# Bible verses: 2 Kings 2:23-24; Numbers 5:11-31 **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 25, 2013, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473 "2013-07-25T12:51:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Kable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kable)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2013, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/281 "2013-08-02T13:37:59Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > Basically, the problem here is, you don’t know anything about what you’re talking about. As I’ve said, you need to draw conclusions only where you have information. FYI Frylock, I’ll no longer be discussing these topics any further. I’ve noticed a tendency for you be overly literal in my word use, overly pedantic and to miscomprehend nuance. I find conversing with such types to be a of a time waster but I wish you well. ---
**Author:** ![Kable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kable)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2013, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/282 "2013-08-02T13:52:38Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > I was going to chide Kable for a post way up on the page where he implies that Paul wrote Acts. Good catch Skammer, Paul didn’t write Acts. You catching me in that error almost made me forget that I was still waiting for you to answer a question about something you said earlier in post #240. If you recall, I was following along with you all the way to the end then you said: > [@](#): > > So clearly the Law condemns us. And, until “heaven and earth pass away” the Law will be there as a reminder of how much we fall short of God’s commandments. > > But the good news is that in Jesus, we have been freed from the Law - we are not justified by following the Law, but by faith in Christ. Right before saying that the Law will not pass away, he says: “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law. I have not come to abolish it, but to fulfill it.” You are saying Jesus is OK with sin and breaking all them laws because he’s died for you? You think that henceforth sinning is a perfectly OK thing to do, and not something people should endeavor to avoid? ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2013, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/283 "2013-08-02T14:03:41Z")
> [@Kable](#): > > I find conversing with such types to be a of a time waster but I wish you well. Tell me about a conversation on a topic like this that you’ve participated in that you didn’t find to be a time waster. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2013, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/284 "2013-08-02T14:38:48Z")
> [@monavis](#): > > There are many translations of many passages in the Bible, according to Matthew; Jesus said the sun would not give it’s light, the moon would turn to blood, the stars would fall, and that generation would not pass away until all those things would be accomplished. Some sects teach that the word generation didn’t mean the same as today, but Matthew also wrote that there was 14 generations between David and Jesus. Using the same word. > > Jesus also is quoted as saying that he would return in his father’s glory with his angels, before some of those standing there listening to him would see death. It didn’t happen . I have heard different ways to look at this (because it was never recorded) but the Resurrection was in secret; there was no angels at the transfiguration. and it seems to me if these writings were true, the Book of Revelations would be moot! In a lot of interpretations the hyperbole of sun not giving light, moon turning to blood, etc, was a reference to the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD. It would be considered by every Jew to be a complete and unmitigated disaster. I’m not sure if I buy it, but I’m not sure what I believe on that point. On the later paragraph, I believe it to be referring to the Resurrection. The Father is glorified through the defeat of death, the Devil, and sin - and perhaps it was angels who led Jesus back. Those standing there did witness the resurrected Christ. That is simply my interpretation of the passage, others may have a different view of it. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2013, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/285 "2013-08-02T18:36:30Z")
> [@Kable](#): > > Yelling? Christians call themselves Christians because they are followers of Christ. I’m just pointing out that they aren’t doing that. Get it? No, you’re claiming that “Following Christ” has one meaning and one meaning only, as defined by you, and that anyone who does not adhere to the One True Interpretation of the Bible is not a True Christian™ - which is an argument I’m used to hearing from fundamentalists, but not from atheists. The last time that every Christian in the world agreed on what it means to be a Christian was - well, never, as the disagreements between the Gospels and the Epistles should make clear to you if you weren’t so fixated on trying to treat the New Testament as a monolithic entity to be mined for gotcha quotes. ---
