# Better Call Saul "Alpine Shepard Boy" 3/2 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 3, 2015, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072 "2015-03-03T03:56:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2015, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/61 "2015-03-04T23:35:54Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > Not a big deal for me, but be aware that not everyone watches those previews. This is the sort of thing that can set off epic battles royale in some threads; here it’s probably fine (though a spoiler box might be a courtesy). Agreed, please put such comments in clearly marked spoiler boxes. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/62 "2015-03-05T00:24:04Z")
Having never seen Breaking Bad, I would appreciate someone telling me about Mike’s background and situation. ---
**Author:** ![DrForrester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8edcca/32.png) [@DrForrester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrForrester)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/63 "2015-03-05T01:11:23Z")
> **[Mike Ehrmantraut](https://breakingbad.fandom.com/wiki/Mike_Ehrmantraut)** > > Michael "Mike" Ehrmantraut is an American career criminal, Marine Corps veteran, and former Philadelphia police officer. Calm and calculating, Mike later became a private investigator, hitman, assassin, and violent fixer for drug traffickers to... ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/64 "2015-03-05T01:21:28Z")
Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![splatterpunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3be4f8/32.png) [@splatterpunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/splatterpunk)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/65 "2015-03-05T03:09:30Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > Right, and no disrespect, I just thought it an odd turn the discussion took when PA emissions laws and regulations were being thoroughly analyzed. > > Besides, isn’t it supposed to be 2001? It’s a prop car they used for the year, I doubt they got too hung up on the emission stickers. It’s 2002. In episode 1, Jimmy’s check for the PD work was dated sometime in 2002. @ **davidm** : Are the dates on the stickers issue dates or expiration dates? (As if this hijack hasn’t derailed the thread enough as it is.) ---
**Author:** ![LawMonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@LawMonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LawMonkey)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/66 "2015-03-05T04:25:03Z")
> [@splatterpunk](#): > > (As if this hijack hasn’t derailed the thread enough as it is.) While I am not normally one for putting much importance into this sort of incidental detail… man, it’s Vince Gilligan. I listened to the insider podcasts for the last season or two of Breaking Bad. “Obsessive attention to detail” does not even begin to describe these guys. If it was prominently featured in a shot on the show, I can pretty much guarantee some thought went into it (even if it won’t necessarily turn into a major or even minor plot thread). ---
**Author:** ![Chicago\_Faucet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chicago_faucet/32/13910_2.png) [@Chicago\_Faucet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chicago_Faucet)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/67 "2015-03-05T04:49:58Z")
Was anyone else surprised to find out that Chuck and Jimmy were brothers? I thought that they were father and son. Just thinking as I’m typing, trying to figure out the timeline in vague terms, because I like to compare times - not that it’s really _that_ important overall to the show. We’re watching a timeless series that happened sometime in the recent past - although the non-smartphones are humorous. I assume the show starts around 2003. So this is about six years before Saul meets Walt. The flashback to Cicero, just assuming, was probably ten years before this - give or take. I think we are led to believe or assume that Chuck saved Jimmy, and Jimmy decided to turn to law as a profession in return - as an adult. In that flashback, there were hair and style issues leading me to believe the ten years difference. Also, the time to get a degree and law degree and pass the bar, and then work a couple years in the profession leads me to believe the ten years from the flashback. So, we are looking at the early 90s when the Cicero flashback happened. What is really starting to build up in me is going to be the name change from Jimmy McGill to Saul Goodman. We saw where the name “'Sall good, man” came from, but think about what has to happen for Jimmy to take the name Saul. I mean, his brother has to be out of the picture - because he would have no part of it. It has to be forced upon him by the HHM law firm. And, he is already a local celebrity with the name Jimmy McGill, even with the courts. To have to change his name to Saul Goodman will take something monumental happening. ---
