I can get why people wouldn’t like Garcia or Weir, but if you don’t like Pigpen singing Hard To Handle and pounding on his organ there’s something wrong with you.
As for the rest of your post, if you think jazz musicians mostly play pre-written music or metal songs don’t take talent to write, then you are (probably wilfully) ignorant of huge amounts of the last 40-50 years of musical history.
I just posted that. Stop playing. Go read something.
Now cite for
Beatles were first designed to sell to teenage girls, specifically.
Beatles were a boy band
beatles were a covers band
Beatles would have been allowed to make LPs of covers if they could not write their own material.
There were many bands more “dangerous” than the beatles.
Definition of “Boy band”
You’ve gotten a free pass so far AFAICS
Jazz is improvisational music. Much of it is not written down. That’s the point. You still need those skills that I mentioned if you go back and read what I actually wrote.
Metal, eh. It’s hard when it doesn’t swing or breathe. I don’t want to disillusion you but The last 40 or 50 years has been plenty good without it. Lots of music, passion, songwriting that didn’t need metal to be there at all.
Heh, do you have a cite that Martin was a pop producer?
No, you haven’t backed up your assertion at all. So, I’ll just assume you can’t back it up and move on. Toodles.
From the wiki entry on Martin.:
So, pop/comedy, up to that time.
Martin was a producer of novelties and comedy. He was not a “pop” producer by this citation anyway. The Beatles liked him right away because he had worked with the Goons (and Peter Sellers esp), beyond the fringe and that was the week that was.
The Beatles were brought to his attention because of a relationship with a publisher who had made a deal with Epstein who could not get the boys signed to a record label. He thought it was worth a shot, especially since there was a publisher who was going to try to get original Lennon McCartney songs to be recorded and to be hits if possible. It was a situation where there was not a lot of downside. No one was looking too closely at Martin then. This seems to be just the opposite of the way a teen idol band would start.
No publisher taking an interest = no George Martin= no parlophone. Got a problem with that take it up with God.
He also was the one who recommended Dick James to them, as their second publisher, as James had been a singer who Martin had produced for a hit with the “Robin Hood” theme song, which you can hear in a Monty Python sketch from the 70s.
OK if you insist:
Now cite for
Beatles were first designed to sell to teenage girls, specifically.
Beatles were a boy band
beatles were a covers band
Beatles would have been allowed to make LPs of covers if they could not write their own material.
There were many bands more “dangerous” than the beatles.
Definition of “Boy band”
Sigh, you still haven’t cited any of that. A publishing deal meant bupkiss then and means bupkiss now wrt to having a record deal, especially since the person who’s decision it was to sign them (Martin) thought the songs in question were sub-par. If anyone else wants to ask for cites, I’ll do it. Since you’re not willing to reciprocate with anything but bald assertions, I don’t see any reason to continue that with you.
The whole issue was just a distraction from your ultimate wrongness about so many other things, and your fear of having to document anything you say here. Seeing as how you were the one making assertions about their early recording career without a sniff of the facts I’ll take that as the whimper of a whipped dog who’s going off to nurse his wounds. Better luck next time.
This is unfortunately typical, and a huge part of why you get so much pushback here.
George Martin was not a “pop producer.” He was a producer who did a small amount of pop, but most of his job was elsewhere. Just as the Beatles were not a pop band, but did a small amount of pop as part of much more varied total recordings.
You keep cherrypicking a small and not representative portion of the whole and insisting that the whole can be defined by the part. That’s more than just factually wrong. It’s bad thinking. You are sure to wind up saying things that are ludicrous, fatuous, or risible. You may have a kernel of truth buried in there somewhere, but you wrap it in disposable and dismissable nonsense. Why do you bother?
I’ve asked you to reciprocate, and back up one assertion, and you can’t do that. Insults aren’t improving your position.
Yet in the world outside of this thread, my experience with these assertions is that they aren’t ludicrous, fatuous, or risible, and most of the world agrees with me. Now, the rest of the world isn’t a thread that would attract the most hardcore Beatles defenders, so that might explain it. In the end, these assertions didn’t seem to raise any conflict among the group of musicians I questioned. Martin had most of his success pre-Beatles with novelty and pop, that seems pretty plain to me.
Reciprocation for what exactly? All you got is obfuscation and avoidance.
Complements, insults, you can’t say the results would be any different whichever so what’s it matter?
I told you that the publishing deal came first and made the recording connection, and it was a personal connection, because Martins Parlophone was not a place where teen idols were groomed or even belonged. And Martin had never had a rock group. I gave you the info so then you said it meant “Bupkiss.” Do you even remember what you are shoveling from one minute to the next?
So they sold records to teen age girls. They sold records to teenage boys, adults. Other rock and pop groups sold records to teenagers and adults. You have a special insight into this? “They’re a boy band, man” It’s just a boring mock provocative thing to say. There is no argument in it. We all agree on almost all the facts anyway.
I think your friends were just being nice and going along with you.
Publishing contracts mean bupkiss in getting a recording contract. There are plenty of published songwriters that can’t get a recording contract. If Martin had thought the songs were great, but The Beatles were boring, he could have just licensed the songs for another performer.
Martin was the person at Parlaphone who made the decision. From every account I can find, he didn’t particularly like the songs, the part of the recordings that attracted him was the singing. He decided to go with them because they were witty and funny, and decided he could work with them.
Every account up to now has told that story. Mark Lewisohn in his recent biography Tune In uncovered quite a different story. It’s complicated and involves players most people have never heard of, but the upshot is that the Beatles were already signed to EMI when Martin was assigned to work with them. Their first session with him was a recording test designed to determine what they could do, but it was not an audition. You’re right about his opinions of their first original songs, although that changed very quickly.
And just to stir the pot, here’s a recent interview in which Paul McCartney describes the Beatles as a boy band. Oh well. 
That’s not the real McCartney, that’s the replacement after he died. What would he know?
Thank you so very much. You wield a claymore, while I am equipped with a pocketknife. 
It’s a good interview besides that one sentence, too! He also explains how they began writing originals out of necessity. Because when they were fifth on the bill and only playing covers, the other four bands had a good chance of playing their whole set between them. Originals are the only way to cure that.
“Natural growing up and development, and drugs.”
“It’s not me, it’s Chaucer.”
If you’ve got more details on what was going on at EMI without violating copyright, I’d love to hear it. If not, I’ll keep an eye out for it.
Wow, on review: Ok, so how do I get out of arguing that wasn’t an interview with one of those guys so cleverly exposed on thebeatlesneverexisted.com?
I love this!
I would argue that Paul was using “boy band” in a way that is different vs. how it has come to be known since then. But then again, you, scabpicker have been kinda arguing that point.
Music - a black and white topic!