum, not because I don’t see glaring statements comprised entirely of pure bullshit) is that your experience is precisely the opposite of mine. In fact, I can’t imagine anyone lasting 2 days, let alone 2 years managing claims with the attitudes you describe–they’d be fired, fired, fired.
Same here. I have never met a claims manager who wanted to deny claims. Their job is to be sure that claims are paid properly according to the policy and any relevent laws or case law that applies. I’ll add that I have nearly 20 years in the industry across nearly all lines of business and have worked everything for sales to underwriting to claims over the years.