# Better Call Saul - Finale **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 19, 2016, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625 "2016-04-19T04:23:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![btcg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecd19e/32.png) [@btcg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/btcg)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/81 "2016-04-20T06:18:42Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > For what it’s worth, here are copies of all of the documents in question. > > [http://images.sync.amctv.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/MVfiles\_2up\_small.pdf](http://images.sync.amctv.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/MVfiles_2up_small.pdf) > > There are some there that are obviously copies of things that would have been mailed out but, yeah, they were probably mailed out before Jimmy made the changes, so I think people may be right when they say that Chuck was the only one who saw the doctored versions. **If so then my comments about forensic analysis are obviously moot**. No big deal. It’s already forgotten. ---
**Author:** ![Pedro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/919ad9/32.png) [@Pedro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pedro)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/82 "2016-04-20T06:24:13Z")
I expected the show to pick up but the opposite is happening. The Kettlemans and the courthouse appearances and the nail salon office where good comedic relief but now it’s just becoming dull. It’s not bad but it’s no BB either. ---
**Author:** ![btcg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecd19e/32.png) [@btcg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/btcg)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/83 "2016-04-20T06:29:00Z")
> [@Pedro](#): > > I expected the show to pick up but the opposite is happening. The Kettlemans and the courthouse appearances and the nail salon office where good comedic relief but now it’s just becoming dull. It’s not bad but it’s no BB either. Glad I’m not the only one who feels that way. Still, it’s better than most television… save The Americans and Vikings… my other two fav’s. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 7:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/84 "2016-04-20T07:07:53Z")
I’m still enjoying it a lot, but I was kind of hoping that the guy with the baseball cards would be a continuing story for longer than it was. I didn’t find the Kettlemans all that interesting, but he was amusing. ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/85 "2016-04-20T07:11:14Z")
> [@Absolute](#): > > Also, responding to a post upthread: it seemed pretty clear to me that Howard was in on this. Chuck didn’t actually quit, he just sent Howard a letter asking him to call Jimmy (since how else would Chuck get him to come over?) Chuck set up the whole thing as bait for Jimmy, and he had no reason not to let Howard in on it. Wouldn’t that also be fraudulent behaviour? How would deceiving someone to get information be defensible in court? ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/86 "2016-04-20T07:12:27Z")
> [@btcg](#): > > Glad I’m not the only one who feels that way. Still, it’s better than most television… save The Americans and Vikings… my other two fav’s. The Leftovers, Season 2: best storytelling in the past year. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/87 "2016-04-20T08:20:34Z")
> [@scoots](#): > > Nah. Have to disagree. There’s three witnesses - photocopier guy and Ernesto (who will both crack under cop questioning) and Kim (who won’t lie under oath in court) plus a confession. > [@scoots](#): > > She hinted that Jimmy might want to cover any tracks he might have left - and then Jimmy immediately upped and left the house in the middle of the night and was gone for quite some time. > [@scoots](#): > > She wouldn’t have any choice. It’s known that her and Jimmy are sleeping together. The police will ask her about Jimmy’s movements on the night in question. She either tells the truth or she lies. Not long after that, she’ll be in court facing the same questions. She won’t lie in court so she can’t lie to the police. No, she has plausible deniability, and was careful to keep it that way. She never asked Jimmy if he did it, and never pursued any details about it very specifically so she could maintain her official lack of knowledge (even though her gut knows he’s guilty). ---
**Author:** ![crucible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@crucible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crucible)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/88 "2016-04-20T09:43:29Z")
I’m leaning toward the logical path that Jimmy agrees not to use his McGill name and that there is enough profitable business coming his way that he decides to stay in the great Southwest…but, why did he choose ‘Saul Goodman’? The family wasn’t actually Jewish, were they? Is there still an interesting story behind the choice of ‘Saul Goodman’ as his lawyer name? If he were to have left the area entirely, went to Nebraska to practice law, etc. then I could see how ‘Saul Goodman’ might have thrown any pursuers off track a bit…but staying in NM, everyone must know that Saul Goodman is the former Jimmy McGill, and would not think of that name change as some bit of favorable information about Jimmy’s professional ability. ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 9:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/89 "2016-04-20T09:55:54Z")
