# Best way to remove 4x4 posts embeded in concrete? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 6, 2010, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506 "2010-05-06T13:56:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Philster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/13edae/32.png) [@Philster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Philster)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2010, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/21 "2010-05-06T20:06:35Z")
Cut it with a reciprocating saw as level as possible. Really, doing anything more serves no purpose. ---
**Author:** ![Projammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/projammer/32/559_2.png) [@Projammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Projammer)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2010, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/22 "2010-05-06T20:26:22Z")
Since the seller has indicated he’s okay with you leaving the footings there, rent or borrow a Sawzall and cut them off flush with the top of the concrete. Take it home and determine how they need to be trimmed to make it level where you’ll be installing it. Pour your own concrete footings and set [post anchors](http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xh4/R-100375031/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053) in the wet cement. ---
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2010, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/23 "2010-05-06T20:45:59Z")
> [@johnpost](#): > > cement anchors keep the posts from rotting, even treated posts will deteriorate in dirt. > [@muldoonthief](#): > > PT posts will deteriorate in concrete as well. That’s why they sit posts on the footings on decks, using some galvanized hardware to keep them in place, not set them in the footings. they will deteriorate much slower in concrete especially with drainage. to do the best job when putting posts in the ground you would pour the anchors and put in anchor bolts and plumb them and put brackets onto them. though that would work good for decks and decorative items it might not hold up to all the forces put on a playset. ---
**Author:** ![phreesh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@phreesh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phreesh)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2010, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/24 "2010-05-06T21:57:57Z")
Echo that you do NOT want to be digging out cemented-in posts. HUGE amount of work and effort and mess. Get a saw and cut the sucker off at ground level. At the new place, you have several options - -If it’s heavy, set it on the ground or maybe some cement blocks (leveled) -If you’re worried about its stability, dig some holes and cement in some new 4x4s. Attach those 4x4s to the play structure in one of many possible ways. -Use some steel spikes and attach it to those -Build a badass tree house! Good luck! ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2010, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/25 "2010-05-07T03:38:38Z")
concret e \*\*\*\* c o \*\*\*\* n c \*\*\*\* r e \*\*\*\* t econcrete ---
**Author:** ![Sparky812](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Sparky812](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparky812)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2010, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/26 "2010-05-07T13:47:35Z")
> [@This\_Just\_In\_2](#): > > Answer: Don’t > > Seriously, that is going to be a lot of work in someone else’s yard. You’re either going to have a lot of elbow grease involved or you’re going to have to rent some serious equipment to get it done. > > I just bought 10ft 4x4 pressure treated posts at Home Depot for about $15 each. So compare how much the rental/elbow grease is worth to you. > > If I were you I would just uncouple the rest of the play structure - go home and put nice brand new posts in the ground and attach the rest of the hardware to it. I missed the part about leaving the footings. So I echo this advice go with new 4x4s. > [@Projammer](#): > > Pour your own concrete footings and set [post anchors](http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xh4/R-100375031/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053) in the wet cement. Use sono tubes for pilings and one of these on top. Then you’ll never have to worry about wood rotting in concrete or ground. > [@crazyjoe](#): > > To be honest I am not sure the need for cementing it into the ground. It can’t be for stability…this thing probably weighs close to half a ton, it isn’t going anywhere. Cutting it off at ground level seems like a pretty nice option, it’s just a matter of cutting everything at about the same height. ``` With new posts you won't have to level them or you can compensate on the height of your sono tube pilings. ``` > [@crazyjoe](#): > > Also, I have seen those cement bricks specifically made for “floating deck” instalaltions and the like, could they be used here? I thkn they are called “dek-block.” You cannot use these for any freestanding structure that is more than 2 feet high. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2010, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/27 "2010-05-07T14:14:58Z")
