# Benign Neglect of Opioids Smacks of Racism **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 19, 2017, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351 "2017-06-19T02:32:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2017, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/21 "2017-06-19T20:24:13Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > No. This would indeed place the OP on the left of most Democrats. Most Democrats are vicious towards drug addicts and have been for quite some time. Just in this case, the “left-wing” position makes sense. That’s not the point I was making. The OP appears to think that what “left-wing Democrats” want is to hurt white people. That’s not true. Left-wing Democrats want black people and white people to be treated equally - but they want it to be done by making conditions for black people better not by making conditions for white people worse. ---
**Author:** ![Arcite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/67e7ee/32.png) [@Arcite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arcite)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2017, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/22 "2017-06-19T22:25:52Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I think a better comparison than crack vs. opioids is crack vs. meth. Meth also has no legitimate medical uses, is perceived as a lower-class drug affecting mostly white people, and yet the sentencing guidelines are the same as crack and I don’t see a lot more compassion aimed at meth heads vs. crack heads. > > Regards, > Shodan Believe it or not–and I know how hard this is to believe; I’m a psychiatrist and did not learn this until after residency–methamphetamine is an FDA-approved prescription medicine in the United States. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2017, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/23 "2017-06-19T22:49:40Z")
> [@Arcite](#): > > Believe it or not–and I know how hard this is to believe; I’m a psychiatrist and did not learn this until after residency–methamphetamine is an FDA-approved prescription medicine in the United States. That is honestly hard to believe. Where the heck did you train? And when? I trained as a lowly Family Medicine doc in the mid 80’s and got schooled in that right from the get-go. Meth was **only** to be prescribed for narcolepsy, ADD/ADHD, ddx of depression, and a few other niche uses, but **NEVER** for weight loss. Oh, well. I’ve had a few blindingly obvious in hindsight knowledge deficits of my own, so I shouldn’t point fingers . … . ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2017, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/24 "2017-06-19T22:58:22Z")
> [@Arcite](#): > > Believe it or not–and I know how hard this is to believe; I’m a psychiatrist and did not learn this until after residency–methamphetamine is an FDA-approved prescription medicine in the United States. Yep, sure is! I’ve worked with people who remember when it wasn’t even a controlled substance, and doctors gave it out for the asking, because it was thought to be a safe weight-reducing drug. My BFF’s mother believes she took it during at least one of her pregnancies, all of them in the early 1960s, to minimize her weight gain which was a big thing at the time. :eek: The one time I dispensed Desoxyn, it was for a terminal cancer patient to treat morphine-induced fatigue. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2017, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/25 "2017-06-19T23:12:43Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I think a better comparison than crack vs. opioids is crack vs. meth. Meth also has no legitimate medical uses, is perceived as a lower-class drug affecting mostly white people, and yet the sentencing guidelines are the same as crack and I don’t see a lot more compassion aimed at meth heads vs. crack heads. > > Regards, > Shodan Isn’t adderall/ritalin exactly methamphetamine? I think it does have medical uses. > [@WillFarnaby](#): > > I fail to see the logic behind targeting drug companies for “flooding the market” with drugs. Decreasing the supply of legal drugs would drive more addicts to illegal drugs and also increase the price. This would exacerbate the problems that most addicts have, namely acquiring safe drugs at a low cost. Decreasing the supply of drugs would lower the incidence of drug addiction in aggregate. Most addicts who abuse prescription drugs eventually move on to illicit substances, not the other way around. Many of the heroin addicts we have now would have never become heroin users if it wasn’t for the legal drugs that started the addictions. ---
