# Biblically sophisticated Christians: how many are there in the US? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 27, 2010, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/biblically-sophisticated-christians-how-many-are-there-in-the-us/537564 "2010-04-27T21:19:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/biblically-sophisticated-christians-how-many-are-there-in-the-us/537564/61 "2010-04-30T23:28:00Z")
**Skammer** I have to run as a baseball game awaits me. Before I go… Are you an atheist? (sorry, I don’t have time to research this) ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/biblically-sophisticated-christians-how-many-are-there-in-the-us/537564/62 "2010-05-01T00:02:00Z")
> [@Hold\_Fast](#): > > Well, while this is no doubt true, I can’t tell you how many people I know who know next to nothing about Atheism, the belief they profess to have. I admit curiousity - what’s there to know about atheism? Lack of belief is…lack of belief. The number of rituals involved are surprisingly low (mostly sleeping in on sunday), and while there’s a fair amount of extant literature in which atheism-compatible ideas appear, there is no actual holy writ, so that’s another source of complexity lacking. So seriously, what don’t I know? ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/biblically-sophisticated-christians-how-many-are-there-in-the-us/537564/63 "2010-05-01T01:22:51Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > **monavis** , you’re an example of what I was talking about before. You’re greatly oversimplifying and I don’t think you really have a deep enough understanding of what you’re talking about. Obviously we can’t prove it. What are you calling “a fact”? The part about humans writing it? Sure. Is it a fact that they weren’t divinely inspired? There’s no way to prove that either way. Okay, let’s go with that. Moses is mythological and there are contradictions in the Bible. So what? What exactly does that invalidate? What Psalm are you talking about? I don’t recall one that says humans are God. Please cite where Jesus said that. Most Christians don’t consider translations to be inspired; only the original manuscripts. There are small fringe groups who consier the KJV to be the “inspired” English translation, but they’re… small and fringe. I don’t know that. Maybe they were/are inspired, in whole or in part. It sound like you are the one who needs to read up on the Council of Nicea. First, the Catholic/Orthodox split hadn’t occurred yet. Second, most of the NT texts were considered “inspired” long before that council met – what the Council did was agree on which texts would be included in the canonical New Testament. They also agreed on a shared creed (the Nicene Creed) as a response to common heresies that were floating about. What do you find so insidious about this council? Why should he have to? You said you had proof (of what, I’m not sure) but you haven’t demonstrated it here. I will try to make this simple for you. People said God inspired what was written, that we can prove. There is no way one can truthful say God inspired anything. This is just belief in what a human said. Now, I suggest that you read Psalm 82 in KJV or in a Catholic version read psalm 81, Jesus backed this up according to John chapter 10 verse 34." Is it not written in your law,“I said you are gods”? John 20 verse 27 talks about Jesus having a human body after He was supposed to have ressurected. There are no original writings from any of the Bible writers, and untill about 1,000 The Catholic and Orthodox were united they had a difference in the Trinity and separated at that time. Constantine was responsible for having the Bishops meet to decide on how to unite Christianity because it was very divided. Then those people decided what was inspired and what wasn’t and tossed aside what they didn’t think was inspired, or the word of God. It may not be what you would like it to be, but that is what happened. As to how do you know if the Bible is inspired by God, how do you know if Muhammed was not inspired and was said to have an angel dictate the Koran to him.? It is a matter of what one or who one wants to believe. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/biblically-sophisticated-christians-how-many-are-there-in-the-us/537564/64 "2010-05-01T04:29:06Z")
> [@raindog](#): > > **Skammer** Are you an atheist? (sorry, I don’t have time to research this) No. > [@monavis](#): > > I will try to make this simple for you. People said God inspired what was written, that we can prove. There is no way one can truthful say God inspired anything. This is just belief in what a human said. If you’re saying we can’t prove that God inspired the Bible, I don’t disagree. > [@](#): > > Now, I suggest that you read Psalm 82 in KJV or in a Catholic version read psalm 81, Jesus backed this up according to John chapter 10 verse 34." Is it not written in your law,“I said you are gods”? Okay, but what is your point about those verses? > [@](#): > > John 20 verse 27 talks about Jesus having a human body after He was supposed to have ressurected. Yes, he had a resurrected body. Again, I’m missing your point. > [@](#): > > There are no original writings from any of the Bible writers, and untill about 1,000 The Catholic and Orthodox were united they had a difference in the Trinity and separated at that time. Constantine was responsible for having the Bishops meet to decide on how to unite Christianity because it was very divided. Then those people decided what was inspired and what wasn’t and tossed aside what they didn’t think was inspired, or the word of God. It may not be what you would like it to be, but that is what happened. As to how do you know if the Bible is inspired by God, how do you know if Muhammed was not inspired and was said to have an angel dictate the Koran to him.? It is a matter of what one or who one wants to believe. Yes, I know the history of the church councils; why would you think I have a problem with the way the biblical canon was decided? Other than a conference of all the bishops in Christendom coming together, how would you have decided which books belonged in the Bible? And I already said I don’t know if Mohammed was inspired or not. I suspect not, at least in the particulars that contradict Christianity, but I don’t _know_ and I’m not claiming otherwise. I get the feeling you’re saying ‘Gotcha!’ but I don’t think I understand what your point it. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/biblically-sophisticated-christians-how-many-are-there-in-the-us/537564/65 "2010-05-01T12:33:07Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > No. > > If you’re saying we can’t prove that God inspired the Bible, I don’t disagree. Okay, but what is your point about those verses? Yes, he had a resurrected body. Again, I’m missing your point. > > Yes, I know the history of the church councils; why would you think I have a problem with the way the biblical canon was decided? Other than a conference of all the bishops in Christendom coming together, how would you have decided which books belonged in the Bible? And I already said I don’t know if Mohammed was inspired or not. I suspect not, at least in the particulars that contradict Christianity, but I don’t _know_ and I’m not claiming otherwise. > > I get the feeling you’re saying ‘Gotcha!’ but I don’t think I understand what your point it. My point was you asked me when Jesus said we were gods, and what Psalm it was. Even if the writers of the gospels were saying God inspired the writers we are taking their word for it, not any God’s word. I do not care about gotcha games I just like things to be truths that can be proven and not go by what some one said or wrote. I do not believe God spoke to anyone, or had anyone speak for Him. If Moses was a historically proven person( or not) it is still the writings of some human. Some need, or want to believe, and if it helps them fine, but that doesn’t mean everyone else has to believe what they do, nor should laws be made to favor their beliefs. People like to make up things and also say things that aren’t true, to try to get people to believe what they do. Some do it now and I am sure some may have done it thousands of years ago. There are things in the Bible that are not true so I do not accept that any god would inspire such things. Just like you suspect Muhammad wasn’t inspired(I do not either) but I don’t think any one was inspired by a God to write the Bible any more than Aesops fables or Hans Christian Anderson, or any of today’s writers. There are some good ideas in most writings and some that could be diregarded. You believe in Christianity and that is your right,but believing doesn’t make anything so; everyone in my opinion has a right to their own beliefs and if they use their beliefs for good so be it, no matter if it is in the Buddah , Muhammed, Jesus, or Ron Howard just so they do not use it to force others to do so or harm them. Belief is a personal thing and should be kept that way. If others agree with them that is okay as well. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2010, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/biblically-sophisticated-christians-how-many-are-there-in-the-us/537564/66 "2010-05-01T12:35:57Z")
> [@monavis](#): > > My point was you asked me when Jesus said we were gods, and what Psalm it was. Even if the writers of the gospels were saying God inspired the writers we are taking their word for it, not any God’s word. I do not care about gotcha games I just like things to be truths that can be proven and not go by what some one said or wrote. I do not believe God spoke to anyone, or had anyone speak for Him. > > If Moses was a historically proven person( or not) it is still the writings of some human. Some need, or want to believe, and if it helps them fine, but that doesn’t mean everyone else has to believe what they do, nor should laws be made to favor their beliefs. People like to make up things and also say things that aren’t true, to try to get people to believe what they do. Some do it now and I am sure some may have done it thousands of years ago. There are things in the Bible that are not true so I do not accept that any god would inspire such things. > > Just like you suspect Muhammad wasn’t inspired(I do not either) but I don’t think any one was inspired by a God to write the Bible any more than Aesops fables or Hans Christian Anderson, or any of today’s writers. There are some good ideas in most writings and some that could be diregarded. You believe in Christianity and that is your right,but believing doesn’t make anything so; everyone in my opinion has a right to their own beliefs and if they use their beliefs for good so be it, no matter if it is in the Buddah , Muhammed, Jesus, or Ron Howard just so they do not use it to force others to do so or harm them. Belief is a personal thing and should be kept that way. If others agree with them that is okay as well. As a post script; I wouldn’t try to decide what writings were in the Bible, nor would I decide that God inspired some things and not others. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/biblically-sophisticated-christians-how-many-are-there-in-the-us/537564.md?page=3)