# Bill Clinton threatens to sue restaurant for showing picture of Chelsea **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 26, 2007, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584 "2007-09-26T19:05:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/21 "2007-09-26T21:57:26Z")
Shouldn’t this be in the Pit with a title like" I know Bill Clinton has been out of office for like 7 friken years, but I still think he is a stupid poo poo head"? ---
**Author:** ![Mikemike2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikemike2/32/305_2.png) [@Mikemike2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mikemike2)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/22 "2007-09-26T22:07:56Z")
[QUOTE=Arnold Winkelried] Shouldn’t the signature at the end of the letter say “Counselor to _former_ President Clinton”? [/QUOTE] I have often heard of former presidents being addressed simply as president so and so. When Jimmy Carter was on the news recently with his new book they referred to him as “President Jimmy Carter”. Maybe it is some sort of honorific? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/23 "2007-09-26T22:10:21Z")
[QUOTE=Arnold Winkelried] Shouldn’t the signature at the end of the letter say “Counselor to _former_ President Clinton”? [/QUOTE] Don’t they get to be called “President” even after they are out of office? I think the standard is you call them whatever they last were. If he were to become the UN ambassador, he’d be Ambassador Clinton from now on. ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/24 "2007-09-26T22:13:40Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Don’t they get to be called “President” even after they are out of office? I think the standard is you call them whatever they last were. If he were to become the UN ambassador, he’d be Ambassador Clinton from now on. [/QUOTE] I thought for both the millitary and the civil service they are referred to as whatever the highest title or rank they ever held. I think that holds true for retirement pay as well. ETA this only applies when they no longer hold active rank or title so if he was appointed Abassador then I guess he would be called that. But after he left that office he would revert back to “Mr. President” ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/25 "2007-09-26T22:15:27Z")
[QUOTE=askeptic] I thought for both the millitary and the civil service they are referred to as whatever the highest title or rank they ever held. I think that holds true for retirement pay as well. [/QUOTE] Could be. What if one were a Representative and a Senator. Surely one wouldn’t presume that “Senator” is a higher rank, would one? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/26 "2007-09-26T22:18:30Z")
According to [this site](http://englishplus.com/news/news1200.htm), he would still be referred to as President Clinton. > [@](#): > > How do we address someone who held an office but is no longer in that office? > > \ > > Usually out of respect, we would still refer to them the same way. While we might refer to a retired Senator Smith as former Senator Smith or ex-Senator Smith, that would not be appropriate as an address - whether a direct personal address or address on a letter. It is perfectly acceptable and appropriate to continue to address him as “Senator Smith” or write him in care of “Senator John Smith.” The term Honorable is usually reserved for those still in office. ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/27 "2007-09-26T22:21:48Z")
Well, the ex-prez is after all still a lawyer. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/28 "2007-09-26T22:22:21Z")
[QUOTE=silenus] If I were the owner, I’d have my lawyer send a letter back telling Bill to stick it. Let him sue. See what \*\*that \*\* does to Hillary’s public opinion numbers. [/QUOTE] Yeah, but telling off Bill Clinton in New York? That does nothing for the restaurant. ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/29 "2007-09-26T22:26:10Z")
[QUOTE=Linked Article] The term Honorable is usually reserved for those still in office. [/QUOTE] I think that probably depends on the person in office. ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/30 "2007-09-26T22:39:07Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Could be. What if one were a Representative and a Senator. Surely one wouldn’t presume that “Senator” is a higher rank, would one? 😉 [/QUOTE] Sure. Why not? 1/100 vs 1/435. Higher pay, bigger budget, longer term in office, less direct contact with constituents. So all together the houses are equal but individually I see nothing wrong with saying a Senator outranks a Representative. The Army seems to agree. > [@WestPoint Protocol List](#): > > 42 UNITED STATES SENATORS (BY SENIORITY; WHEN EQUAL, BY ALPHA) > 43 FORMER UNITED STATES SENATORS (BY DATE OF RETIREMENT) > 44 GOVERNORS WHEN NOT IN OWN STATE (BY STATE DATE OF ENTRY; WHEN EQUAL, BY ALPHA) (SEE #4) > 45 ACTING HEADS OF CABINET LEVEL DEPARTMENTS > 46 FORMER VICE PRESIDENTS OF THE UNITED STATES > 47 UNITED STATES HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES (BY SENIORITY; WHEN EQUAL, BY ALPHA) from [here](http://www.usma.edu/Protocol/images/DA_precedence.pdf) warning PDF ---
**Author:** ![zamboniracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zamboniracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zamboniracer)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2007, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/31 "2007-09-26T23:50:22Z")
[QUOTE=ouryL] Well, the ex-prez is after all still a lawyer. 😃 [/QUOTE] But he’s not licensed to practice at the moment. ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2007, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/32 "2007-09-27T00:05:52Z")
