# Best way to react when confronted with a 300lb Mountain Lion? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 25, 2002, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831 "2002-10-25T13:56:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/1 "2002-10-25T13:56:44Z")
Recently I was hiking just outside Phoenix, Arizona with a friend of mine. We were hiking on the Usury Mountain State Park. Basically, this park has one major trail about a mile long straight up the side of a mountain to what’s called the windy cave. We were up there to get some shots of sunset over Phoenix. After we got the shots, it was getting dark, and we were walking down the mountain when we heard this high pitched screeech/scream. It sounded like a woman screaming. Anyway, we continued around the corner of a small butte when we saw it…A very large tan cat about 70 feet away, staring right at us. In an instant its ears and head lowered and she started backing up to the small shelf she was sitting next to. The cat was approximately 5 feet from head to tip of tail, all tan with a white belly. The tail was strong and bulky looking. Well she stopped backing up and moved across the trail, and screamed once again. My buddy and I stood motionless until we couldn’t see it anymore. I started talking to my friend and he was fumbling around in his backpack. I said “what the hell are you doing lets get outa here!!” Well he found what he was looking for – a small, black 9mm hand gun. “This is the only reason I carry this in my back pack, for situations just like this one,” he said. Thankful that he had it, I was not convinced we were out of danger yet. To make a long story short we walked back to the car, talking very loudly to each other so as not to surprise the cat later on down the path. It worked and we only heard her scream a couple more times while decending the path. Things could have gone much different. She could have flat out charged us, then what? My friend would have had no time to fumble in his bag for his side arm. Would it have been curtins for both of us? Anyone have similar experiences, maybe with a different animal? A bear maybe. I know they tell you when confronted with a bear, you are supposed to curl up on the ground put your hands over your neck and … wait… YEAH RIGHT!!! Does that really work? I woudl hate to do that only to have the bear start gnawing on my living flesh, from behind no less.!! So what should we have done? Granted my buddy had a gun, but what if he hadn’t? I’m a pretty big guy and so is he, but come on what if? Could we have jumped on the cat and wrestled it ? Would that have worked? I used to live in Phoenix full time when I was in grad school, however I was only visiting a few weeks ago. I never really heard of too many hikers coming upon Mountain lions. And I have hiked all over the desert south west and never seen one. Only warnings and such. So any dopers have similar experiences? What are you really supposed to do when confronted with deadly animals? Can they really smell fear? ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/2 "2002-10-25T14:12:35Z")
What you don’t want to do is run away or act like prey in any manner. In my bear behavious courses, they advised making a great deal of noise on trails so as to avoid any surprise encounters. Of course, stay the heck away from a kill site or cubs/ kits/ etc. Should you come in contact, don’t appear threatning and slowly move backwards while continuing to face the animal. Then go clean yourself up. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/3 "2002-10-25T14:14:44Z")
I don’t think a 5 foot mountain lion is going to weigh 300 lbs. Depending on your size and attitude the lion will decide whether you are worth the risk of tacking or not. IIRC people attacked have mainly been fairly small women. [http://www.dfg.ca.gov/lion/](http://www.dfg.ca.gov/lion/) > [@](#): > > SOME FACTS ABOUT MOUNTAIN LIONS > Physical appearance: The mountain lion, commonly known as cougar, panther or puma, is tawny-colored with black-tipped ears and tail. Although smaller than the jaguar, it is one of North America’s largest cats. > > Adult males may be more than 8 feet long, from nose to end of tail, and generally weigh between 130 and 150 pounds. Adult females can be 7 feet long and weigh between 65 and 90 pounds. > > WHAT SHOULD YOU DO IF YOU ENCOUNTER A MOUNTAIN LION? > There’s been very little research on how to avoid mountain lion attacks. But mountain lion attacks that have occurred are being analyzed in the hope that some crucial questions can be answered: Did the victim do something to inadvertently provoke an attack? What should a person who is approached by a mountain lion do–or not do? The following suggestions are based on studies of mountain lion behavior and analysis of attacks by mountain lions, tigers and leopards: > > DO NOT HIKE ALONE: Go in groups, with adults supervising children. > KEEP CHILDREN CLOSE TO YOU: Observations of captured wild mountain lions reveal that the animals seem especially drawn to children. Keep children within your sight at all times. > DO NOT APPROACH A LION: Most mountain lions will try to avoid a confrontation. Give them a way to escape. > DO NOT RUN FROM A LION: Running may stimulate a mountain lion’s instinct to chase. Instead, stand and face the animal. Make eye contact. If you have small children with you, pick them