**Author:** ![Arcite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/67e7ee/32.png) [@Arcite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arcite)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2017, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/26 "2017-06-19T23:18:09Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > That is honestly hard to believe. Where the heck did you train? And when? > > I trained as a lowly Family Medicine doc in the mid 80’s and got schooled in that right from the get-go. Meth was **only** to be prescribed for narcolepsy, ADD/ADHD, ddx of depression, and a few other niche uses, but **NEVER** for weight loss. > > Oh, well. I’ve had a few blindingly obvious in hindsight knowledge deficits of my own, so I shouldn’t point fingers . … . I’m aware you were probably being facetious, but what I was saying was hard to believe was the fact that meth is a prescription drug, not the fact that I didn’t learn that it was in residency. I trained at a mid-tier Midwestern program and graduated just a couple of years ago. From the beginning of residency through today, I have never encountered a single instance of any physician prescribing methamphetamine, nor any patient who attested to ever having received a prescription for it, for any indication. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2017, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/27 "2017-06-19T23:49:45Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Some of that is true because the horses have already left the barn. Some more is true because we’re not going to get treatment for addicts who would benefit from it and let the rest die. But allowing drug companies to produce more doses of drugs that are needed, and more addictive forms of those drugs will just make the problem worse. I think the disagreement comes in when we talk about the “problem”. It seems like many people think the problem is addiction. That is a problem that would be wrestled with by doctors on a case-by-case basis. Also voluntary societal arrangements have a role to play, as well as societal promotion of virtuous behavior in general. A doctor should consider the risk of the patient developing an addiction when prescribing medication. The drugs that are being produced create a high that a lot of people seem to like. When you limit this supply, you are exacerbating what i consider to be the problems. The drugs cost too much. Nicotine is highly addictive, yet you don’t see teenage girls prostituting themselves for cigarettes. You don’t see teenage boys dying from a bad cigarette. > [@CarnalK](#): > > Do you have some examples in mind? The governments of most large cities in the United States The Congressional Black Caucus, and the Democratic Caucus in general Bill Clinton Barack Obama That about covers it. > [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > That’s not the point I was making. The OP appears to think that what “left-wing Democrats” want is to hurt white people. That’s not true. Left-wing Democrats want black people and white people to be treated equally - but they want it to be done by making conditions for black people better not by making conditions for white people worse. Ok I would argue that is mostly true, of course one wonders why they don’t advocate for laissez-faire if that’s the case. 😃 Leftists in general tend to believe the economy is a zero-sum venture, with rich people only getting ahead at the expense of the poor. > [@Ambivalid](#): > > Isn’t adderall/ritalin exactly methamphetamine? I think it does have medical uses. > Decreasing the supply of drugs would lower the incidence of drug addiction in aggregate. Most addicts who abuse prescription drugs eventually move on to illicit substances, not the other way around. Many of the heroin addicts we have now would have never become heroin users if it wasn’t for the legal drugs that started the addictions. So you want to combat addiction by limiting the supply of safe and potentially cheap drugs? Has that been an effective tactic so far in the drug war? Seriously, your argument is basically a carbon-copy of what the drug warriors have been saying for decades. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2017, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/28 "2017-06-20T00:12:33Z")
> [@Arcite](#): > > I trained at a mid-tier Midwestern program and graduated just a couple of years ago. From the beginning of residency through today, I have never encountered a single instance of any physician prescribing methamphetamine, nor any patient who attested to ever having received a prescription for it, for any indication. Times sure have changed. Probably for the better, in that regard. I’m glad to hear it’s no longer getting handed out like candy for attention deficit. I’ve seen hundreds of adult patients who were on it for that. Not prescribed by me, but by pshrinks. but I admit it’s tailed off in the last 5 years or so. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2017, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/29 "2017-06-20T00:50:32Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > I think the disagreement comes in when we talk about the “problem”. It seems like many people think the problem is addiction. That is a problem that would be wrestled with by doctors on a case-by-case basis. Also voluntary societal arrangements have a role to play, as well as societal promotion of virtuous behavior in general. A doctor should consider the risk of the patient developing an addiction when prescribing medication. > > The drugs that are being produced create a high that a lot of people seem to like. When you limit this supply, you are exacerbating what i consider to be the problems. The drugs cost too much. Nicotine is highly addictive, yet you don’t see teenage girls prostituting themselves for cigarettes. You don’t see teenage boys dying from a bad cigarette. You don’t see teenage boys overdosing on cigarettes either. Opiate addicts develop a tolerance