**Author:** ![PBear42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ecccb3/32.png) [@PBear42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PBear42)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2013, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/286 "2013-08-03T05:00:02Z")
I think it’s bad form to post something here and not respond to the reply. But this will be my last post in the thread, as I’ve said what I have to say. You’re the OP, so it’s only fair that you get the last word in this little exchange. Don’t bother with any questions, though. As a courtesy, I will read your reply, but I won’t be responding. Rather, I will leave it to those reading the thread to draw their own conclusions. > [@Kable](#): > > The Gospels do contradict each other sometimes. They are irreconcilable without introducing error. In your humble opinion. Most Christians think otherwise. So do I. > [@](#): > > Jesus does contradict Paul sometimes. They are irreconciliable without introducing error. You want to place that error with Paul or Jesus? As mentioned previously, you’re conflating the Gospels and Jesus. As for the latter point, same response as to the previous one. > [@](#): > > I already addressed this passage. In Acts 15 Paul contradicts Jesus. I said from the start that I was aware that most Christians side with Paul. Again, it’s only your opinion that Acts contradicts Matthew. Most Christians think otherwise. So do I. Indeed, I rather like **Smapti’s** summary of the problem with your position in [Post #274](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=16534298&postcount=274). > [@](#): > > You however, still have not answered whether you think Matthew or the other gospels actually quote Jesus? That was not a rhetorical question. Do they? Not sure why my opinion on the subject is important, but my belief (even when I was a Christian) is that the Gospel writers attempted in good faith to reconstruct Jesus’ words, but were seriously handicapped by the weakness of the source materials, a common problem in ancient writings. More importantly, even if one assumes (as do most Christians) that the Gospels are accurate quotations by way of divine inspiration, it’s trivially easy to reconcile Acts with the passage in Matthew on which you rely. This was demonstrated by others upthread. That you, an atheist, are not persuaded is of no moment. In any event, it doesn’t entitle you to ascribe to Christians beliefs they do not hold so you can heap scorn and derision thereon. As I said, you get the last word in this little exchange. ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2013, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/287 "2013-08-03T11:46:07Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by **Kable** > The Gospels do contradict each other sometimes. They are irreconcilable without introducing error. > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by **PBear42** > In your humble opinion. Most Christians think otherwise. So do I. I would think that would be news to many if most liberal Christians couldn’t recognize and acknowledge the many contradictions, but it would be on par for the conservative ones. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2013, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/288 "2013-08-03T11:55:13Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > In a lot of interpretations the hyperbole of sun not giving light, moon turning to blood, etc, was a reference to the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD. It would be considered by every Jew to be a complete and unmitigated disaster. I’m not sure if I buy it, but I’m not sure what I believe on that point. > > On the later paragraph, I believe it to be referring to the Resurrection. The Father is glorified through the defeat of death, the Devil, and sin - and perhaps it was angels who led Jesus back. Those standing there did witness the resurrected Christ. That is simply my interpretation of the passage, others may have a different view of it. With the sun not giving it’s light, and the stars falling on earth, there would be no life left on earth, or even an earth to speak of. and more than the temple would have been razed. Even Jesus mother didn’t expect Jesus to resurrect, if she did, she wouldn’t have gone to anoint his body, there was no angels with him nor was it in his father’s glory. Most of the people he knew well didn’t recognize him, So that would be a far cry from coming in glory! And, what happened to all the people who were said to come out of their graves? ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/289 "2013-08-06T18:08:10Z")