> [@crucible](#): > > I’m leaning toward the logical path that Jimmy agrees not to use his McGill name and that there is enough profitable business coming his way that he decides to stay in the great Southwest…but, why did he choose ‘Saul Goodman’? The family wasn’t actually Jewish, were they? Is there still an interesting story behind the choice of ‘Saul Goodman’ as his lawyer name? > > If he were to have left the area entirely, went to Nebraska to practice law, etc. then I could see how ‘Saul Goodman’ might have thrown any pursuers off track a bit…but staying in NM, everyone must know that Saul Goodman is the former Jimmy McGill, and would not think of that name change as some bit of favorable information about Jimmy’s professional ability. It’s all good, man. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/90 "2016-04-20T13:18:22Z")
> [@scoots](#): > > She hinted that Jimmy might want to cover any tracks he might have left - and then Jimmy immediately upped and left the house in the middle of the night and was gone for quite some time. No, she made an innocent factual observation about Chuck and how his mind works, which prompted Jimmy to go out in the dead of night and talk to the copy guy to try to keep his innocent, completely legal copying from becoming a detail that Chuck’s paranoia could latch onto even though he would rather just sleep and hope his brother recovered on his own. Unfortunately it was too late, and the fact that Chuck became agitated enough at the copy guy that he became threatening, then collapsed into a head injury, then refused medical treatment makes it clear that Jimmy was right to worry about his brother’s condition. It’s not a felony to make factual statements that prompt’s a man to try to help protect his brother and leads to him saving his brother’s life! And really, if he was trying to conceal a felony, why would he go against the doctor’s advice and get a temporary guardianship, when the doctor wanted to have his brother committed, which would stop the entire investigation? Kim has been very careful not to say or hear anything that she shouldn’t. She may be a well-dressed cute blonde, but she’s also a hotshot lawyer with flexible ethics. > [@btcg](#): > > @ Pantastic: > > As a writer myself, I’m becoming quite a fan of your writing. You’re talented! Thanks, I’m enjoying discussing the show here. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/91 "2016-04-20T13:22:31Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > I have to wonder if a proper forensic examination of the documents wouldn’t reveal that they are copies, and that the “originals” that they were copied from had numbers pasted on them. Other people have pointed out that Jimmy put the originals back, which means there are no modified documents to examine, so that forensic analysis won’t show anything. On the other kind of forensic analysis, Jimmy didn’t use gloves and conceivably might have left fingerprints. But by this time fingerprints don’t show that anything bad happened, because any prints could have been left there after the documents passed to Kim. In case anyone is still confused, the sequence is: Chuck gets case files delivered from HHM, which have various documents about what MV is doing. Some of these are things that were filed with the banking commission in the past. Jimmy comes in to keep an eye on Chuck, realizes he’s got an opportunity, and takes all of the documents with addresses on them out of the files. He goes to the copy place and makes numerous copies and doctors them up, then puts the final doctored copies back into the files at Chuck’s house. Chuck uses the doctored copies to generate the start of new documents for MV’s branch, and passes them on to paralegals at HHM to be finalized. None of the paralegals comment on the address, either they don’t catch it or they don’t want to call out a partner. Chuck and Howard go to the hearing where the incorrect documents have been filed. While they are at the hearing Jimmy cuts back in and puts the old original documents back into the files at Chuck’s house. So at this point all of the old documents in the file have the correct address, match what was sent in already, and haven’t been modified at all. The documents generated by Chuck all have the wrong address as though he accidentally read the numbers wrong, and none have been doctored in any way. ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/92 "2016-04-20T13:35:02Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > Other people have pointed out that Jimmy put the originals back, which means there are no modified documents to examine, so that forensic analysis won’t show anything. On the other kind of forensic analysis, Jimmy didn’t use gloves and conceivably might have left fingerprints. But by this time fingerprints don’t show that anything bad happened, because any prints could have been left there after the documents passed to Kim. > > In case anyone is still confused, the sequence is: > > Chuck gets case files delivered from HHM, which have various documents about what MV is doing. Some of these are things that were filed with the banking commission in the past. > > Jimmy comes in to keep an eye on Chuck, realizes he’s got an opportunity, and takes all of the documents with addresses on them out of the files. He goes to the copy place and makes numerous copies and doctors them up, then puts the final doctored copies back into the files at Chuck’s house. > > Chuck uses the doctored copies to generate the start of new documents for MV’s branch, and passes them on to paralegals at HHM to be finalized. None of the paralegals comment on the address, either they don’t catch it or they don’t want to call out a partner. > > Chuck and Howard go to the hearing where the incorrect documents have been filed. While they are at the hearing Jimmy cuts back in and puts the old original documents back into the files at Chuck’s house. So at this point all of the old documents in the file have the correct address, match what was sent in already, and haven’t been modified at all. The documents generated by Chuck all have the wrong address as though he accidentally read the numbers wrong, and none have been doctored in any way. Exactement, as the French would say. There’s nothing TO investigate in a forensic way. Slippin’ Jimmy is thorough. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/93 "2016-04-20T13:37:35Z")
