# Biden's choice for vice presidential candidate **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 10, 2020, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505 "2020-04-10T15:04:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 56
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2020, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1103 "2020-08-16T19:13:01Z")
Michelle ran some programs while her husband was President, and her main qualification was the fact that she’d sweep Joe to a massive landslide. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2020, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1104 "2020-08-16T19:15:40Z")
She had hard, tough, primary fights. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2020, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1105 "2020-08-16T19:18:18Z")
I’m assuming that when she wins in November, giving her an unbroken streak of wins, you won’t count that either since the VP pick doesn’t change the result. If she wins, you discount it; if she loses, you blame her. Good to know. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lantern2/32/3010_2.png) [@Lantern2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern2)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2020, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1106 "2020-08-16T19:22:16Z")
I should have written “loses winnable Presidential elections”. Obviously careerists win a lot of elections almost by definition. However they often struggle at the final hurdle against less experienced opponents as exemplified by Hillary, Romney, Kerry and Gore. (and counting total high-level political experience). Harris strikes me as very much being in that mould. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lantern2/32/3010_2.png) [@Lantern2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern2)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2020, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1107 "2020-08-16T19:23:21Z")
And obviously I am thinking of the top of the ticket. As I said earlier I think she is a good choice for VP candidate. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2020, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1108 "2020-08-16T20:05:52Z")
I heard on CNN that one reason, probably not the only one, for passing on Duckworth was to avoid being derailed into questions of citizenship since she was born in Bangkok. Ironic that we’ve entered that territory now, especially since unlike with Obama, the Republikans freely admit Harris was born in the US. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2020, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1109 "2020-08-16T22:47:01Z")
> [@Lantern2](#): > > Obviously careerists win a lot of elections almost by definition. However they often struggle at the final hurdle against less experienced opponents as exemplified by Hillary, Romney, Kerry and Gore. (and counting total high-level political experience). Seems to me like you’re adding qualifiers to make your statement be true. As if the others’ opponents weren’t careerist politicians (except for Hillary’s). ---
**Author:** ![Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulf_the_Unwashed)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2020, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1110 "2020-08-16T23:38:03Z")
Romney and Kerry were running against incumbent presidents. Hard for me to argue that Obama at that point was “less experienced” than Romney (or Bush than Kerry). ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1111 "2020-08-17T04:23:42Z")
As I’ve written on the Dope before, Michelle Obama made it very, _very_ clear in her memoir _Becoming_ that she has absolutely no interest - zero, zilch, nada, no way Jose - in ever running for elective office. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lantern2/32/3010_2.png) [@Lantern2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern2)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1112 "2020-08-17T05:11:03Z")
Agreed for Romney versus Obama. Much of Romney’s careerism was in the private sector. Kerry had a longer high-level political career than Bush even in 2004. In any event the experience point was secondary. I am thinking more about a personality type: the kind of person who would be happy and successful methodically moving up the ladder in a large organization. I think Gore, Kerry, Romney and Hillary are all examples of that type compared to their respective opponents. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1113 "2020-08-17T12:30:41Z")
> [@Lantern2](#): > > Obviously careerists win a lot of elections almost by definition. However they often struggle at the final hurdle against less experienced opponents as exemplified by Hillary, Romney, Kerry and Gore. > [@Lantern2](#): > > I am thinking more about a personality type: the kind of person who would be happy and successful methodically moving up the ladder in a large organization. I think Gore, Kerry, Romney and Hillary are all examples of that type compared to their respective opponents. Your definition of “careerist” is post-hoc poppycock. There is nothing about any of these people that makes them less “careerist” than any of their opponents, with the probable exception of Hillary Clinton compared to Donald Trump, who really was something of an outlier in terms of presidential candidates. And the only reason Trump never had to move methodically up the ladder is that he was placed at the top of the ladder by his father. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lantern2/32/3010_2.png) [@Lantern2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern2)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1114 "2020-08-17T13:51:17Z")
It’s not post-hoc. If you go back and read profiles of Gore,Kerry, Romney and Hillary before their election results you would absolutely find common elements in the description like stiff, unlikable and overly calculating. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1115 "2020-08-17T13:54:05Z")
If the alternative to “overly calculating” is “shoot from the hip”, I prefer overly calculating given the importance of the issues being considered. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lantern2/32/3010_2.png) [@Lantern2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern2)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1116 "2020-08-17T14:13:11Z")
Actually it’s not so much about being calculating as seeming calculating. Voters are put off by politicians who are transparently ambitious.The successful ones create a persona and story which voters find appealing and which cloak their ambition. I think this is most true at the Presidential level simply because there is vastly more scrutiny. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1117 "2020-08-17T14:20:53Z")
So people want someone who can appear nonchalant and unambitious while at the same time thinking they are the right person for the job, even if the job is leader of the free world and POTUS? One of the regular questions in job interviews is “where do you see yourself in five years?” and showing ambition in the answer is considered a _good_ thing. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lantern2/32/3010_2.png) [@Lantern2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern2)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1118 "2020-08-17T14:37:26Z")
Well obviously running for President isn’t like a regular job interview. I think what voters want is a leader with an inspiring vision for the country rather than a politician who is slavering to reach the last rung of the political ladder. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1119 "2020-08-17T14:37:40Z")
Or, you could have someone who IS ambitious and hardworking AND pays some dues in the minors before hitting the Big Show, AND comes across as affable and chill. See: Reagan, Clinton, Obama. None of them “came out of nowhere” and all of them had, in fact, political careers – and it still is a political career if you run and lose a few times (in Reagan’s case, a second career). Mondale and Gore et al just _were_ “stiffs” by personality. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lantern2/32/3010_2.png) [@Lantern2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern2)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1120 "2020-08-17T15:02:27Z")
Well yeah I am not arguing for a Democratic Trump with zero political experience and that’s probably not what voters usually want either. And what’s important is less the length of the resume than whether that resume defines the candidate. Biden is an interesting case of a politician with an absurdly long career but who has also created a persona that voters relate to. Part of it is the personal tragedies that he has faced and part of it is an affable regular-guy persona which is at least somewhat genuine. He is obviously ambitious but I don’t think he is perceived by voters as such. I also think that 2020 may be an unusual year where voters might actually prefer an experienced pro but that may not be true next time. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1121 "2020-08-17T15:27:04Z")
> [@Lantern2](#): > > Well obviously running for President isn’t like a regular job interview. > > I think what voters want is a leader with an inspiring vision for the country rather than a politician who is slavering to reach the last rung of the political ladder. Too bad it’s not like a regular job interview; surely the 2016 election would have ended very differently. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bidens-choice-for-vice-presidential-candidate/851505/1122 "2020-08-17T15:37:17Z")
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