Kable: > [@](#): > > I’d be interested in seeing the Talmud passages. But frankly, in parallel to what you said about first-hand evidence, there would be no proof that such ever worked, either. The Talmudic passage is in tractate Sotah (that’s the Hebrew word for “suspected woman”) page 28a. The Mishna says that “Just as the waters test the woman, they also test the man.” The Talmud explains this passage to refer to the fact (or as you’d probably say, “fact”) that a test prompted by the suspicions of a husband who has sinned sexually will not work to convict the wife. The Talmud says this is alluded to by verse 31, “The husband will be innocent of any wrongdoing, but the woman will bear the consequences of her sin.’”, that it has a secondary meaning that only when the husband is in fact innocent of sin will the woman bear consequences from her sins. As for proof, obviously there is none nowadays that an atheist would consider acceptable. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/290 "2013-08-06T22:00:24Z")
> [@monavis](#): > > With the sun not giving it’s light, and the stars falling on earth, there would be no life left on earth, or even an earth to speak of. and more than the temple would have been razed. > Even Jesus mother didn’t expect Jesus to resurrect, if she did, she wouldn’t have gone to anoint his body, there was no angels with him nor was it in his father’s glory. Most of the people he knew well didn’t recognize him, So that would be a far cry from coming in glory! And, what happened to all the people who were said to come out of their graves? For many Jews, the destruction of the Temple was akin to the world disappearing. It was a mega-disaster which destroyed the reason for their existence. I would think returning from death, conquering said death, sin, and the devil, is kind of glorious. That and his body was pretty nice looking after he resurrected and all. Kind of glorious sounding to me. As for the graves coming out - are you conflating the Matthew text with another? ---
**Author:** ![Find\_Friends](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@Find\_Friends](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Find_Friends)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/291 "2013-08-07T00:08:02Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Kable: > > The Talmudic passage is in tractate Sotah (that’s the Hebrew word for “suspected woman”) page 28a. The Mishna says that “Just as the waters test the woman, they also test the man.” The Talmud explains this passage to refer to the fact (or as you’d probably say, “fact”) that a test prompted by the suspicions of a husband who has sinned sexually will not work to convict the wife. The Talmud says this is alluded to by verse 31, “The husband will be innocent of any wrongdoing, but the woman will bear the consequences of her sin.’”, that it has a secondary meaning that only when the husband is in fact innocent of sin will the woman bear consequences from her sins. It was I who requested the Talmudic passage. You seem to think it was Kable. > [@cmkeller](#): > > As for proof, obviously there is none nowadays that an atheist would consider acceptable. First, I want to say something I have often thought but never said on this board. I have never been bothered by the confidence in fundamentalist beliefs often expressed by adherents of Judaism here. Maybe because it is unknown for a Jewish believer to persistently ring one’s doorbell of insist on shoving a tract in one’s face downtown. * * * As you have said before, things are not set up for the practice to be carried on today. I’m curious about whether the following is something you would expect to work today: [30:37] And Jacob took him rods of green poplar, and of the hazel and chestnut tree; and pilled white strakes in them, and made the white appear which was in the rods. [30:38] And he set the rods which he had pilled before the flocks in the gutters in the watering troughs when the flocks came to drink, that they should conceive when they came to drink. [30:39] And the flocks conceived before the rods, and brought forth cattle ring-straked, speckled, and spotted. _ **ETA: It was post 201 where I asked about the Talmud.** _ ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/292 "2013-08-07T00:43:37Z")
Trans Fat Og: > [@](#): > > It was I who requested the Talmudic passage. You seem to think it was Kable. My apologies, then, that post should have been directed to you. > [@](#): > > As you have said before, things are not set up for the practice to be carried on today. I’m curious about whether the following is something you would expect to work today: > > [30:37] And Jacob took him rods of green poplar, and of the hazel and chestnut tree; and pilled white strakes in them, and made the white appear which was in the rods. [30:38] And he set the rods which he had pilled before the flocks in the gutters in the watering troughs when the flocks came to drink, that they should conceive when they came to drink. [30:39] And the flocks conceived before the rods, and brought forth cattle ring-straked, speckled, and spotted. No, and it wouldn’t have worked for anyone else in Biblical times either. This was a miracle that Jacob had been told by an angel to perform in a prophetic dream, as specific recompense for Laban’s cheating him. It’s not something that is said to work in general. (Genesis 31:10-12) ---
