Oh, bullshit. One doesn’t “sellout” by accident, it usually happens because one “sets out to do it”. I don’t know dick about her new album, but quit feeding me a bunch of crap about how people who didn’t like Liz Phair’s change of direction are idiots. I don’t give a rip what she said in some interview you read somewhere, a lot of people obviously think she’s full of shit. That doesn’t make them idiots, only cynical. There’s nothing plain and simple about it, it just seems to me you can’t handle a different perspective.
And my point was in support of your premise in the case of Ron Silver. He hasn’t sold out, he’s lost his freaking mind. And that? Is something totally different.
Oh please. This is exactly why the argument is stupid. You can’t go around worshipping some artist and believing that every word they say is gospel and then claim “Sellout!” and “Liar!” when they say something you disagree with or put out an album you don’t like.
No, YOU don’t like him when he’s angry.
That’s your opinion, anyway.
Thanks!
Billy Corgan recently testified before Congress in support of Ticketmaster/LiveNation merger.
As one poster a while back said, “Just go away already”
Bob Dylan was accused of selling out for going electric in 1965.
That was the last time in American culture the words “selling out” could be taken seriously.
Dylan rejected the charge. Rock rejected the charge. The world rejected the charge.
That was the end of selling out.
Good thing, too.
I haven’t read through the entire thread (been away a while) but the first thing that came to mind after reading the OP was hearing Bob Dylan’s “Forever Young” in an ad for Pepsi the other day. I have (had) some special personal associations with that song and they had nothing to do with Pepsi.
Yes, that would be a good example of not selling out. REM has always been about the art. Music is the medium they chose to express themselves. They make music for the sake of expression, to challenge thought, to cause an emotional response…allow the audience to react. Making money for the sole purpose of making money is not necessarily selling out. Music, or any art form, that is produced for the sole purpose of making money is a commercial enterprise, a product manufactured with intent of making a profit. It is the same as Microsoft making Vistas or Pepsi making cola or Gap making clothes. Commercial art is still art, it just has a different intent behind it. Somebody who designs Logos is an artist but the art he/she makes is different in content and intent than someone like Picasso or Rembrant or Dali. Someone who write jingles for products is different from the Rolling Stones or Tool or Nick Drake. An artist who sells out is one who changes intent. The artist goes from making art for the sake of personal expression to making art for the sake of making money. Justin Timberlake, Britney Spears, Madonna, etc have always made a product meant to sell. It was music produced for the masses. The music isn’t necessarily bad, just unappealing to the more discerning listener. I don’t like the music they produce because it sounds cheap and seems to have no other redeeming quality other than “It has a good beat and you can dance to it”. Muscians like Tool or REM make music to promote an idea, a thought, a feeling, a philosophy all designed to elicit an emotional or intellectual response. If they decided to allow their music to be used in a commercial it wouldn’t necessarily be a sell out because the music itself hasn’t changed, they just decided to make a buck on it. Jane’s Addiction sold out with Strays, they used to make cutting edge, make-you-think, interesting music that not only me want to move but also made me think and feel. Strays was radio friendly hard rock that sounded nothing like anything else they had released. Then Perry formed Satellite Party, which sounded just like the Strays album. It just happened to suck because it sounded self-indulgent and schmaltzy. It was a weak album. Perry has lost touch with his roots and inspiration. He used to be great, now he is mediocre. Every artist has a slump, I hope his ends soon. I look forward to his next release.
Michelangelo. He wanted to do sculpture. He was great at sculpture. A little arm-twisting by the pope and suddenly he’s painting the guy’s ceiling. For, like, four years. WTF?
Still not a sell out scenario. He was commissioned to do a job. It was still his work in his style. Kind of like Trent Reznor doing the score for a movie or video game. The one who commissioned the work wanted what the artist was able to produce. There was no compromise on artistic integrity. Sometimes an artist will do work to pay the bills and to further their own ability to produce the kind of work they want, which is on the slippery slope of selling out but I don’t fault anyone for wanting eat. A starving artist produces no art because he/she can’t afford the supplies to produce, let alone, eat. A “starving artist” who turns down a paying commission just to stick to the principle that he/she won’t “sell out” is a retard who deserves to only be famouse after his/her death, which won’t take long when not eating, or living in a stable home, or practicing basic hygiene, etc. I suppose it comes down to compromising integrity for the sole sake of profit versus personal satisfaction (art for art’s sake).
Ice T, rapper of the ‘Cop killer’ song who went on to play a detective in Law and Order.
Ice Cube, gangsta rapper and star of movies such as “Are we there yet?” and “All about the Benjamins”.
I think Ozzy Osbourne needs a mention too.
I suppose one might argue they were all just diversifying their talents… :dubious:
I genuinely think that his opinions evolved. If anything, it shows that he reached his views after some consideration. You don’t agree with them but that’s hardly selling out.
Quoted for truth. Whatever Silver may have been to you, he wasn’t a “sell out”.