up if possible so they don’t panic and run. Although it may be awkward, pick them up without bending over or turning away from the mountain lion. > DO NOT CROUCH DOWN OR BEND OVER: In Nepal, a researcher studying tigers and leopards watched the big cats kill cattle and domestic water buffalo while ignoring humans standing nearby. He surmised that a human standing up is just not the right shape for a cat’s prey. On the other hand, a person squatting or bending over looks a lot like a four-legged prey animal. If you’re in mountain lion country, avoid squatting, crouching or bending over, even when picking up children. > DO ALL YOU CAN TO APPEAR LARGER: Raise your arms. Open your jacket if you are wearing one. Again, pick up small children. Throw stones, branches, or whatever you can reach without crouching or turning your back. Wave your arms slowly and speak firmly in a loud voice. The idea is to convince the mountain lion that you are not prey and that you may be a danger to it. > FIGHT BACK IF ATTACKED: A hiker in Southern California used a rock to fend off a mountain lion that was attacking his son. Others have fought back successfully with sticks, caps, jackets, garden tools and their bare hands. Since a mountain lion usually tries to bite the head or neck, try to remain standing and face the attacking animal. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/4 "2002-10-25T14:18:36Z")
Most mountain lion attacks would be over long before you had a chance to pull out a gun. They have a tendency to attack by stalking their prey and dropping on them from above. They usually break the necks of their prey, death being very quick. If you saw a cat, he wasn’t stalking you. It has been said that if you see a mountain lion, it’s been watching you for some time already. They rarely attack adult humans, perfering to pick smaller prey, like young humans for example. Several children have been attacked, hiking solo. The gun was nice to have, but probably not very useful in most situations. Do you think you could have fired an accurate shot at a big cat (not 300lbs, maybe 100 to 150 or so) that was charging you at 30MPH? You’d probably only get one shot, it’d better be good. Your best bet is to look large, hold your hands up over your head, back away slowly, never run or curl up in a fetal positon, don’t bend over or crawl. If attacked, fight back, go for the face and eyes, kick and punch. Some good advice: [http://ndnd.essortment.com/mountainlionat\_rfem.htm](http://ndnd.essortment.com/mountainlionat_rfem.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/5 "2002-10-25T14:21:26Z")
Ok. It was dusk, and my poundage was off a tad. But it was big, and sure did look like it was going to attack. As quick as it gained interest in us, it quickly lost interest as well, and moved along crossing our path and continuing on down into the gully. It was certainly not malnourished either. It did in fact have a large mid section with a pretty long fold of skin under its belly. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/6 "2002-10-25T14:29:57Z")
I read an article by a fellow who encountered a puma. The cat was some distance away. When the guy bent down to pick up a stick, or diverted his gaze, the cat advanced, but stopped when he stood up and looked at it. He found that standing large and staring at it was most effective in keeping it from coming at him, as previous posts indicate. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/7 "2002-10-25T14:36:25Z")
**Telemark** , oddly enough my friend and I were speaking (very loudly) on our way down the mountain of what we would have done if she had attacked. And he remembers his grandfather saying that if you are going to shoot an animal that running at you, you had better wait till its at the end of your barrel before you fire. Because there is no way your going to hit it otherwise… ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/8 "2002-10-25T14:41:33Z")
I was told on a survival course to make oneself look as big as possible ie spread arms out, especially with coat draped over you. And don’t act either aggressively or scared. You want to make it so he is intimidated by you but not threatened (so as to defend) ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/9 "2002-10-25T14:45:58Z")
According to Worst Case Scenarios, you want to make sure you do not turn your back on the cat, but back away slowly. You should also make yourself appear as large and formidable as possible. For example, if you have a jacket or large shirt, lift and hold out the corners to give yourself the appearance of more mass. I also heard that carrying a large walking stick is a good idea. It will make you seem more formidable, and if the cat does attack and you are holding the stick in front of you it will most likely go for the stick first. If you are lucky it may be content that it has shown dominance by beating the shit out of the stick. Chances are that if you saw it, it was protecting a den of cubs, or a recent kill. ---
**Author:** ![Forbin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5e9695/32.png) [@Forbin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Forbin)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/10 "2002-10-25T14:47:28Z")
Carrying a whistle is a good idea too. A shrill blast from a whistle sends a “don’t come over here” message to preditors like lions. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/11 "2002-10-25T14:57:20Z")
