# "Big Brother" Auto Dealership **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 24, 2021, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713 "2021-04-24T21:04:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![a6ka97](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c2a13f/32.png) [@a6ka97](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/a6ka97)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2021, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/1 "2021-04-24T21:04:21Z")
Bought a new vehicle in 2019. Have had it serviced at the selling dealer, last time several months ago at 11,123 miles. Mostly in town driving so miles are below normal. I was very surprised when I got an email from the dealership asking if I would like to trade for a new vehicle as used vehicles are in high demand. My estimated mileage they listed for my vehicle was 12,597, notice- not an even number like 12,600 or even 13,000 miles. Scary part is my vehicle’s mileage was 12,602 miles. Coincidence? Or are they “watching me” and they know what my exact mileage is at any given time? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2021, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/2 "2021-04-24T21:17:31Z")
Did you get any kind of security/theft tracking system? Example: > **[InTouch GPS Powered Car Inventory Management | PassTime GPS](https://passtimegps.com/solutions/intouch/)** > > Designed for franchise auto and powersports dealers, InTouch combines GPS-powered inventory management, vehicle protection and theft recovery with push notification capabilities for maintenance and customer retention. > Easily locate any parked vehicle on- or off-lot > GPS geofencing with automated alerts > **Send customers maintenance and recall alerts** > Device resale for additional profits ---
**Author:** ![TheCuse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thecuse/32/2854_2.png) [@TheCuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheCuse)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2021, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/3 "2021-04-24T21:28:31Z")
I know my 2019 Jeep Cherokee has a service through Mopar and once a month the onboard diagnostics get emailed to me (tire pressure, mileage, gas mileage, how much gas is left, ABS system, etc. I think like 20 things. I wonder if my dealer can get the same information from them? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2021, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/4 "2021-04-24T21:32:16Z")
Many of these makes are collecting data on your car: > **[Who Owns the Data Your Car Collects?](https://www.consumerreports.org/automotive-technology/who-owns-the-data-your-car-collects/)** > > Who owns the data your car collects, and how should it be used? Consumer Reports says today’s high-tech vehicles are wireless data collectors on wheels. > Some of the data from these sensors never leaves the car, but increasingly, a lot of it does. Manufacturers such as BMW, General Motors, Nissan, Tesla, and Toyota are selling vehicles with data connections that allow them to gather a detailed portrait of both car and driver. > “Cars are generating so much data, and all of it is incredibly valuable,” says Joseph Jerome, policy counsel for the Center for Democracy & Technology. “Carmakers are champing at the bit to find ways to monetize it.” > And there’s potentially plenty of money to be made: A 2016 white paper from industry research and consulting firm McKinsey projects a $450 billion to $750 billion industry for automotive data by 2030. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2021, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/5 "2021-04-24T21:42:01Z")
Is there any info about government access to this information? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2021, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/6 "2021-04-24T22:07:06Z")
Good question. If you go to [document page 23; **[PDF](https://www.gao.gov/assets/gao-17-656.pdf)** page 28, you’ll see that a group of privacy experts echo this concern, in a section titled > Selected Experts Had Concerns about Connected Vehicle Data Privacy and Automakers’ Privacy Efforts I wonder if any of this data has yet been subpoenaed. Hmm. Maybe … maybe: > **[These Companies Track Millions Of Cars—Immigration And Border Police Have...](https://www.forbes.com/sites/thomasbrewster/2021/04/01/these-companies-track-millions-of-cars-immigration-and-border-police-have-been-grabbing-their-data/?sh=6bba811650c5)** > > Federal agencies have been able to tap data from General Motors OnStar, as well as fleet-tracking companies Geotab and Spireon. [NB: not an exact parallel, but maybe an indicator as to what information is collected, what might be shared, and under what circumstances.] ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2021, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/7 "2021-04-24T23:04:13Z")
My Subaru dealer had my exact mileage (well as when I left home to drive to the dealership) when I took it in for service. I do not subscribe to their Starlink service, but apparently when I plug my phone in and turn on CarPlay (IOS app) it transmits not just my mileage but a boatload of other info to the dealer. For example they know how much gas I have added to the car since I bought it! It’s a 2019. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2021, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/8 "2021-04-24T23:35:00Z")
There is no cause for alarm! Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!! And don’t worry, your smart TV and your smart phone have both been doing the same thing for years. ---