**Author:** ![Tacit\_Knowledge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@Tacit\_Knowledge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tacit_Knowledge)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/293 "2013-08-07T03:50:13Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > _Post hoc ergo propter hoc_? The text doesn’t explicitly say that God sent the bears, or even that there was any direct connection between Elisha’s cursing and the bears’ appearance. It’s certainly natural to draw that conclusion, but I don’t know whether it’s fair to assume (and a literal reading doesn’t _require_ it, at any rate). I agree with you. Only I’d ask why it would be “natural to draw that conclusion”. It seems like a pretty absurd, far-fetched, far-reaching and purely superstitious conclusion to arrive at. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/294 "2013-08-07T12:10:27Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > For many Jews, the destruction of the Temple was akin to the world disappearing. It was a mega-disaster which destroyed the reason for their existence. > > I would think returning from death, conquering said death, sin, and the devil, is kind of glorious. That and his body was pretty nice looking after he resurrected and all. Kind of glorious sounding to me. > > As for the graves coming out - are you conflating the Matthew text with another? I ill have to look up the chapter and verse, but one of the writers, speaking of the Resurrection, Wrote there were many who came out of their graves, during the earth quake that is said to have happened. The resurrection Jesus didn’t look like any being in Glory, Mary Magdalene who was supposed to have been the first to see him thought he was the gardener so what Glory is that? ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/295 "2013-08-07T15:51:36Z")
> [@monavis](#): > > I ill have to look up the chapter and verse, but one of the writers, speaking of the Resurrection, Wrote there were many who came out of their graves, during the earth quake that is said to have happened. > The resurrection Jesus didn’t look like any being in Glory, Mary Magdalene who was supposed to have been the first to see him thought he was the gardener so what Glory is that? What, you never heard of a gardener named Jesus? And yes, it was Matthew who made up the story of the zombie invasion of Jerusalem. If true, it would have been the greatest miracle of the entire Bible, but it is given half a line. Not even the other gospel writers would touch it. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/296 "2013-08-07T18:11:22Z")
> [@monavis](#): > > I ill have to look up the chapter and verse, but one of the writers, speaking of the Resurrection, Wrote there were many who came out of their graves, during the earth quake that is said to have happened. Ah, I think I may have misinterpreted your original post. My apologies. Matthew talks about the tombs of the Saints being opened at Jesus’s death and appearing to people after the resurrection (though, not as a prophecy but as part of his telling the story). I don’t think anyone really knows what that was about as it was two lines in Matthew right after Jesus’s death and doesn’t get brought back up, and isn’t found in any of the other Gospels. This is plenty of stuff on the dead rising from their graves at the Second Coming, however. It may be a reference to what Tradition says that in between Jesus’s death and resurrection (on Holy Saturday), He preached to those in Hell (presumably leading them out of Hell). I believe that tradition indicates that was when folks who never had the chance to hear about Jesus were able to listen to the good news and obtain salvation. > [@](#): > > The resurrection Jesus didn’t look like any being in Glory, Mary Magdalene who was supposed to have been the first to see him thought he was the gardener so what Glory is that? I think a Jesus who has a shiny new body, coming back from death, and can disappear and appear at will is pretty glorious. YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2013, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/297 "2013-08-08T12:17:12Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > Ah, I think I may have misinterpreted your original post. My apologies. > > Matthew talks about the tombs of the Saints being opened at Jesus’s death and appearing to people after the resurrection (though, not as a prophecy but as part of his telling the story). I don’t think anyone really knows what that was about as it was two lines in Matthew right after Jesus’s death and doesn’t get brought back up, and isn’t found in any of the other Gospels. > > This is plenty of stuff on the dead rising from their graves at the Second Coming, however. > > It may be a reference to what Tradition says that in between Jesus’s death and resurrection (on Holy Saturday), He preached to those in Hell (presumably leading them out of Hell). I believe that tradition indicates that was when folks who never had the chance to hear about Jesus were able to listen to the good news and obtain salvation. > > I think a Jesus who has a shiny new body, coming back from death, and can disappear and appear at will is pretty glorious. YMMV. Where were the angels that Jesus is quoted as saying that would be with him when he came in his father’s glory? That is how you look at it but I hardly think even his apostles that hid ran to the grave when they heard he had returned didn’t see any glory. Then later on the men walking with him didn’t recognize him until he broke bread. In my opinion that was not in glory, more like in secret. The gardener Mary saw was not glowing, or in Glory! ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2013, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/298 "2013-08-08T14:29:23Z")
