# Bea Arthur Syndrome, or "We need someone realy ugly!" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 16, 2005, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326 "2005-08-16T21:08:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![plnnr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@plnnr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/plnnr)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/41 "2005-08-17T15:32:33Z")
Marie Dressler was going to be my first response. Can you imagine what the children borne of her and Wallace Beary would have looked like? Edna Mae Oliver is another good choice. She always looked like she had sucked on a lemon. Of the current crop, I’ll second Steve Buscemi and raise you Clint Howard [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0397212/](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0397212/) ---
**Author:** ![romansperson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/romansperson/32/17100_2.png) [@romansperson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/romansperson)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/42 "2005-08-17T17:13:20Z")
> [@bluethree](#): > > What’s so ugly about Bea Arthur? I think she’s nice looking. And Sarah Jessica Parker is easily twice as ugly as Bea Arthur. Sarah Jessica has the classic Witchy-Poo face, warts included. Yet they pass her off as beautiful. > > What the ??? > > I’ve also been surprised to see how many young people think Lucille Ball was unattractive. My God, she was gorgeous when she was young. Just another confirmation that beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Look at Bette Davis. I think she was butt-ugly, and yet in her day she was an ingenue and a glamorous star. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/43 "2005-08-17T17:20:06Z")
That guy that played The Elephant Man was pretty much born to play that role. Haven’t seen him in much else though. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/44 "2005-08-17T17:30:54Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > Ann B. Davis (not so much ugly as plain) > > Kathy Bates > > Kathleen Freeman > > Carol Kane > > And a special nod to Alyce beasley, who got (IMHO) the best non-comic line in the entire run of _Cheers_ as Coach’s daughter: > > “Look at me Daddy. Really look at me! Tell me what you see.” > > Coach: “Oh my God. I never saw it before. You look just like your mother.” > > “That’s right. I look just like her. And my mother was not (pause, looks at Coach) comfortable with her beauty.” Wow, I guess I must be crazy, I would call Carol Kane and Alyce Beasley Cute. Hardly in the category of the actress who played Mimi on Drew Carey or Bea Arthur. I am going with memories of the 70’s versions of both woman but still, they were cute. Carol was even the female lead in a Gene Wilder movie where she was suppose to be a gorgeous and sexy but naive girl. Found it: [The World’s Greatest Lover (1977)](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0076933/) ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/45 "2005-08-17T17:50:41Z")
[Peter Lorre](http://imdb.com/name/nm0000048/) – not extraordinary ugly, just really… funny-looking. ---
**Author:** ![Alma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@Alma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alma)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/46 "2005-08-17T17:53:31Z")
> [@FriarTed](#): > > THE QUEEN OF THE SIXTH DIMENSION - FORBIDDEN ZONE!!! I have this poster on my wall: [http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080752/](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080752/) There’s a woman who knows how to use what she got. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/47 "2005-08-17T17:59:03Z")
> [@Lute Skywatcher](#): > > As is Billy Drago. Trivia: [Drago](http://triviana.com/film/ufilm/untobill.gif) is the biological father of [Darren E. Burrows](http://www.paramountcomedy.es/series/doctorenalaska/img/ed.jpg), who in addition to playing Ed on _Northern Exposure_ played Hatchet Face’s boyfriend in _Cry Baby_ (then disappeared from the face of the Earth seemingly, which is just as well since he couldn’t act). ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/48 "2005-08-17T18:05:31Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > Trivia: [Drago](http://triviana.com/film/ufilm/untobill.gif) is the biological father of [Darren E. Burrows](http://www.paramountcomedy.es/series/doctorenalaska/img/ed.jpg), who in addition to playing Ed on _Northern Exposure_ played Hatchet Face’s boyfriend in _Cry Baby_ (then disappeared from the face of the Earth seemingly, which is just as well since he couldn’t act). Darren E. Burrows did a good job as a bank robber on the X-files in a Groundhog day storyline. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/49 "2005-08-17T18:06:27Z")
[Peter Lorre](http://imdb.com/name/nm0000048/) – not extraordinary ugly, just really… funny-looking. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/50 "2005-08-17T18:22:58Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > That guy that played The Elephant Man was pretty much born to play that role. > > Haven’t seen him in much else though. You mean [John Hurt](http://www.goatview.com/hurt_john.jpg)??? [He’s been pretty busy…](http://us.imdb.com/name/nm0000457/) ---
**Author:** ![The\_Chao\_Goes\_Mu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_chao_goes_mu/32/3191_2.png) [@The\_Chao\_Goes\_Mu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Chao_Goes_Mu)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2005, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/51 "2005-08-17T20:10:20Z")
I wouldn’t kick Bea Arthur out of bed. I always thought she was attractive and that voice. Oh my god that voice! And I’m sure Bea is soooo hurt by the idea that people make fun of her looks… I bet she’s crying all the way to the bank. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2005, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/52 "2005-08-18T20:28:00Z")
Michael Gambon. I’ve been watching _The Singing Detective_ and he doesn’t look THAT much worse in the psoriasis makeup. ---
