# Ben Carson for President thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 31, 2015, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554 "2015-08-31T22:58:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/121 "2015-09-28T03:45:53Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The Muslim thing made headlines, but that has more to do with the timing, and the fact is few liberals would disagree with the substance of what he said anyway. :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > I doubt a devout Muslim who supports Sharia law over our Constitution would get very many Democratic votes. First he’d have to be able to _exist_. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/122 "2015-09-28T03:47:43Z")
He wouldn’t exist because he wouldn’t get elected dogcatcher. Carson’s statement was a classic example of something being wrong because it wasn’t nice to say, rather than an expression of anything of substance. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/123 "2015-09-28T03:50:48Z")
Do please note that you have to \*imagine \*scenarios in order to condemn “liberals” for acting the way you imagine they’d do. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/124 "2015-09-28T03:54:33Z")
Why would I condemn liberals? Not supporting a candidate who places his religion over the Constitution is not only a positive thing it’s what liberals have done since liberalism was invented. At least I HOPE you’re not telling me that liberals would support a Sharia-advocating Muslim candidate when they won’t support Mike Huckabee. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/125 "2015-09-28T04:00:05Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Why would I condemn liberals? Why \*did \*you? Post 120, right above, just a few minutes ago. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/126 "2015-09-28T04:03:05Z")
By saying that liberals wouldn’t disagree with what he said, I was condemning them? Would liberal voters support a Sharia advocate for President? ---
**Author:** ![Kyomara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8edcca/32.png) [@Kyomara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyomara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/127 "2015-09-28T11:10:13Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > By saying that liberals wouldn’t disagree with what he said, I was condemning them? Would liberal voters support a Sharia advocate for President? Carson said that he “would not advocate that we put a Muslim in charge of this nation,” and that Islam is not consistent with the Constitution. No mention was made of whether the hypothetical Muslim candidate believes in or follows Sharia Law. No one should agree with what he said, because it would seem to advocate for a religious test for presidential candidates, and it amounts to religious discrimination. Additionally, it is another demonstration of Dr. Carson’s painful ignorance regarding many topics other than neurosurgery. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/128 "2015-09-28T11:13:37Z")
He did clarify his statement to mean advocates of Sharia law over our Constitution. ---
**Author:** ![CGav8r](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/34f0e0/32.png) [@CGav8r](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CGav8r)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/129 "2015-09-28T13:08:42Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > He did clarify his statement to mean advocates of Sharia law over our Constitution. Not only is that a mealy-mouthed excuse (would he support someone like Kim Davis who advocates the Bible over the Constitution?), him making a religious test in order to be President is the definition of un-American. Heck, the Constitution that he’s speaking of has a l’il mention of a religious test for government office in Article Six… I’d say that’s a pretty big gaffe… ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/130 "2015-09-28T13:47:51Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Fewer dumb statements, he’s a little more under control now. He was a gaffe a minute in April, now it’s more like a gaffe a month. And the gaffes are less serious. The Muslim thing made headlines, but that has more to do with the timing, and the fact is few liberals would disagree with the substance of what he said anyway. I doubt a devout Muslim who supports Sharia law over our Constitution would get very many Democratic votes. I don’t see this – I see his latest statements as dumb as any of his earlier statements. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/131 "2015-09-28T14:52:34Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > He did clarify his statement to mean advocates of Sharia law over our Constitution. Why do Muslims have to vow to support the Constitution over Sharia law and Christians don’t have to vow to support the Constitution over the Bible (or their own interpretation thereof)? I have to give credit to Carson for two things. He proved that you can be a brain surgeon and be an imbecile. He also proved that blacks can be racist assholes just as much as whites. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/132 "2015-09-28T15:02:10Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Why do Muslims have to vow to support the Constitution over Sharia law and Christians don’t have to vow to support the Constitution over the Bible (or their own interpretation thereof)? > > I have to give credit to Carson for two things. He proved that you can be a brain surgeon and be an imbecile. He also proved that blacks can be racist assholes just as much as whites. And weren’t those two questions you just needed to have answers to? They were keeping you up nights, weren’t they? ---
**Author:** ![Kyomara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8edcca/32.png) [@Kyomara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyomara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/133 "2015-09-28T18:43:08Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > He did clarify his statement to mean advocates of Sharia law over our Constitution. Carson offensively assumes that the “default” for practicing Muslims is a devotion to Sharia Law, which at best demonstrates a profound ignorance of Islam and religious practice in general, and at worst betrays his ill-informed bigotry against Islam (which his supporters share). And when he adds that “I would have problems with somebody who embraced all the doctrines associated with Islam,” he implies that Muslims who are not devoted to Sharia Law are somehow not “real” Muslims. The man is a dolt. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/134 "2015-09-28T21:17:22Z")
> [@CGav8r](#): > > Not only is that a mealy-mouthed excuse (would he support someone like Kim Davis who advocates the Bible over the Constitution?), him making a religious test in order to be President is the definition of un-American. Heck, the Constitution that he’s speaking of has a l’il mention of a religious test for government office in Article Six… > I’d say that’s a pretty big gaffe… He said right from the start that he personally could not support a Muslim for President. The Constitution lets people vote however they want and support whoever they want for any reason. The Constitution is not at issue here since Carson advocated no change in our laws. What is at issue is Carson’s personal views, which are shared by a rather large minority of Americans, and which if it was an actually devout Muslim would probably be nearly universally shared. A Sharia-supporting Muslim has about as much chance to win liberal votes as Kim Davis. The difference is that it’s PC to say that about Kim Davis. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/135 "2015-09-28T22:36:58Z")
[ > [@](#): > > Carson told the AP that NASCAR fans should continue flying the flag “if it’s private property and that’s what they want to do.” > > He also acknowledged the flag remains “a symbol of hate” for many black people and compared it to the Nazi swastika. > > “Swastikas are a symbol of hate for some people, too. And yet they still exist in museums and places like that,” Carson said, describing the decision about flying the flag “a local issue.” ''If it’s a majority of people in that area who want it to fly, I certainly wouldn’t take it down." ]([http://bigstory.ap.org/article/f90d40d439d24b9c89ef9ae692121ed0/racing-legend-petty-appears-carson-nascar-country](http://bigstory.ap.org/article/f90d40d439d24b9c89ef9ae692121ed0/racing-legend-petty-appears-carson-nascar-country))😕:eek: ---
**Author:** ![Kyomara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8edcca/32.png) [@Kyomara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyomara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/136 "2015-09-28T22:45:13Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > He said right from the start that he personally could not support a Muslim for President. The Constitution lets people vote however they want and support whoever they want for any reason. The Constitution is not at issue here since Carson advocated no change in our laws. What is at issue is Carson’s personal views, which are shared by a rather large minority of Americans, and which if it was an actually devout Muslim would probably be nearly universally shared. A Sharia-supporting Muslim has about as much chance to win liberal votes as Kim Davis. The difference is that it’s PC to say that about Kim Davis. Carson is not your wingnut conservative friend you run into sometimes at the grocery store; he is running for president. And making ignorant statements that insult the religion of at least 2 million Americans is not presidential. Nobody asked him what he thought about a Sharia Law-practicing Muslim as president. The fact that he assumed it is telling and troubling. ---
**Author:** ![Kyomara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8edcca/32.png) [@Kyomara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyomara)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/137 "2015-09-28T22:55:55Z")
Also I must add: > [@adaher](#): > > A Sharia-supporting Muslim has about as much chance to win liberal votes as Kim Davis. The difference is that it’s PC to say that about Kim Davis. “PC” (what a stupid, meaningless word) doesn’t enter into it. The question was whether he would support a Muslim for president. If he had been asked whether he would support a proponent of Sharia Law for president, the reaction from the left would have been much different. The problem with Kim Davis is not that she’s Christian, it’s that she uses her religion to interfere with other people’s constitutional rights. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2015, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/138 "2015-09-28T23:02:50Z")
> [@Kyomara](#): > > The problem with Kim Davis is not that she’s Christian, it’s that she uses her religion to interfere with other people’s constitutional rights. Aye, that’s the crux of the biscuit right there. ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2015, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/139 "2015-09-29T00:05:17Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > He did clarify his statement to mean advocates of Sharia law over our Constitution. Did he clarify it as soon as he said it, or did he clarify it after his aides told him to? ETA: whatever, I’m rooting for him, because if he became the Republican nominee, I think we would see about 10% voter turnout by Pubbies in the general election. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2015, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554/140 "2015-09-29T01:35:06Z")
It’s wrong to assume that most Muslims are devout? I’d think assuming the opposite would be insulting. I know I’d be insulted if a candidate said, “Sure I can support a Jew for office, most of them don’t even go to synagogue!” Even though it’s true. But as a general rule, assuming that followers of a religion don’t believe in their religion enough to accept its basic precepts is actually fairly insulting. We’re not all Catholics, you know.🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-carson-for-president-thread/729554.md?page=8)