# Best way to get good at chess? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [November 26, 2011, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140 "2011-11-26T13:03:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2011, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/82 "2011-12-04T03:52:34Z")
“Can’t seal the deal” is probably actually draw by the 50-move-rule, not by stalemate. A stalemate is not synonymous with a draw; it’s just one specific sort of draw (and actually a fairly rare one). It happens when the current player has no legal move at all, and yet is not in check. ---
**Author:** ![Candyman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Candyman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Candyman74)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2011, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/83 "2011-12-04T04:01:34Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > “Can’t seal the deal” is probably actually draw by the 50-move-rule, not by stalemate. A stalemate is not synonymous with a draw; it’s just one specific sort of draw (and actually a fairly rare one). It happens when the current player has no legal move at all, and yet is not in check. No, it’s stalemate. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2011, 9:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/84 "2011-12-04T09:16:50Z")
Yes, there’s are well-known stalemates in the K+Q v K ending. The most glaring is probably some variant on this position: Black King on e8, White King on e6, White Queen on f6. Black to move is stalemated. Less common, but still important (it’s why King and Bishop’s pawn on the seventh draw against King and Queen), Black King on a1, White Queen on c2, White King anywhere, Black to move is stalemated. The technique for winning is simple though: the Queen alone can shepherd the enemy King to the edge without ever checking. Once the King is forced to the edge, bring your own King up and finish him off. Weaker King on the edge, Queen one square in and defended by the King is the basic position, e.g. BK on e8, WQ on e7, WK on any of d6, e6 or f6. ---
**Author:** ![SiXSwordS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/49beb7/32.png) [@SiXSwordS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SiXSwordS)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2011, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/85 "2011-12-04T13:43:51Z")
> [@glee](#): > > [Chess - training game (Glee v SiXSwordS) - The Game Room - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=517459) …speaking of getting one’s ass handed to you… But I should comment that I noticed a marked improvement in my game afterward. I haven’t been playing as much lately, so a similar game would be very helpful. I suspect that someone else has better chops on the diagrams, but FWIW this site: [Chess Board Editor - Apronus.com](http://www.apronus.com/chess/wbeditor.php?m=e4) was helpful in the linked game. ---
**Author:** ![Candyman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Candyman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Candyman74)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2011, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/86 "2011-12-04T14:17:11Z")
It’s a shame you can’t embed images in an SDMB thread. A chess game would work really well then! ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2011, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/87 "2011-12-04T14:27:26Z")
> [@Candyman74](#): > > Stalemate is the bane of my weak endgame. I can’t seal the deal. Stalemate shouldn’t really be a problem in a K&Q versus K end-game; it can only happen if you make a glaring mistake near the end. Stalemate **is** a big deal in K+P versus K ; in certain cases the weaker side can put the stronger side in a position where he either loses the pawn or imposes stalemate. Learning how to use and avoid this is one of the first things you should learn. Learning perfect play in this endgame is quite easy and it forms the basis of other,much harder endgames. If you haven’t already, you should also learn how to mate with K+R versus K. ---
**Author:** ![HongKongFooey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c4cdca/32.png) [@HongKongFooey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HongKongFooey)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2011, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/88 "2011-12-04T14:42:11Z")
> [@Candyman74](#): > > It’s a shame you can’t embed images in an SDMB thread. A chess game would work really well then! **Giraffe** ’s board [has the chess plug-in enabled.](http://www.giraffeboards.com/forumdisplay.php?f=61) It’s a bit clunky but good enough for edumacation purposes. ---