**Author:** ![magnusblitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@magnusblitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magnusblitz)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/68 "2015-03-05T06:32:37Z")
> [@Chicago\_Faucet](#): > > Was anyone else surprised to find out that Chuck and Jimmy were brothers? I thought that they were father and son. I admit I wasn’t clear on their relationship after the first episode, but I looked it up and found out they were brothers. It probably doesn’t help that there’s already a 15-year age gap between the actors (Odenkirk is 52, McKean is 67) plus they’re clearly using makeup/etc to make Jimmy look younger than Breaking Bad, whereas I don’t think they’re doing the same for Chuck. As an aside, Better Call Saul is set in 2002, and Breaking Bad starts in September 2009. So yeah, pretty close. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/69 "2015-03-05T12:17:18Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > Agreed, please put such comments in clearly marked spoiler boxes. Thanks! I second (third?) that. I hate previews, never watch them. (I hate “previouslies”, as in “previously on…” almost as much, because they don’t just recap the past episode or two, but show scenes from much earlier episodes which telegraph what characters or events are going to be significant in the current one.) > [@Chicago\_Faucet](#): > > What is really starting to build up in me is going to be the name change from Jimmy McGill to Saul Goodman. We saw where the name “'Sall good, man” came from, but think about what has to happen for Jimmy to take the name Saul. I mean, his brother has to be out of the picture - because he would have no part of it. It has to be forced upon him by the HHM law firm. I wouldn’t assume that. In Breaking Bad he said [spoiler]“My real name’s McGill. The Jew thing I just do for the homeboys. They all want a pipe-hitting member of the tribe, so to speak…” I’m not sure what that “pipe-hitting” bit means (“the tribe” is presumably the Hebrew tribe), but stereotypically, gang-banger types are keen to use “Jew lawyers”. [/spoiler] So while we can’t necessarily assume everything BB-era Saul says is gospel, I don’t know why he would lie about that and his explanation made sense. > [@Joey\_P](#): > > If you listen to the pod cast from Breaking Bad or Just Call Saul, they get hung up about _everything_. Rhea (Kim) was saying how amazed she was that her office was decorated properly. Not just random stuff, but right down to year books from when her character would have been in high school. All the paper on the desk had actual words on it. Every newspaper article was an actual article and not just a bunch of gibberish. Yeah, I never listened to the BB podcast but I’ve really been enjoying this one. And Rhea seems like a really smart, interesting, dedicated actor (and I like that she prefers “actor” to “actress”, as do I). > [@magnusblitz](#): > > I admit I wasn’t clear on their relationship after the first episode, but I looked it up and found out they were brothers. > > It probably doesn’t help that there’s already a 15-year age gap between the actors (Odenkirk is 52, McKean is 67) plus they’re clearly using makeup/etc to make Jimmy look younger than Breaking Bad, whereas I don’t think they’re doing the same for Chuck. I was thinking the same things, even when I kept seeing in reviews that they were brothers (from critics who had presumably seen several eps). It could be seen as a strange casting choice, to cast a 67 year old to play the brother of a guy who is at this point presumably trying to represent mid-'40s (in the main timeline of the show). But hey, my oldest son is 13 years older than my youngest, and a high school girlfriend had just one sibling, a sister who was 17 years older. So it is obviously possible, though unusual. And normally on a TV show you wouldn’t go for something that unusual unless there was some specific plot reason to do it. > [@davidm](#): > > That rancher asked if cash was okay. What would have happened if Jimmy had asked for a check? No problem–he presumably has a “National Bank of \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_” (I forget what he was calling his country). ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/70 "2015-03-05T12:47:00Z")
> [@UncleRojelio](#): > > So you’ve evidently never read a Breaking Bad thread on this forum? Oh no! I believe I was fairly active in those threads as well. But no where near as much as when LOST was airing. Damn, talk about picking over the most minute of details with that show. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/71 "2015-03-05T13:12:37Z")
> [@splatterpunk](#): > > It’s 2002. In episode 1, Jimmy’s check for the PD work was dated sometime in 2002. > > @ **davidm** : Are the dates on the stickers issue dates or expiration dates? (As if this hijack hasn’t derailed the thread enough as it is.) It’s the expiration date, and yes, I was mistaken in saying that her last inspection was in 2002. Since the date is an expiration date the last safety inspection was in Dec 2001 and she left sometime after that and before the end of 2002 and, because one of the stickers is dated 6/2002 presumably before that had to be renewed. So she left between 12/2001 and 6/2002. Regarding the discrepancy in the dates between the safety and emissions stickers; I found some information on this page: [67 Pa. Code Subchapter A. General Provisions](http://www.pacode.com/secure/data/067/chapter175/subchapAtoc.html) > [@](#): > > § 175.5. Semiannual inspection. > > School buses, vehicles which are under contract with or owned by a school district or a private or parochial school, including vehicles having chartered group and party rights under the Public Utility Commission and used to transport school students; passenger vans used to transport persons for hire or owned by a commercial enterprise and used for the transportation of employees to or from their place of employment; mass transit vehicles and motor carrier vehicles with a registered gross weight in excess of 17,000 pounds, other than farm vehicles for which a biennial certificate of exemption has been issued shall be subject to semiannual inspection. From what I can tell this applies only to the safety inspection and not the emissions inspection which presumably would still be only once a year. So her two stickers being 6 months out of sync (presuming it’s not a mistake by the props people) probably indicates that the car fell under semiannual, rather than annual, safety inspection requirements. It’s obviously not a bus and doesn’t exceed 17,000 pounds and it’s not a van, so apparently it was owned by or under contract with a school. I don’t think schools generally contract small passenger vehicles so it may have been the property of a Pennsylvania school district (or some private school). ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/72 "2015-03-05T13:59:55Z")