and need more and more of the drug, and don’t just take it to maintain pain relief. Some of the users are just getting high and will eventually OD if they have ready access to the drugs. Not all of them, but they’ll certainly shorten their lives and encounter medical problems related to the drugs they use. Doctor’s can’t assess the risk of addiction years down the road. When it’s needed the drugs should be prescribed, along with required pain management programs, and other efforts to alleviate the pain. But prescribing bottles of pills where the patient can take as many as they want will just create more problems. They’ll want more than are prescribed and fuel the illegal drug market which we are unable to stop. I don’t care if people take drugs, I don’t care if people kill themselves with drugs, the problems are woven into our other societal failures, there’s no simple remedy, but dispensing the drugs like candy and me paying the associated costs through my tax dollars is not a solution. I’ll pay for the treatment, I’ll pay for the alternatives, but right now we’re all paying for dumbasses to get a buzz on and then kill themselves, and we’ll pay more for the other dumbasses who will want to use punishment as a solution. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2017, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/30 "2017-06-20T00:55:37Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > I trained as a lowly Family Medicine doc in the mid 80’s and got schooled in that right from the get-go. Meth was **only** to be prescribed for narcolepsy, ADD/ADHD, ddx of depression, and a few other niche uses, but **NEVER** for weight loss. Jeez, I’ve got a bottle of methamphetamine salts. Had to check that out, I guess it’s just Adderall. Tried a couple for for ADD and didn’t like it. I know illegal meth use has grown over the years but I used to live near Chester PA which was a major source of illegal meth in the 70s, it’s been ruining lives for a long time. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2017, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/31 "2017-06-20T01:10:15Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > So you want to combat addiction by limiting the supply of safe and potentially cheap drugs? Has that been an effective tactic so far in the drug war? > > Seriously, your argument is basically a carbon-copy of what the drug warriors have been saying for decades. Starting around a decade ago, there was an aggressive shift towards more liberal prescriptions for pain. Undoubtedly, this has led to people who don’t really need the meds getting them and ultimately becoming addicted. By making prescription pain meds more difficult to get, it will have the effect of people who would have become addicted remaining sober. It’s not in a vacuum tho, it will also have the negative effect of some legitimate pain patients not getting the medicine, or even just timely administration of, the meds that they need. But significantly more people will be helped. I have been prescribed a pain reliever that underwent scheduling changes and is now much more heavily regulated. I have not been affected by this change at all, or minimally. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2017, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/32 "2017-06-20T03:27:22Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Jeez, I’ve got a bottle of methamphetamine salts. Had to check that out, I guess it’s just Adderall. Tried a couple for for ADD and didn’t like it. I know illegal meth use has grown over the years but I used to live near Chester PA which was a major source of illegal meth in the 70s, it’s been ruining lives for a long time. Adderall used to be called Obetrol. Guess why? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2017, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/33 "2017-06-20T03:43:03Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Leftists in general tend to believe the economy is a zero-sum venture, with rich people only getting ahead at the expense of the poor. And libertarians believe rich people never get ahead at the expense of the poor, which is just as delusional. So moderates have no problem with people getting rich - but they think there should be rules on how you can get rich. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2017, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/34 "2017-06-20T11:05:33Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Isn’t adderall/ritalin exactly methamphetamine? > [@TriPolar](#): > > Jeez, I’ve got a bottle of methamphetamine salts. Had to check that out, I guess it’s just Adderall. Not since the 70s [Adderall - Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adderall) ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2017, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351/35 "2017-06-20T14:34:17Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > The governments of most large cities in the United States > > The Congressional Black Caucus, and the Democratic Caucus in general > > Bill Clinton > > Barack Obama > > That about covers it. That doesn’t cover anything. Those aren’t examples of viciousness towards addicts, it’s a list of people. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/benign-neglect-of-opioids-smacks-of-racism/789351.md?page=1)