# Better Call Saul: Season IV **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 30, 2018, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792 "2018-07-30T04:48:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 51
**Author:** ![sich\_hinaufwinden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@sich\_hinaufwinden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sich_hinaufwinden)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1003 "2018-10-03T05:09:19Z")
> [@sich\_hinaufwinden](#): > > Maybe she wants to stay together and is offering this not only as an olive branch and to help with his immediate needs, but also saying she’s on board ramping up their scamming activity? > > > [@Pantastic](#): > > > > I think this misses that Jimmy blew up at her to the point that he’s moving his stuff out of her house. I didn’t interpret ‘we can start with that’ as her trying to decide what scams they do, it’s her saying ‘this is the thing we can start doing to save the relationship’. Like ‘lets not try to fix the whole giant ball of hurt that happened on the roof, lets try to reconnect one step at a time, and the first will be getting you reinstated’. I didn’t miss that although it’s obvious we have a different take on things. I agree she’s saying she wants to begin work on getting their relationship back to a good spot, starting with her helping to get him reinstated. All I was saying/adding to that was I thought maybe it was supposed to have double meaning and she has an idea for a scam that will make that possible. That is, she knows he wants to scam and she knows he wants to be reinstated, so a scam to get him reinstated would tick both those boxes. It seemed like a kind of dramatic end to that scene for her simply to be saying she’ll help him fill out the paperwork for his appeal so to speak. If it turns out that all she does is remind Jimmy to mention Chuck to the board in his appeal, otherwise coaches him, and maybe puts in a good word with someone, then my guess is wrong. Certainly won’t be the first time for that! It just seems that would be kind of boring to me at this point in the season though it’s certainly possible. But a scam doesn’t seem all that implausible to me, given the plot so far in which they’re ramping up that aspect of the relationship and there only being one episode left this season. ---
**Author:** ![sich\_hinaufwinden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@sich\_hinaufwinden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sich_hinaufwinden)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1004 "2018-10-03T05:23:21Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > Well, realistically there would probably be multiple copies of the plans stored in multiple locations (like one for the official file, one for the application record, one for the inspector to carry). You can ‘assume’ this takes place before the multiple copies were created. I generally agree with this except for the assumption part. My work is almost entirely on the public infrastructure side of things rather than private development, but in my experience the process is fairly similar. We generally provide multiple sets of final prints. Not to say the recipient won’t make additional copies themselves once they’ve been accepted, but the burden is typically on us to provide however many sets they will need for their initial internal distribution. We usually provide a signed/sealed reproducible original (ink on mylar or vellum) as well as several paper copies. I’m not saying there was never an instance when we provided a single set of plans, but I don’t remember doing so. So there would likely be other sets of the originally approved plans in their possession that wouldn’t match the single new “approved” record copy. Also, even back then, we would provide an electronic copy of our files. Sometimes just a PDF, sometimes the actual CAD files, and sometimes both. These would exist in the e-mail of the recipient, possibly on that person’s local box, as well as being copied up to their server. Essentially a lot of “electronic” paper trail that could definitely come back to haunt them. That they would only have a single copy of the plans, on paper no less, just doesn’t quite ring true. But it’s not the kind of thing that ruins the plot for me - I enjoyed the story for what it is. ---
**Author:** ![GreedySmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a698b9/32.png) [@GreedySmurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreedySmurf)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 9:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1005 "2018-10-03T09:36:45Z")
Couple of questions about a couple of details; - Did anyone catch what the wording was Kim was painting on the mug when she was on the teleconference? - Was there some significance to the briefcase she was putting back in the gift box? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1006 "2018-10-03T10:30:29Z")