Dig down to the concrete and cut the posts off as close to it as possible. Buy new timber stub posts of the same thickness and bolt them on the side of the cut posts , then concrete these in place in your chosen location (or concrete them in, then bolt, but that will probably require careful measuring and levelling) Either leave the concrete in the ground for the existing owner to remove, or break it up and remove it yourself using a percussion hammer or just picks and wrecking bars, but removing the timber superstructure first will make this easier anyway. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2010, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/28 "2010-05-07T14:41:36Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > Because each footing probably weighs a few hundred pounds? Ah, yes, good reason. . . ---
**Author:** ![Philster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/13edae/32.png) [@Philster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Philster)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2010, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/29 "2010-05-07T15:06:06Z")
Each footing weighs about 95 lbs, unless the lunatic who set the footings used more than one bag. ---
**Author:** ![Sparky812](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Sparky812](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparky812)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2010, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/30 "2010-05-07T15:27:26Z")
> [@Philster](#): > > Each footing weighs about 95 lbs, unless the lunatic who set the footings used more than one bag. Yep, the average weight of concrete is approx. 150 lbs. per cubic foot which would require a 60 lb. bag, so a 40lb. bag would come in around 95-100 lbs. Here’s is a good [link](http://www.sakrete.com/projects/calculators.aspx) for estimating how much concrete you’ll need. ---
**Author:** ![crazyjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f14d63/32.png) [@crazyjoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crazyjoe)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/31 "2010-05-07T16:20:33Z")
> [@Sparky812](#): > > You cannot use these for any freestanding structure that is more than 2 feet high. I am not sure this is true. See here: [http://www.deckplans.com/how-to-build-a-splash-pool-deck/step-4](http://www.deckplans.com/how-to-build-a-splash-pool-deck/step-4) This is obviously a \> 2 foot tall structure. Do I need to start another thread, titled “How do I dig post holes for footings underneath a 50 foot tall pine tree?” ---
**Author:** ![Sparky812](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Sparky812](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparky812)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2010, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/32 "2010-05-11T11:33:16Z")
Seriously?! I wouldn’t follow that design, there are too many flaws which would make it unstable over time. Are you willing to take that risk with a climber for your children? In my area, the Ontario Building Code Act states: > [@](#): > > Deck blocks can only be used where: > > 1. The deck is not attached to the house, > 2. The deck is less than 55m2 (592 ft2), and > 3. The distance from the finished ground to the under side of the floor joists is not more than 600mm (23 5/8 in) at any point. Where are you located? Check your local building codes. I have experience using deck blocks and they suit that purpose fine, but they fail at any other application. As far as the post holes go, rent a gas auger then have some big heavy friends help you. Seriously! … hire a post hole company. ---
**Author:** ![crazyjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f14d63/32.png) [@crazyjoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crazyjoe)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2010, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/33 "2010-05-11T13:16:11Z")
Well, after a long, fun day yesterday disassembling this thing, I have come to some conclusions: 1. Using twisty nails AND carriage bolts to hold these things together is a damn foolish way to operate. It’s WAY overbuilt and also makes it a bear to take apart. Way too many places where I was not able to get the recip saw in to cut the nails, either. 2. Despite my earlier thoughts, this was not cemented into the ground. The posts are showing some deterioration where they were sunk into the ground. 3. Spoke to a contractor doing some work on my porch who recommended against trying to dig post holes under the tree. Seriously, we are talking about 4 or 5 inch thick roots here. He suggested standing it on the ground and using stakes to anchor it. I will do this as well as make some effort to keep it from being in constant contact with the ground…but the presence of a sandbox underneath means it will have some soil contact at all times. Hopefully a good oil based paint and primer will extend the life of the set. It doesn’t need to last forever, just until the kids are too old for it. ---
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2010, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/34 "2010-05-11T13:33:49Z")
> [@crazyjoe](#): > > Well, after a long, fun day yesterday disassembling this thing, I have come to some conclusions: > > 1. Using twisty nails AND carriage bolts to hold these things together is a damn foolish way to operate. It’s WAY overbuilt and also makes it a bear to take apart. the carriage bolts provide strength and are a good method for disassembly or maintenance when needed. if you use a single bolt at a joint (that isn’t let in) you need to prevent rotation. the twisty nails may have been used for that purpose and they are destructive to remove. you can get the same with easier disassembly with some smaller long lag bolts. ---