**Author:** ![Baal\_Houtham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baal_houtham/32/13604_2.png) [@Baal\_Houtham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baal_Houtham)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/89 "2011-12-05T04:33:40Z")
Question for Mr. **glee** : Are there some (mature, experienced) ELO 2000 players that play blindfold chess much better than some ELO 2500 players? …or does the talent for blindfold playing pretty much map directly to a player’s “innate” chess ability? ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/90 "2011-12-05T11:02:28Z")
> [@Candyman74](#): > > I can’t seem to find it again, but last night as part of my self-tutelage I was watching an online video dealing with that very concept. I’ll try to describe it if I can. > > Basically, one player brought his queen out right near the beginning and started moving it about. The other player didn’t really pay much attention to that and simply started getting his bishops and knights out and some of his pawns forward. The result was that the first player was constantly moving his queen around trying not to get it taken (because near the beginning of the game with an emptyish middle ground, as various opposing pieces were moved forward the queen was running out of places it could go). > > After a few minutes of this the result was: one player had a crapload of pieces forward in great positions dominating most of the board. In all that time, the other player had only managed to move his queen, and it was in a space it could have gotten to 7 moves ago - i.e. he’d made zero progress at all while his opponent had made craploads of process developing his pieces. The simple tips I give inexperienced players for in the opening (rather than opening analysis, which they’re not ready for) are: - control the centre (d4,d5,e4,e5), because it allows access to all parts of the board - develop your pieces (don’t move the Queen all the time) - get castled (it protects your King, especially when the centre opens up) Here’s some short examples of what **NOT** to do. 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3) Bc4 h6? 4) Nc3 Bg4 5) Nxe5! Bxd1 6) Bxf7+ Ke7 7) Nd5 checkmate 2. e4 e5 2) Bc4 Nf6 3) Nc3 Nxe4 4) Bxf7+ Kxf7 5) Nxe4 Nc6 6) Qf3+ Kg8?? 7) Ng5 Qxg5 8) Qd5 checkmate 1. e4 e5 2. Qh5?\* Nc6 3) Qg4?? d5 4) Qf3 dxe4 5) Qxe4 Nf6 6) Qf3 Bg4 7)Qb3 Nd4 8) Qxb7 Nxc2 checkmate \*the top US player Nakamura has played this - but only for shock value. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/91 "2011-12-05T11:10:30Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Hiya, good to see you back! Jim’s D&D is still going over on the 'Phant should you feel like bringing Ghan out of retirement. Also I have your absence to thank for my signature. 🆒 > > So the practical effect of knowing the K, B+N ending has been to bump up your win percentage by 0.025% (a half-point in 2000 games). I’m sure you agree that for most of us there are more profitable areas of study. 😃 Thanks for remembering me! I **do** recommend studying basic checkmates because: - you can understand them completely - it’s a good place to start and builds confidence - they might come up and once you know how to win it’s easy (Yes, I’ve only had K,B+N v K once. But failing to win such a known position would have worried me.) ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 11:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/92 "2011-12-05T11:18:16Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Less common, but still important (it’s why King and Bishop’s pawn on the seventh draw against King and Queen), Black King on a1, White Queen on c2, White King anywhere, Black to move is stalemated. Your position is: White: Qc2 K ‘somewhere’ Black: Ka1 I assume White’s last move was Qb3xc2? If we put the White King on a4,b4 or c4, White wins by playing 1. Qc3+ Kb1 2) Kb3 c1=Q 3) Qd3+ Ka1 4) Qa6+ Kb1 5) Qa2 checkmate Your point is basically true, but the exceptions show why studying endings is useful! ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/93 "2011-12-05T11:23:28Z")
> [@SiXSwordS](#): > > …speaking of getting one’s ass handed to you… > > But I should comment that I noticed a marked improvement in my game afterward. I haven’t been playing as much lately, so a similar game would be very helpful. > > I suspect that someone else has better chops on the diagrams, but FWIW this site: [Chess Board Editor - Apronus.com](http://www.apronus.com/chess/wbeditor.php?m=e4) was helpful in the linked game. Don’t feel bad - I spent the ‘10,000 hours to mastery’ on chess in my youth (and had the concentration, logic and desire needed as well.) I’m glad our game helped. 🆒 How about this - I play SDMB games v Candyman 74 and Mosier; you kindly pop diagrams into each thread; then I give you another game? ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/94 "2011-12-05T11:28:19Z")