> [@GreedySmurf](#): > > Couple of questions about a couple of details; > > - Did anyone catch what the wording was Kim was painting on the mug when she was on the teleconference? > - Was there some significance to the briefcase she was putting back in the gift box? It was the yellow “World’s best lawyer” mug she’d earlier given him. She’d painted AGAIN on it. The briefcase had _JMM_ monogrammed on it (for “James M. McGill”, I presume) and will likely be made moot when he gets his license back as Saul Goodman. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1007 "2018-10-03T10:43:08Z")
**[Moderating]** > [@TruCelt](#): > > Well, at least we aren’t being jerks or trying to stifle the conversation. By all means, start a “BCS/talk to me in one-liners” thread. If you believe that another poster is trying to stifle the conversation, what you should do is report him. What you should not do is call him a jerk. This is a Warning for personal insults. ---
**Author:** ![soonerblue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/soonerblue/32/3302_2.png) [@soonerblue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/soonerblue)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1008 "2018-10-03T11:46:18Z")
I predict that I’ll soon go stark-raving, spittle-flecked mad trying to figure out this dang show. Don’t get me wrong, I love it to pieces, but I’m starting to believe what I read somewhere about the creators making it up as they go along. Sure makes for an exciting ride. I was betting good money that Werner would be blown up - such a brilliant suspenceful scene directed by Vince Gilligan. But maybe Werner saw the writing on the wall - heh, Wiedersehen - and fled to save his life, especially after Mike’s very serious warning about “the man we work for.” And why doesn’t all that blasting through rock send the local seismologists to investigate? At the diner, after the Lizzie, idiot-Bill, baby-in-the-car scam, Jimmy said they’d be unstoppable with their combined magic. Kim said they should only use their powers for good. Jimmy wonders if a larger floor plan for a bank was really good. She said - “I’ll know it when I see it.” Jimmy thought he had charmed those three board interviewers, but had a nagging suspicion the moment he left. He almost marched back into that boardroom. Maybe he should say something nice about Chuck, knowing how they’d revere him … but no, that would’ve been really insincere… Jimmy: “Oh kick a man while he’s down, huh?” Kim: “Jimmy, you’re always down.” Ouch. That was the worst fight they’ve ever had, so mean and angry … but maybe it was a good thing to vent and clear the air. Because they were so subdued when he came back to her place… silently packing up to move out. BTW - so brillantly photographed (Marshall Adams) using the doorway and the bedroom mirror to keep them together in the same frame while they’re in separate rooms. Jimmy spoke first saying how he’d messed things up. She asked if he still wants to be a lawyer, and he said yes … she said, “Well, we can start with that.” Which I took as not planning a scam - heh, no letter writing campaign - but just her help though the legal system. Lalo, a charming egotistical foodie psychopath, tossing his Los Pollos cup out the window as they peel out of the parking lot, does not know he’s messin’ with a true silent cold-blooded brutal psychopath … It will be the end of Nacho if Gus asks him to get rid of Lalo … The nursing home scene - I noticed the elderly woman grab her purse and clutch it tight when Nacho walked up behind her. Hey lady, he doesn’t care about your purse … unless it’s full of blue meth… If you don’t hear from me after the finale next week - I’m in the nervous hospital… ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1009 "2018-10-03T13:06:26Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > It was the yellow “World’s best lawyer” mug she’d earlier given him. She’d painted AGAIN on it. The briefcase had _JMM_ monogrammed on it (for “James M. McGill”, I presume) and will likely be made moot when he gets his license back as Saul Goodman. She also painted “World’s [2nd] Best Lawyer [Again]”, herself presumably being #1. The briefcase is something he will need once he goes back to lawyering again (and as you say has his initials on it). ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1010 "2018-10-03T13:11:15Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > The briefcase is something he will need once he goes back to lawyering again (and as you say has his initials on it). I phrased that poorly. I meant the monogram will be moot, not the briefcase itself. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1011 "2018-10-03T14:26:02Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > As for Werner… I don’t think Mike will kill him. My memory of breaking bad is a little hazy, but did we ever see Mike kill an innocent in cold blood? I remember he killed an assassin who came to kill him, and he’s killed other bad guys, but I think it would be a stretch for him to hunt down Werner and kill him - especially since he sees so much of himself there. I don’t think Werner counts as an innocent though, he’s a willing participant in the drug ‘game’ like anyone working for the Salamancas or Gus. He hasn’t killed anyone, so he’s not ‘bad’, but I don’t think he counts as a ‘bystander’ and that’s where we’ve really seen Mike draw the line. Mike absolutely wouldn’t threaten Werner’s wife, but I think that Werner may qualify as ‘fair game’ at this point. > [@SlackerInc](#): > > Sam, I think you are forgetting that Mike was about to kill Walt in cold blood (after feeding him lies about a leak) on Gus’s orders, when Jesse threw a wrench in the works by killing Gale. Walt was not remotely an innocent. Aside from willingly joining the drug trade, he had several direct deaths that Mike didn’t know about but could probably guess about, and had just run over and shot two of Gus’s dealers. > [@soonerblue](#): > > I predict that I’ll soon go stark-raving, spittle-flecked mad trying to figure out this dang show. Don’t get me wrong, I love it to pieces, but I’m starting to believe what I read somewhere about the creators making it up as they go along. Sure makes for an exciting ride. What I like about the series is that they throw a bunch of surprises, but they work hard to avoid making cheap ones. It’s not like Walking Dead where they do a fakeout of someone dying in a dumpster or so many shows where a character suddenly develops a new trait to drive the surprise. Kim getting turned on by scamming was unexpected, but we’ve seen all along that she enjoys the scamming and only really shies away from major consequences. The exact shape of Jimmy and Kim’s conflict is unexpected, but they’ve been hinting at that conflict all along. Werner running away was a surprise, but they’ve shown him increasingly cracking under pressure as the dig drags on for months longer than expected. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1012 "2018-10-03T14:34:46Z")
> [@sich\_hinaufwinden](#): > > It seemed like a kind of dramatic end to that scene for her simply to be saying she’ll help him fill out the paperwork for his appeal so to speak. > > If it turns out that all she does is remind Jimmy to mention Chuck to the board in his appeal, otherwise coaches him, and maybe puts in a good word with someone, then my guess is wrong. Certainly won’t be the first time for that! It just seems that would be kind of boring to me at this point in the season though it’s certainly possible. I don’t think there will be anything that will qualify as a ‘scam’, there won’t be a letter writing campaign or swapped documents or Huell planting a battery on someone, the only dishonest piece will be that Jimmy won’t give his real feelings about Chuck. I think there will be a dramatic court scene that does more than just ‘mention Chuck, get a good reference’ though, I agree it won’t be boring. I have a strong suspicion that what they do will end up with Jimmy demanding to practice law under the Saul Goodman name, either as a supposedly nice gesture towards Chuck “I don’t want to drag him down” or after admitting the level of conflict between them “I am tired of living in his shadow”. > [@GreedySmurf](#): > > Couple of questions about a couple of details; > > - Did anyone catch what the wording was Kim was painting on the mug when she was on the teleconference? It was either the same mug she gave Jimmy back in S2 or the same design. The mug has “World’s Best Lawyer” printed on it, the original had a ‘second’ in front of best (repeated here) and she was adding ‘again’ to the bottom. It’s a joking gift she gave him back when things seemed to be going good, modified with a wry reference to his reinstatement. The mug was significant in S2 because it didn’t fit into the cupholder of the car D&M gave Jimmy > [@](#): > > - Was there some significance to the briefcase she was putting back in the gift box? It’s monogrammed with Jimmy’s real initials. I think it’s going to become obsolete if, like I predicted above, the reinstatement involves him swearing to operate under the Saul Goodman name instead of JMM. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1013 "2018-10-03T16:19:29Z")
> [@soonerblue](#): > > Don’t get me wrong, I love it to pieces, but I’m starting to believe what I read somewhere about the creators making it up as they go along. Sure makes for an exciting ride. The creators have actually been pretty explicit that is exactly what they do and very deliberately so :). While they start with an overarching plan, it is left pretty loose. This gives them the freedom to wander down paths that interest them if they find a story line or actor that is working better than expected. And they have the freedom to quietly eject what doesn’t seem to be working( for them ). They enjoy the pressure of having to work on the fly - it adds extra motivation in the writing room. For most TV shows I’d say this would be a weakness. The team assembled for this show and BB has made it mostly a powerful virtue. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1014 "2018-10-03T16:36:45Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I phrased that poorly. I meant the monogram will be moot, not the briefcase itself. I wasn’t contradicting you, just elaborating slightly. ---