**Author:** ![Sparky812](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Sparky812](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparky812)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2010, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/35 "2010-05-11T14:44:33Z")
> [@crazyjoe](#): > > 1. Using twisty nails AND carriage bolts to hold these things together is a damn foolish way to operate. It’s WAY overbuilt and also makes it a bear to take apart. Way too many places where I was not able to get the recip saw in to cut the nails, either. Do you mean spiral nails? Yep, they can be a pain but if you get some leverage they pull out quite easily. Carriage bolts… meet Impact Driver… no problem!🙂 ---
**Author:** ![FluffyBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecb155/32.png) [@FluffyBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FluffyBob)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2010, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/36 "2010-05-11T15:16:42Z")
> [@johnpost](#): > > cement anchors keep the posts from rotting, even treated posts will deteriorate in dirt. I have to assume you live in a very different climate than I do here with very different materials available because the exact opposite is true at least where I live, in southern Alberta. This is just wrong. All wood posts will eventually rot at the point the post emerges from the concrete. Water builds up at that point and the post can never dry out. Posts in packed in soil or gravel, (or properly concreted in with concrete in a bell on the only the bottom half of the buried portion of the post) seem to fare much better. Posts in concrete pilings/sono tubes with the top of the concrete well above ground level and rounded for drainage last a long time. I have pulled out many posts packed only in soil and most are intact though with the surface ablated. Old concreted posts typically will snap off right above the concrete. In wet enough conditions posts will rot through eventually whether in concrete or not. ---
**Author:** ![Khendrask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3e96dc/32.png) [@Khendrask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khendrask)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2010, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/37 "2010-05-11T15:45:10Z")
Strangely enough, the standard here for building a dock in the water calls for no concrete, no casing, no nothing. Just sink 6x6, treated lumber posts directly into the lake-bed. We have lots of older docks standing just fine. As a matter of fact, it’s normally the decking boards that fail from the sun-baking. ---
**Author:** ![crazyjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f14d63/32.png) [@crazyjoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crazyjoe)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2010, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/38 "2010-05-11T17:34:01Z")
> [@Sparky812](#): > > Do you mean spiral nails? Yep, they can be a pain but if you get some leverage they pull out quite easily. > > Carriage bolts… meet Impact Driver… no problem!🙂 Removing the nuts from the carriage bolts were not a problem. The problem was that the @#$% who put them in did not drill a big enough hole. He must have hammered the SOB’s through, because I had to use a punch and a hearty gorilla swing to dislodge it enough to get vice grips around it and then twist it out (the carriage bolt was threaded along its entire 6.5 inch length. Then removing 4 spiral nails, even with a 2-foot crowbar, is not exactly easy when the only positions you can take are precarious. Also, the ends of the bolts were the rounded, flat kind. There was no way to use a wrench to dislodge them, I had to use vice grips. All in all, it was a long, hard, day. ---
**Author:** ![Sparky812](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Sparky812](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparky812)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/39 "2010-05-13T11:42:34Z")
> [@crazyjoe](#): > > Removing the nuts from the carriage bolts were not a problem. The problem was that the @#$% who put them in did not drill a big enough hole. He must have hammered the SOB’s through, because I had to use a punch and a hearty gorilla swing to dislodge it enough to get vice grips around it and then twist it out (the carriage bolt was threaded along its entire 6.5 inch length. Then removing 4 spiral nails, even with a 2-foot crowbar, is not exactly easy when the only positions you can take are precarious. > > Also, the ends of the bolts were the rounded, flat kind. There was no way to use a wrench to dislodge them, I had to use vice grips. > > All in all, it was a long, hard, day. Vice grips!? I’ll bet it was a long day! After removing the nuts, you couldn’t have used a sledge to pop the bolt’s head out the other side then used your crowbar with block of wood to pull them out? Also,once you remove one, you could use it as a punch with a hammer or sledge to knock the others out. ---
**Author:** ![crazyjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f14d63/32.png) [@crazyjoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crazyjoe)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506/40 "2010-05-13T15:21:34Z")
I did eventrually think of using another bolt as a punch later in the day, after I had removed 10 or so carriage bolts. The problem is that you still have to un-embed the bolts you used as a punch. Didn’t have a lot of blocks of wood that were less than 5 or 6 feet long, which makes things terribly inconvenient, especially given the positional challeneges above. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/best-way-to-remove-4x4-posts-embeded-in-concrete/538506.md?page=1)