Since Mike was a Philly cop, I’m wondering if maybe PA police cars, and Philly police cars in particular, fall under semiannual inspection requirements. The statute I linked to doesn’t mention police vehicles, and googling it is difficult - you get a bunch of results about police enforcement of sticker requirements - and it’s surprisingly difficult to find an image of a PA police car where the stickers are legible. Apparently the Philadelphia school district has it’s own police. [http://articles.philly.com/2011-10-16/news/30286431\_1\_police-officers-heroin-possession-district-policeman](http://articles.philly.com/2011-10-16/news/30286431_1_police-officers-heroin-possession-district-policeman) Whether or not their cars belong to the school district I can’t say. Could Mike have been a school cop at some point? Sort of a last stop in his fall from grace? Of course that wouldn’t explain how his daughter ended up with the car. ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/73 "2015-03-05T16:30:41Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > I believe her character is supposed to be his daughter-in-law who eventually gives birth to his granddaughter whom he dearly loved and breaks bad to make a ton of money for her when she was old enough. Somehow I totally missed Mike and his daughter-in-law. I do vaguely remember a comment about a detective being a long way from home. Can someone sum it up for me? ---
**Author:** ![Bumbershoot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bumbershoot/32/3428_2.png) [@Bumbershoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bumbershoot)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/74 "2015-03-05T16:46:02Z")
I rewatched it last night and the Subaru does have a front plate, but it sure looks like one of our six-character red-on-yellow New Mexico plates. Except as someone pointed out, we don’t issue front plates here in New Mexico. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/75 "2015-03-05T19:15:05Z")
> [@Bumbershoot](#): > > I rewatched it last night and the Subaru does have a front plate, but it sure looks like one of our six-character red-on-yellow New Mexico plates. Except as someone pointed out, we don’t issue front plates here in New Mexico. When I lived in Kansas over a decade ago (about the time frame of this show, 2002ish), you could pay extra for a second license plate if you wanted. Lots of people did this just so they didn’t have ugly screw holes or an empty frame on their front bumper. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/76 "2015-03-05T20:45:49Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I was thinking the same things, even when I kept seeing in reviews that they were brothers (from critics who had presumably seen several eps). It could be seen as a strange casting choice, to cast a 67 year old to play the brother of a guy who is at this point presumably trying to represent mid-'40s (in the main timeline of the show). But hey, my oldest son is 13 years older than my youngest, and a high school girlfriend had just one sibling, a sister who was 17 years older. > > So it is obviously possible, though unusual. And normally on a TV show you wouldn’t go for something that unusual unless there was some specific plot reason to do it. My sister was 21 when I was born, most strangers took her for my mother and my mother for my grandmother 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/77 "2015-03-05T20:59:34Z")
> [@grude](#): > > My sister was 21 when I was born, most strangers took her for my mother and my mother for my grandmother 🙂 I’ll bet your Mother liked that. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![SJL4041](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/73ab20/32.png) [@SJL4041](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SJL4041)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/78 "2015-03-05T21:04:38Z")
I agree that this episode was probably too slowly paced if you hadn’t ready seen Breaking Bad, but it was a very important point in the series. Gilligan seems to love have characters do the right thing, set off on the right path, only to be dragged back to the dark side almost unwittingly. Saul has resolved to take up “elder law,” he’s even invested in the Matlock suit and fruit cup advertising. He’s concentrating his considerable charm on the nursing home residents and handing his card out to elderly parking lot attendants. It would be very Gilligan to have whatever Mike is dealing with drag Saul back to the wrong side of the law. Jane had gone straight, until Jesse dragged her under. Jesse went straight until Walt pulled him back in. Walt must have gone straight five times, but always backslid. I think we’ll see a similar pattern with Saul/Jimmy. ---
**Author:** ![rock\_party](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e19b73/32.png) [@rock\_party](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rock_party)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/79 "2015-03-05T21:44:33Z")
Fun fact: I grew up in ABQ, just one block from the Alpine lady’s house. A school friend lived in the house growing up and I actually played there when I was a kid. Also, Jimmy driving and hitting the skate board twins was filmed just one block further away from the Alpine lady’s house. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072/80 "2015-03-05T21:49:45Z")
> [@SJL4041](#): > > handing his card out to\*\* elderly\*\* parking lot attendants. You _want_ to have your knees broken with a Louisville slugger? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-alpine-shepard-boy-3-2/714072.md?page=5)