Buy him a latt’e. & a nice piece of cheescake. Sit down with the mountain lion, & try to _reason_ things out. Compromise is possible. After all, do we _really_ need to bring the lawyers in on this? ----this message for peace brought to you by P.E.T.A. fnord PS-- Don’t you mean “puma”? ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/12 "2002-10-25T15:21:29Z")
_PS-- Don’t you mean “puma”?_ Not sure if the above was part of the joke, but puma = mountain lion = panther = painter, etc. Different names for the same critter. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/13 "2002-10-25T16:04:05Z")
Also catamount here in New England. They haven’t really become a viable population here yet, but unconfirmed sightings are way up and there have been a few confirmed ones. Right now the population may be transients from Canada, or escaped pets (people are insane) but they may establish a breeding population soon. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/14 "2002-10-25T17:40:59Z")
Offer him a 25 lb. mouse? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Opengrave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/919ad9/32.png) [@Opengrave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Opengrave)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/15 "2002-10-25T17:51:26Z")
I can’t believe no one has suggested the _Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch_ (and of course the _Book of Armaments_). It worked on a rabbit, why not a mountain lion? OK, seriously I have read in old books/novels that the guides in African safaris used to wear hats that had a flap that hung down in the back. Painted on the flap was a face. The thought was that most big cats will not attack a human that is facing them. The flap on the back made it appear that the human was facing them even if the cat was stalking form the rear. This could all be UL but it makes a bit of sense. NP: **Iron Maiden** – _Somewhere in Time_ ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/16 "2002-10-25T18:13:57Z")
Reminds me of a scene from the movie _Continental Divide_ where John Belushi is confronted by a Mountain Lion in his (or rather the woman he was staying with) cabin. The woman upon returning from her eagle watching notices her front door open and runs inside to find Belushi scratched and battered but generally ok. He explains that a Mountain Lion surprised him. Shocked that he survived that (big time city boy not cutout for the wilderness) she asked him how he fended it off. “Well,” Belushi explains, “when I saw him coming at me I thought to myself what would stop me if I were a Mountain Lion so I picked up that broom over there and hit him in the balls.” [sub] (Mind you…been a long time since I’ve seen the movie so my quote may not be exact but the gist of it is right.) [/sub] ---
**Author:** ![andymurph64](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a88e57/32.png) [@andymurph64](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andymurph64)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/17 "2002-10-25T18:21:58Z")
> [@](#): > > I also heard that carrying a large walking stick is a good idea. It will make you seem more formidable, and if the cat does attack and you are holding the stick in front of you it will most likely go for the stick first. I hiked many times in Wyoming when I lived there spending overnight many times. I heard moutain lions but never saw one. I was told your best friend doing this is a nice stout walking stick. Not only does it support you walking and all that but you can use it like a spear, holding it out infront of you lengthwise to keep a charging animal away. I don’t know if it works having never had to do it but it did feel better to have it. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/18 "2002-10-25T18:53:11Z")
A 9 mm? A bit anemic if you ask me. If tramping through the woods known to have bear, I would suggest a .357 Mag at a _minimum_. A .44 Mag would be ideal. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/19 "2002-10-25T19:01:13Z")
_…I have read in old books/novels that the guides in African safaris used to wear hats that had a flap that hung down in the back. Painted on the flap was a face. The thought was that most big cats will not attack a human that is facing them. The flap on the back made it appear that the human was facing them even if the cat was stalking form the rear. This could all be UL but it makes a bit of sense._ Some time in the last few years there was an aritcle in Smithsonian Magazine about tigers in some part of India. The technique you mention was described, and I believe they had a photo of one the rear-facing masks the locals used. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2002, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831/20 "2002-10-25T19:05:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Crafter\_Man \* > \*\*A 9 mm? A bit anemic if you ask me. If tramping through the woods known to have bear, I would suggest a .357 Mag at a _minimum_. A .44 Mag would be ideal. \*\* If you’re going to carry a firearm to deal with animal attacks, I’d suggest a rifle. A good shot with a .308 will kill a polar bear. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-react-when-confronted-with-a-300lb-mountain-lion/133831.md?page=2)