# Ben Stein on Nixon, Ted Kennedy, and Health Care **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 4, 2014, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064 "2014-06-04T22:06:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2014, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/1 "2014-06-04T22:06:20Z")
Ben Stein [on](http://www.cnn.com/2014/06/04/opinion/stein-nixon-60s/index.html?hpt=hp_c4) Nixon’s universal health care plan: > [@](#): > > [Nixon] sent up to Congress the first proposal for universal health care. I know. I wrote the message sending it to Congress – where Teddy Kennedy promptly killed it. So, Nixon good, Kennedy bad! Right? Steven Pearlstein with a slightly different [version](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/27/AR2009082703919.html). > [@](#): > > Nixon was concerned that he would once again have to face a Kennedy in the next year’s election – in this case a Kennedy with a proposal to extend health care to all Americans. Feeling the need to offer an alternative, Nixon asked Congress to require for the first time that all companies provide a health plan for their employees, with federal subsidies for low-income workers. > … > At first, Kennedy rejected Nixon’s proposal as nothing more than a bonanza for the insurance industry that would create a two-class system of health care in America. Ah, a reasonable explanation why Kennedy might have acted the way he did. But you’d never know it from Nixon hagiographer Ben Stein. Now don’t get me wrong, the article from Stein is full of admirable actions taken by Nixon during his presidency. But don’t you think that any article with the title “The Truth About Nixon” ought to have at least one mention of that little incident we refer to as “Watergate”. Ben Stein. What a maroon. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2014, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/2 "2014-06-04T22:14:09Z")
Yeah, legislators (and presidents) are really good about submitting sham bills with fancy names in order to impress the voters. The actual details are usually crap, and they get shot down. But then they can go on TV and tell everyone, “The evil other party shot down my ‘Universal Success For Everyone’ bill!” ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2014, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/3 "2014-06-04T23:45:25Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > But don’t you think that any article with the title “The Truth About Nixon” ought to have at least one mention of that little incident we refer to as “Watergate”. Did you read the whole article? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/4 "2014-06-05T00:12:40Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > But don’t you think that any article with the title “The Truth About Nixon” ought to have at least one mention of that little incident we refer to as “Watergate”. He does sort of mention it. At the very end of the article he has a line about _“He helped with a coverup of a mysterious burglary that no one understands to this day. That was his grievous sin, and grievously did he answer for it.”_ So technically, Stein did mention Watergate. But he soft-pedaled the hell out of it. There is nothing mysterious about the crime. And Nixon did more than just “help” with the cover-up. He was the President - the reason there was a cover-up is because he told people to do it. And by the same token, his involvement occurred prior to the cover-up. The crime occurred because Nixon decided to hire a bunch of criminals to work for him. He might not have known the details about what crimes they were committing but he knew they were out there committing crimes for him. As for grievously answering for his crimes, Nixon was allowed to retire and was pardoned from any possible criminal charges. I’d say he got off lightly. ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/5 "2014-06-05T04:52:46Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > He does sort of mention it. At the very end of the article he has a line about _“He helped with a coverup of a mysterious burglary that no one understands to this day. That was his grievous sin, and grievously did he answer for it.”_ You know those threads where we come up with absurd (but partly true) summaries for movies? Like that Wizard of Oz one: “Transported to a faraway land, a young girl murders the first person she meets, teams up with 3 others and kills again.” Well if we had a thread doing the same thing to well known political events, this summary of Watergate would take first prize. Absolutely hilarious. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/6 "2014-06-05T05:16:21Z")
[Ben Stein is a dishonest jackass.](http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/six-things-ben-stein-doesnt-want-you-to-know/) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/7 "2014-06-05T08:42:02Z")
> [@drewtwo99](#): > > You know those threads where we come up with absurd (but partly true) summaries for movies? Like that Wizard of Oz one: “Transported to a faraway land, a young girl murders the first person she meets, teams up with 3 others and kills again.” > > Well if we had a thread doing the same thing to well known political events, this summary of Watergate would take first prize. Absolutely hilarious. Stein also claimed that Nixon “did not get us into a large, unnecessary war on false pretenses”. I guess he didn’t fact check that with any Cambodians. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/8 "2014-06-05T14:24:46Z")