There were two glowing angels inside the tomb that told the women that Jesus wasn’t there anymore, if you want to get all literalistic (Luke 24) ;). > [@](#): > > On the first day of the week, very early in the morning, the women took the spices they had prepared and went to the tomb. 2 They found the stone rolled away from the tomb, 3 but when they entered, they did not find the body of the Lord Jesus. 4 While they were wondering about this, suddenly two men in clothes that gleamed like lightning stood beside them. 5 In their fright the women bowed down with their faces to the ground, but the men said to them, "Why do you look for the living among the dead? 6 He is not here; he has risen! Remember how he told you, while he was still with you in Galilee: 7 ‘The Son of Man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, be crucified and on the third day be raised again.’ And I’d counter the lack of “glory” by looking at art regarding the resurrection, which tends to make Jesus look pretty glorious. So it isn’t just me who thinks the resurrection of a dead man is pretty glorious :). This is one from the webpage of a Catholic Parish: [http://www.olfatima.ca/wp-content/themes/twentyeleven-child/images/Jesus-Resurrection.jpg](http://www.olfatima.ca/wp-content/themes/twentyeleven-child/images/Jesus-Resurrection.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2013, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/299 "2013-08-09T11:52:42Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > There were two glowing angels inside the tomb that told the women that Jesus wasn’t there anymore, if you want to get all literalistic (Luke 24) ;). > > And I’d counter the lack of “glory” by looking at art regarding the resurrection, which tends to make Jesus look pretty glorious. So it isn’t just me who thinks the resurrection of a dead man is pretty glorious :). > > This is one from the webpage of a Catholic Parish: [http://www.olfatima.ca/wp-content/themes/twentyeleven-child/images/Jesus-Resurrection.jpg](http://www.olfatima.ca/wp-content/themes/twentyeleven-child/images/Jesus-Resurrection.jpg) Notice it was written by some human who in all probability wanted to glorify the passage. I still would not consider it very Glorious. If his mother expected him to not be alive , and the people who knew him well didn’t recognize him, And I don’t see him coming in glory with his angels. The so called angels were not with Him. Even when it was written that Jesus came through a wall to the Apostles, Thomas had to put his finger in the wounds to prove it was Jesus, speaks to no glorious coming back! ---
**Author:** ![TonySinclair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@TonySinclair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TonySinclair)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2013, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473/300 "2013-08-09T13:51:36Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > There were two glowing angels inside the tomb that told the women that Jesus wasn’t there anymore, if you want to get all literalistic (Luke 24) ;). > > > [@](#): > > > > On the first day of the week, very early in the morning, the women took the spices they had prepared and went to the tomb. 2 They found the stone rolled away from the tomb, 3 but when they entered, they did not find the body of the Lord Jesus. 4 While they were wondering about this, suddenly two men in clothes that gleamed like lightning stood beside them. 5 In their fright the women bowed down with their faces to the ground, but the men said to them, "Why do you look for the living among the dead? 6 He is not here; he has risen! Remember how he told you, while he was still with you in Galilee: 7 'The Son of Man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, be crucified and on the third day be raised again. > > And I’d counter the lack of “glory” by looking at art regarding the resurrection, which tends to make Jesus look pretty glorious. So it isn’t just me who thinks the resurrection of a dead man is pretty glorious :). That’s called artistic license. And IMO the passage you quoted proves that you’re wrong. It clearly shows that “glorious” people are so awesome that people immediately bow down to them. They don’t mistake them for the gardener, or walk with them for a long time without noticing anything out of the ordinary. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bible-verses-2-kings-2-23-24-numbers-5-11-31/664473.md?page=16)