**Author:** ![corkboard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@corkboard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/corkboard)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1015 "2018-10-03T17:29:44Z")
The approval board’s denial of Jimmy’s reinstatement was wrong. He had knocked it out of the park up until that last question. It’s reasonable to expect that there might be a dozen reasons he would avoid mentioning Chuck- for all they know Jimmy had reconciled his issues with his brother and it was too painful to bring his memory of Chuck into the room, so he gave what they all know was a throwaway answer. To deny him based on that response was unreasonable and petty, and possibly beyond the scope of their powers. And I think we might not ever see Werner again. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1016 "2018-10-03T17:43:21Z")
Amazingly, the monologue Jimmy gave on the law was probably the most sincere as he has given over two series. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1017 "2018-10-03T17:53:11Z")
> [@corkboard](#): > > And I think we might not ever see Werner again. That would be awesome. If Werner ends up being the the BCS version of the [Pine Barrens](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pine_Barrens_(The_Sopranos)), my already considerable respect for the show would go up several notches. [He killed 16 Czechoslovakians. Guy was an interior decorator!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsxthFO-HWs) Not that Werner is a commando, of course, but just the idea of someone getting away and never finding him. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1018 "2018-10-03T18:33:31Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > [He killed 16 Czechoslovakians. Guy was an interior decorator!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsxthFO-HWs) My favorite line: “His house looked like shit!” ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1019 "2018-10-03T19:41:45Z")
My brother’s prediction: Mike allowed/assisted Werner’s escape. My prediction: the season finale will conclude with present-day Gene learning that Kim is getting out of prison. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1020 "2018-10-03T20:39:45Z")
> [@Stephe96](#): > > My brother’s prediction: Mike allowed/assisted Werner’s escape. I wouldn’t entirely put it past him. I don’t think that’s the case, but it’s within the realm of possibility. Some other outlandish ‘predictions’ that I don’t think are going to happen but wouldn’t disbelieve: Lalo ends up finding Werner without managing to discover the lab. Maybe kills him, maybe turns him over to Gus for some reason of his own. Lydia kills Werner’s wife, possibly the other Germans, leading to Mike’s Hatred of her. Howard testifies at Jimmy’s hearing about how Chuck actually treated Jimmy. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1021 "2018-10-03T21:30:31Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > Lydia kills Werner’s wife, possibly the other Germans, leading to Mike’s Hatred of her. Why would she kill Werner’s wife? She (as far as we know) doesn’t know anything other than that Werner has been off on a job. If they haven’t caught up with him yet, she’s bait. If they have caught him, and don’t want to kill him, they can use her for leverage. If they kill him, then there would seem to be little point in killing her as well. Also, I presume you mean Lydia has them killed, rather than actually killing them. Lydia has never killed anyone herself, she always has an accomplice do it. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792/1022 "2018-10-03T21:49:48Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Why would she kill Werner’s wife? She (as far as we know) doesn’t know anything other than that Werner has been off on a job. If they haven’t caught up with him yet, she’s bait. If they have caught him, and don’t want to kill him, they can use her for leverage. If they kill him, then there would seem to be little point in killing her as well. Because she’s a paranoid, bloodthirsty person who likes to close up loose ends by killing people. Her exact motive would be shown if she did it - it could be an example to the others, it could be that she thinks the wife knows more from those long phone calls, it could be that Mike won’t kill Werner so she does it to force his hand, there are a lot of things that could be a reason if they go that way. I’m confident that Lydia is going to do something in onscreen in BCS that will earn the disdain Mike shows for her in BB, though it certainly doesn’t have to be here. > [@](#): > > Also, I presume you mean Lydia has them killed, rather than actually killing them. Lydia has never killed anyone herself, she always has an accomplice do it. “Lydia kills them” is what I use to indicate that Lydia makes the decision and takes the actions that leads to their death, not that she physically caused their death directly. I would say that Walt killed the guys in prison, or that Gus killed Juan Bolsa, for example, even though both kept their hands clean and had the Nazi gang or some assassins do the actual deed. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792.md?page=50) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/better-call-saul-season-iv/818792.md?page=52)