I have read that one of the main sticking points was how they were going to finance the healthcare system. They had agreed on a payroll tax with a worker and a company contribution like Social Security has. Nixon wanted the individual to pay for most of it while Kennedy wanted the company to pay for most of it. The irony is that anyone with any knowledge of tax theory knows that it does not matter which side pays for the payroll tax the tax incidence is all on the worker. So Kennedy held out for a meaningless issue and after a while pressure on both sides nixed the deal. That was the liberals best chance for a health care takeover by the government for almost forty years and Kennedy blew it. Thankfully that idiot was in charge of the push for health care legislation and not someone competent. Nepotism sometimes works out for good. ---
**Author:** ![hotflungwok](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/edb3f5/32.png) [@hotflungwok](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hotflungwok)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/9 "2014-06-05T14:53:23Z")
Why does anyone listen to Ben Stein anymore? He sold his credibility for a bag of money long time ago. He’s gotten so bad that I have trouble believing him when he talks about Clear Eyes. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/10 "2014-06-05T17:17:14Z")
> [@hotflungwok](#): > > Why does anyone listen to Ben Stein anymore? He sold his credibility for a bag of money long time ago. He’s gotten so bad that I have trouble believing him when he talks about Clear Eyes. Didn’t he loose his nyt gig over the clear eyes gig being fraudulent somehow? (Googling, I guess it was one of those sleezy free credit score outfits, not clear eyes.) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/11 "2014-06-05T20:06:42Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > Didn’t he loose his nyt gig over the clear eyes gig being fraudulent somehow? > > (Googling, I guess it was one of those sleezy free credit score outfits, not clear eyes.) Stein was a columnist for the New York Times. His contract said that he couldn’t do any commercial endorsements, which is apparently standard for Times columnists. Stein went ahead and began doing endorsements for a credit score company because he somehow figured that didn’t count. The Times fired him. Stein claimed it was because they didn’t like his politics. Now the Times presumably was aware of what Stein’s politics were when they hired him. There was never apparently any issues over what he wrote. (It’s not like the New York Times is some left-wing publication.) The Times said he was fired over the endorsements, it was a clause in Stein’s contract, and Stein was doing endorsements. But I guess claiming you’re a political martyr sounds better. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/12 "2014-06-05T20:45:02Z")
If it wasn’t for ‘Win Ben Stein’s Money’, he would be a complete waste of flesh and oxygen. I really liked that show. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2014, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/13 "2014-06-05T20:54:09Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > I have read that one of the main sticking points was how they were going to finance the healthcare system. They had agreed on a payroll tax with a worker and a company contribution like Social Security has. Nixon wanted the individual to pay for most of it while Kennedy wanted the company to pay for most of it. The irony is that anyone with any knowledge of tax theory knows that it does not matter which side pays for the payroll tax the tax incidence is all on the worker. **So Kennedy held out for a meaningless issue** and after a while pressure on both sides nixed the deal. That was the liberals best chance for a health care takeover by the government for almost forty years and Kennedy blew it. Thankfully that idiot was in charge of the push for health care legislation and not someone competent. Nepotism sometimes works out for good. (bolding mine) Couldn’t you also say that Nixon held out for a meaningless issue? ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/14 "2014-06-06T15:22:10Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > (bolding mine) > > Couldn’t you also say that Nixon held out for a meaningless issue? The difference is that Kennedy was an ideologue and government health care was on the liberal’s wishlist since the end of WW2. For Nixon, he just wanted an accomplishment to burnish his re-election campaign. He was consumed with foreign policy and he was ready to compromise with congress over domestic policy so he could do want he wanted in foreign affairs. He did not need to have a bill to get what he wanted since he was re-elected in a landslide. He ended up getting what he wanted and Kennedy ended up with nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ben-stein-on-nixon-ted-kennedy-and-health-care/690064/15 "2014-06-06T18:48:12Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > The difference is that Kennedy was an ideologue and government health care was on the liberal’s wishlist since the end of WW2. For Nixon, he just wanted an accomplishment to burnish his re-election campaign. He was consumed with foreign policy and he was ready to compromise with congress over domestic policy so he could do want he wanted in foreign affairs. He did not need to have a bill to get what he wanted since he was re-elected in a landslide. He ended up getting what he wanted and Kennedy ended up with nothing. And Nixon was impeached and disgraced and Kennedy served for another three decades.