> [@crucible](#): > > I’m leaning toward the logical path that Jimmy agrees not to use his McGill name and that there is enough profitable business coming his way that he decides to stay in the great Southwest…but, why did he choose ‘Saul Goodman’? The family wasn’t actually Jewish, were they? Is there still an interesting story behind the choice of ‘Saul Goodman’ as his lawyer name? In Breaking Bad, his clientele is mostly criminal, and he explains to Walter that the clients prefer a Jewish attorney, so he chose a name that sounds Jewish. ---
**Author:** ![Smid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/838e76/32.png) [@Smid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smid)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/94 "2016-04-20T14:00:31Z")
Like others have said, underwhelmed by this finale. It’s an episode 6 of the series, at best… ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/95 "2016-04-20T14:10:07Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > In Breaking Bad, his clientele is mostly criminal, and he explains to Walter that the clients prefer a Jewish attorney, so he chose a name that sounds Jewish. Right: [QUOTE=Saul Goodman] Faith and begorrah! A fellow potato eater! My real name’s McGill. The Jew thing I just do for the homeboys. They all want a pipe-hitting member of the tribe, so to speak… [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/96 "2016-04-20T14:14:22Z")
> [@Toxgoddess](#): > > Did anyone else notice that as Jimmy’s commercial finished, the commercial immediately following began with the word WEASEL displayed prominently? Garden Weasel or some such product I assumed; but I had a good laugh. Yes! I thought that was hilarious. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/97 "2016-04-20T14:42:42Z")
> [@Biffster](#): > > The Leftovers, Season 2: best storytelling in the past year. Agreed. For me, the best single season of anything since _Breaking Bad_ wrapped up. Michael McKean is terrific, but the whole Chuck subplot is boring. I find myself hoping they hurry up and get back to what Mike is doing. Jimmy needs to become Saul sooner rather than later. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/98 "2016-04-20T14:52:52Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > Other people have pointed out that Jimmy put the originals back, which means there are no modified documents to examine, so that forensic analysis won’t show anything. > … I already conceded this argument back in post #80. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/99 "2016-04-20T16:15:56Z")
Was that cabin/shack the cartel was at the same place Tuco brought Walter and Jesse at the beginning of season 2 for BB? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Lowry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sam\_Lowry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Lowry)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2016, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625/100 "2016-04-20T16:31:08Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > And I wouldn’t be surprised if Chuck no longer practices law at HHM when next season rolls around - he quit the firm, and Howard may well decide that he has become a liability and take his quitting as fact instead of letting him back out. Fake-quitting to try to trap Jimmy into an admission may be just a bit too much for respectable Howard. And non-respectable Howard may be only too happy to see Chuck committed and his shares of the firm left where they are by his guardian Jimmy. Right, when Chuck comes back and says that he didn’t really mean to quit, but it was to trick Jimmy into confessing, I would think Howard would be concerned. But if Chuck keeps talking and saying that he knew that there was no way he could make a mistake, and that Jimmy is trying to destroy him, and that he covered his house in tin foil in order to convince him (although he really should have done that a long time ago) then I would think Howard would be even more concerned. As a good guy and good lawyer, I would think Howard would encourage Chuck to stay retired, and hope that Chuck doesn’t escalate things. The publicity for HHM would not be good if it gets out that one of their partners is “allergic to electricity” and having this huge fight with his own brother. > [@Absolute](#): > > Also, responding to a post upthread: it seemed pretty clear to me that Howard was in on this. Chuck didn’t actually quit, he just sent Howard a letter asking him to call Jimmy (since how else would Chuck get him to come over?) Chuck set up the whole thing as bait for Jimmy, and he had no reason not to let Howard in on it. I’d be surprised if Howard was in on it. He had thought that Chuck had made a mistake before and fairly gently told him that it’s okay and it wasn’t a good mistake to make but that it’s not the end of the world. I would think if Chuck told him that he had a plan to get Jimmy to confess, and that he would fake quit HHM and cover his house in tin foil, Chuck would sound even crazier than usual and I don’t think Howard would want to enable that. There’s no benefit to HHM for Howard to enable this, and really no benefit to enabling Chuck whether he’s right or not. Even if Chuck proves everything correctly, Mesa Verde is never coming back to HHM, they’ll find another firm. And Howard doesn’t think of Jimmy the same way that Chuck does, where Jimmy is someone always scheming and can’t ever be trusted and to blame for everything that goes wrong. I think he knows that Jimmy isn’t always on the straight and narrow, but I don’t know if he thinks he’s someone who needs to be caught in a lie. I think he mostly tries to stay out of the way of things between Chuck and Jimmy. It’s possible that Howard was helping Chuck, but I’d be surprised if that was the case. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-finale/752625.md?page=6)