[QUOTE=zamboniracer] But he’s not licensed to practice at the moment. [/QUOTE] Is there some reason he should be? Do you expect he will need to practice to earn a living? Or did you have another point? ---
**Author:** ![papaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b77776/32.png) [@papaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/papaw)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2007, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/33 "2007-09-27T00:16:25Z")
I say BIG WHOOP! Bill just needs more attention in the shadow of Hilary, or maybe his counsel just needed to do something to appear useful. ---
**Author:** ![zamboniracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zamboniracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zamboniracer)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2007, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/34 "2007-09-27T00:24:47Z")
[QUOTE=askeptic] Is there some reason he should be? Do you expect he will need to practice to earn a living? Or did you have another point? [/QUOTE] WTF? We’re talking about his letter re his daughter’s picture. My item was in reply to post 27 to the effect that Bill Clinton is still a lawyer. I replied, correctly, that at the moment he isn’t a lawyer because he doesn’t have a license. He cannot practice law and without a license he cannot send nasty letters on behalf of his adult daughter. Clear enough for you, askeptic? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2007, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/35 "2007-09-27T00:30:00Z")
[QUOTE=silenus] I think it means that the restaurant owner will agree to take down the picture. IANAL, but I don’t think Clinton has a legal leg to stand on. The picture wasn’t coerced, it isn’t being used as advertising, there is no “Chelsea Clinton loves my food!” statement being made. [/QUOTE] I’m not so sure. In my lay opinion, I’d say the picture is being used in a commercial/advertising manner. It’s prominently featured in the restaurant’s front window, presumably to draw business by association. I would say it is using Chelsea’s image to draw customers in the restaurant. I have no idea what the courts think about this, but I certainly wouldn’t display something like that without a release of some sort. ---
**Author:** ![ArizonaTeach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/45deac/32.png) [@ArizonaTeach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArizonaTeach)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2007, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/36 "2007-09-27T02:35:31Z")
**What** makes Chelsea Cinton a public figure? Be cause her **father** used to be President? That makes her fair game? Not asking to be snarky…I’m genuinely curious why she would be denied the rights of a private citizen. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2007, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/37 "2007-09-27T03:06:59Z")
[QUOTE=ArizonaTeach] **What** makes Chelsea Cinton a public figure? Be cause her **father** used to be President? That makes her fair game? Not asking to be snarky…I’m genuinely curious why she would be denied the rights of a private citizen. [/QUOTE] Has she taken any role in her mother’s campaign? If so then she has no more right to privacy than Michelle Obama, Elizabeth Edwards, or Judith Giuliani. ---
**Author:** ![ArizonaTeach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/45deac/32.png) [@ArizonaTeach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArizonaTeach)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2007, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/38 "2007-09-27T04:50:00Z")
[QUOTE=alphaboi867] Has she taken any role in her mother’s campaign? If so then she has no more right to privacy than Michelle Obama, Elizabeth Edwards, or Judith Giuliani. [/QUOTE] Well, to my knowledge she hasn’t, but I can’t say I pay attention. But that begs the question - to what extent? Actively campaigning, sure…but answering the phones or licking envelopes…does that mean she’s relinquishing privacy? ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2007, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/39 "2007-09-27T07:04:25Z")
The letter seems fake to me. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2007, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584/40 "2007-09-27T11:27:58Z")
[QUOTE=Shayna] How do you know (and why do you presume) that she didn’t? [/quote] One would presume that if she had previously requested the photo be taken down, that fact would be mentioned somewhere in the letter. However, I’ll grant you that it is an unclear point, because it does not have to be mentioned in the letter. > [@](#): > > How do you know that? How do I know he’s not her attorney? At the bottom of the letter it is signed Douglas J. Band, Counselor to President Clinton. Chelsea has never been president. If Doug is her lawyer, and the letter is written on her behalf, why doesn’t he describe himself as her lawyer? > [@](#): > > Why does it have to be? If my father was an attorney, and his office had a staff of attorneys, and I wanted to have an attorney write a letter on my behalf, I would certainly have my father’s office’s attorney draft the letter, and they wouldn’t do it on my personal stationery. Somewhere on that letter there should be an indicator that Chelsea herself wants the photo taken down. There is currently nothing in that letter positively stating that Chelsea even knows anything about the request. It’s on her dad’s letterhead, written and signed by her dad’s lawyer, indicating that the photo has “come to our attention” and “we ask that you” take it down. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-clinton-threatens-to-sue-restaurant-for-showing-picture-of-chelsea/420584.md?page=3)