**Author:** ![lobotomyboy63](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobotomyboy63/32/2900_2.png) [@lobotomyboy63](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lobotomyboy63)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2021, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/9 "2021-04-24T23:54:56Z")
Not sure if it overlaps with some of the other devices, but I’d heard they were installing black boxes in random cars. IIRC there was a street racing accident where lo and behold, they were able to prove the teens weren’t driving prudently despite their stories. That was awhile ago; these days, there’s probably a black box in your car. > **[How a black box can tell the full story behind a car crash - and how to know...](https://www.wral.com/how-a-black-box-can-tell-the-full-story-behind-a-car-crash-and-how-to-know-if-your-car-has-one/19045889/)** > > Black boxes are located in most newer vehicles and store data on anything from speeds to braking to impacts. In the case of a car crash, a black box can provide much-needed data that can help determine the full story -- and where fault should be... I was watching a youtube video of a guy who got rubbed on the interstate by a guy who cut him off. They pulled over but apparently the offender changed his mind and took off. He chased him down etc. and showed the video to the cops. But his dashcam also recorded _his_ speed, which got up over 100 mph. Wasn’t he handing them proof that _he_ broke the law as well? With a dash cam, at least you _chose_ to get one for data collection. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2021, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/10 "2021-04-25T08:37:11Z")
A friend of mine, who owns a Tesla, recently had her windshield caved in by a flying chunk of metal. She asked Tesla if they could provide all the data logs they had, and they sent her CSV files for hours of driving logs. It included obvious stuff like speed and position, as well as less obvious things like accelerator position, steering wheel angle, whether a passenger was present, the position of the driver/passenger seats, and so on. Dozens, maybe hundreds of telemetry values. Not really a shock to me; actually it was more of a shock that they released the data to her without any particular pushback. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2021, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/11 "2021-04-27T07:11:47Z")
Your car is watching you! Article in Washington Post by Geoffrey A. Fowler, Technology Columnist, Dec. 17, 2019: [What does your car know about you? We hacked a Chevy to find out.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/12/17/what-does-your-car-know-about-you-we-hacked-chevy-find-out/) > [@](#): > > Behind the wheel, it’s nothing but you, the open road — and your car quietly recording your every move. > > On a recent drive, a 2017 Chevrolet collected my precise location. It stored my phone’s ID and the people I called. It judged my acceleration and braking style, beaming back reports to its maker General Motors over an always-on Internet connection. > > Cars have become the most sophisticated computers many of us own, filled with hundreds of sensors. Even older models know an awful lot about you. Many copy over personal data as soon as you plug in a smartphone. > > But for the thousands you spend to buy a car, the data it produces doesn’t belong to you. My Chevy’s dashboard didn’t say what the car was recording. It wasn’t in the owner’s manual. There was no way to download it. > > To glimpse my car data, I had to hack my way in. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2021, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/12 "2021-04-27T07:23:00Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > And don’t worry, your smart TV and your smart phone have both been doing the same thing for years. This too. WaPo Tech Columnist Geoffrey A. Fowler is onto this too, Sept. 18, 2019: [You watch TV. Your TV watches back.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/09/18/you-watch-tv-your-tv-watches-back/) > [@](#): > > Wrapped in a Snuggie, I like to binge on reruns of “The Golden Girls” all by myself. Except I’m not really alone. > > Once every few minutes, my TV beams out a report about what’s on my screen to Samsung, the company that made it. Chances are, your TV is watching you, too, through a few nosy pixels on the screen. > > Ever wondered why TV sets are getting so cheap? Manufacturing efficiency plays a role. But to paraphrase political commentator James Carville, it’s the data, stupid. TVs have joined the ranks of websites, apps and credit cards in the lucrative business of harvesting and sharing your information. Americans spend an average of 3½ hours in front of a TV each day, according to eMarketer, the market research company. Your TV records may not contain sensitive search queries or financial data, but that history is a window to your interests, personality, joys and embarrassments. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2021, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/13 "2021-04-27T10:23:18Z")
The OP’s scenario could also just be the result of mileage being recorded in the dealer’s system at each service, with the 12,597 number being simply an extrapolated estimate of current mileage, presented without any rounding from the system. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2021, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/big-brother-auto-dealership/940713/14 "2021-05-02T01:02:56Z")
So how much is Big Surveillance paying you? 🙂