**Author:** ![Padeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2005, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/53 "2005-08-18T21:46:51Z")
Great Simpsons line, a soap opera producer describing Moe Syzlak: "I wanted Hollywood ugly not ugly ugly. Mary Ann on Gilligan’s Island ugly not Cornelius on Planet of the Apes ugly. " Most people cast in Hollywood as ugly would get kicked out of bed by the avage joe or jane and that includes several listed by SDMB members. Steve Buscemi knows he isn’t an oil painting and uses it to his advantage. I’d bet even Sarah Jessica Parker knows she’s not conventionally pretty at least. I liked her line in _Ed Wood_ bemoning a critic calling her a “horse face.” Now I always thought Alice Beasley was pretty cute but I’ve often gone for the unconventional. John Waters knows ugly and includes a chapter in one of his books about it. Edith Massey was pretty goddamn hideous, he picked her because she looked like she should be Divine’s mom. When he casts ugly he leaves no doubt he means ugly ugly. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2005, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/54 "2005-08-18T22:05:37Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > Cloris Leachman, for instance, was a beauty queen in college, though if you’ve ever been to the Northwestern campus you’d realize that was no great feat. _rimshot_ No, really, she was Miss Chicago of 1946 in the run up to the Miss America contest. And one of the 5 Miss America finalists that year too. I saw her a couple of weeks ago in Kiss Me Deadly and thought she was quite attractive. I don’t think really thin women age as nicely as the plumper ones. **Janet Leigh** – I saw her on TV about 20 years ago, don’t remember the name of the show, but it involved little kids asking questions. (Linkletter, maybe?) Anyway, one kid asked Janet “Don’t you want to be pretty?” She was just way too thin in middle age, that’s all. I’m surprised that **Agnes Moorehead** hasn’t been mentioned. I don’t think she’s ugly, but she’s sure had her share of Plain Jane and crone roles. **Eve Arden** – another gorgeous (and thin) woman who was always the sidekick, never the bride. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2005, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/55 "2005-08-18T22:15:13Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#): > > I’m surprised that **Agnes Moorehead** hasn’t been mentioned. She could be glamorous if she tried. Or a hag if she tried. But like with Michael Gambon, who was up for James Bond after George Lazenby, fercryinoutloud, I get all caught up with her work and forget about her face. Okay, with Gambon I get caught up in his voice, but same difference. > [@](#): > > I don’t think really thin women age as nicely as the plumper ones. Well, I’m not a woman but the secret of my youthful appearance is the fat stretching the wrinkles smooth. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2005, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/56 "2005-08-18T22:15:58Z")
> [@Padeye](#): > > I’d bet even Sarah Jessica Parker knows she’s not conventionally pretty at least. I had a _huge_ crush on Sarah Jessica Parker, back [when she was still “Hollywood ugly.”](http://www.crazyabouttv.com/Images/squarepegs.jpg) The best example of “Hollywood Ugly”: “I’m working up a film treatment of a book about a homely, overweight woman’s insecurities about her romantic prospects, where everyone considers it unlikely that such a ridiculous-looking woman can get a relationship with _any_ man, much less find idealized happiness. Get me [Renée Zellweger](http://cine.elcorreodigital.com/datos/fotografias/zellweger/fotos/01.jpg)’s agent on the line.” WTF? ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2005, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/57 "2005-08-18T22:37:59Z")
Well, it’s a living. Paul Giamatti is the one that sprung to mind first when I read this. He’s broken out of “generic ugly character acter” status during the past couple of years, but he’s still high on the list of contemporary examples, IMO. Can’t imagine how I’d feel about being typecast that way. I’ll just stay out of acting so I don’t find out. ---
**Author:** ![JohnBckWLD](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d6d6ee/32.png) [@JohnBckWLD](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnBckWLD)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2005, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/58 "2005-08-18T23:34:24Z")
According to Variety, a new Paramount project _Dirty Tricks_: a docu-drama based on a John Jeter about the Watergate wives has been cast. Allegedly,[ul][_]eryl Streep will star as Martha Mitchell (Mrs. John Mitchell)[_]Gwyneth Paltrow will play the role of Maureen Dean (Mrs. John Dean)[_]Jill Clayburgh has been signed to play the role of Pat Nixon (Dick’s squeeze), **and** [_] **Annette Bening** will star as (White House correspondent) **Helen Thomas**!! :eek: [/ul]I realize the Watergate fiasco is 30 years old, but if ever there was a screen test that that just cried for Bea Arthur; it’s gotta be the role of [Helen Thomas](http://www.ambergnat.com/archives/images/helen.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2005, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/59 "2005-08-18T23:41:30Z")
I love Helen Thomas to pieces for being the only reporter in the White House press corps in the last five years who retained control of her spine, but the woman has _always_ looked like the third act of a two-act drag show. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2005, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326/60 "2005-08-18T23:55:29Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#): > > I’m surprised that **Agnes Moorehead** hasn’t been mentioned. I don’t think she’s ugly, but she’s sure had her share of Plain Jane and crone roles. She was in the Twilight Zone episode “The Invaders” playing an old woman alone in a cabin when “aliens” attack her. IIRC, she wore no makeup. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bea-arthur-syndrome-or-we-need-someone-realy-ugly/317326.md?page=4)