> [@Lantern](#): > > Stalemate **is** a big deal in K+P versus K ; in certain cases the weaker side can put the stronger side in a position where he either loses the pawn or imposes stalemate. Learning how to use and avoid this is one of the first things you should learn. Learning perfect play in this endgame is quite easy and it forms the basis of other,much harder endgames. You’re absolutely right this is important - and it’s reasonably easy to understand. However any **starting** position with K+p v K is known to be a win or a draw. So the weaker side can do nothing v best play if if the original position is a win; and must play perfectly to hold the draw. (I hope I don’t sound pedantic, but chess is a game of supreme accuracy…;)) ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/95 "2011-12-05T11:49:59Z")
> [@Baal\_Houtham](#): > > Question for Mr. **glee** : > > Are there some (mature, experienced) ELO 2000 players that play blindfold chess much better than some ELO 2500 players? > > …or does the talent for blindfold playing pretty much map directly to a player’s “innate” chess ability? Call me glee! 🙂 Of course all players analyse in regular games by moving pieces in their head (a form of blindfold.) However blindfold simultaneous chess is **very** tiring. Yes, I would say there’s a clear correlation. So top players would automatically be astonishingly good at blindfold (there is an annual tournament called the Melody Amber where half the games are blindfold.) > **[Amber chess tournament](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amber_chess_tournament)** > > The Amber chess tournament (officially the Amber Rapid and Blindfold Chess Tournament, previously Melody Amber) was an annual invitation-only event for some of the world's best players, from 1992 to 2011. Since the second edition, the event uniquely combined blindfold chess and speed chess, and has been held in Monte Carlo. The tournament was sponsored by the Dutch businessman and world champion of correspondence chess, Joop van Oosterom. Named after his daughter, the tournament was usually held ... However they would probably not want to do it too much, especially simultaneously. So maybe a club player who practised a lot could play **more** games than a top player - but I doubt the standard would be very high. P.S. A cheeky chessplayer told me that if there is a blindfold simultaneous display, the players should agree to play similar bizarre moves to confuse the top chap; e.g. as Black all play some combination of … b6 … Bb7 …Na6 … Rb8 … Ba8 … Rc8 …Nb8 … Ba6 (I don’t approve, but I’m sure you get the idea!) ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/96 "2011-12-05T11:59:09Z")
OK, I’ve started v Mosier here: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14531276#post14531276](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14531276#post14531276) Candyman 74 - let me know if you’d like a game. (I can play two at a time!) ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/97 "2011-12-05T19:42:04Z")
> [@glee](#): > > Your position is: > > White: Qc2 K ‘somewhere’ > Black: Ka1 > > I assume White’s last move was Qb3xc2? > If we put the White King on a4,b4 or c4, White wins by playing > > 1. Qc3+ Kb1 2) Kb3 c1=Q 3) Qd3+ Ka1 4) Qa6+ Kb1 5) Qa2 checkmate > > Your point is basically true, but the exceptions show why studying endings is useful! _sigh_. _Thank_ you for the correction… ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/98 "2011-12-05T20:32:20Z")
And I’ve actually played to a K+R vs. K endgame a couple of times, even though I don’t play nearly as much as **glee** or other serious players do. Admittedly, both times I was in a strong position previous to that, and probably could have won quicker, but I knew I could win the K+R, and so accepted a few suboptimal trades to get to that. Better the slow victory you can be sure of, than the quick one you’re not sure of. ---
**Author:** ![Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omg_a_Black_Conservative)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/99 "2011-12-05T20:34:28Z")
The simplest way to get better at chess is to play people better than yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Candyman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Candyman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Candyman74)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/100 "2011-12-05T21:17:04Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > The simplest way to get better at chess is to play people better than yourself. Didn’t read the thread, huh? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Candyman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Candyman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Candyman74)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2011, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140/101 "2011-12-05T21:18:21Z")
> [@glee](#): > > OK, I’ve started v Mosier here: > > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14531276#post14531276](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14531276#post14531276) > > Candyman 74 - let me know if you’d like a game. (I can play two at a time!) I’d love to! I should have time next week if that’s convenient for you ? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-get-good-at-chess/604140.md?page=6)